poop - toilet training issues

[TinyTinker]

I have a lo who is 3 in two weeks time, she has been potty trained for a good few months now, but not quite there. She doesn't like drinking, so we have to constantly remind her and get her to drink - she then waits until she puts a pull up on to go for a nap after lunch before she goes to the loo - rarely goes for a wee on the toilet (she's with me from 7.15am to 5pm). She is reluctant to poo and often holds it in, and gets constipated regularly. She is currently soiling her knickers daily (usually in the afternoon). Mum said yesterday that she has said to lo that it is ok for her to poo in her knickers if she has to, rather that than have her hold it in which is worse. Not sure I like the idea of saying it's ok to poop your knickers and make no attempt to get to the loo etc - that's not really being potty trained - or am I wrong and this is preventing worse health issues. she often bleeds when she holds the poop in etc.

what would you do? I feel putting her back in pull ups or nappies would relieve the child's anxiety but would also put her potty progress back a lot and she is due to start at the nursery year at the infants school in September, so needs to be out of nappies.

This child doesn't really respond to rewards, i.e. if you do x you can get a sticker, or drink a full bottle of water and you get juice etc.

[Evie125]

Hi. I have cared for a child with the same problem. Our health visitor told me that this is actually a very common problem so the first thing I did was reassure mum and pass this information on- children can sense if something is becoming an issue for adults and they also get uptight about it. Unfortunately it's a bit of a vicious circle, once a child gets constipated they don't want to go to the toilet in case it hurts but that makes the problem worse. The daily soiling you mentioned is probably because the child gets constipated and fluid builds up behind the blockage as your body tries to sort the problem naturally , this seeps past and soils underwear. It's not going to sort overnight but you could try fruit juice lollies to increase fluid. A new cup or water bottle, drinking through straw ( something you don't usually use that the child might want to try.... ) prune juice. If you think the child needs to use the potty/ toilet reassure them and distract by talking or even reading to get them to sit for a bit- nothing's going to happen if they jump straight up. If the problem persists mum may need to chat to her go. In some cases medication is given to soften the poo so children have to go ( no longer hurts because it's soft) then children get into a more regular routine that continues when medicine stops. I wouldn't personally use rewards in this instance because the child is obviously struggling with the situation I would however make a fuss when she does go and explain it only hurts if it's too big because you try to stop it coming out .

[JCrakers]

Good advice from Evie125. It is quite a common problem, I've had 3 children who wouldn't poo on the toilet/potty and would either just go and hide to do it or wait until a pull up for bed was put on. If they have 1 poo that hurts it can set them back a lot.


She needs to drink more. Could you maybe go shopping to the pound shop or B&M together and pick a 'special cup' that she can choose. Something gimmicky (Princesses/Disney/curly straw/glittery when shaken) This might encourage her to drink more? Talk to mum about fibre stuff from the Dr?
If you usually give water (which I do) then maybe look at something with more fibre in it....juice or something tastier that will encourage her to drink more.

When she has softer poo's then you can start to work on the toilet/potty

[moggy]

Apart from the drinking thing, have you tried:

- allowing her to have a nappy/pullup just for when she needs to poo, but pull-up needs to be kept near the toilet. She goes in, pull-up on, does poo there, empty poo in toilet, flush, wash hands.

- Then progress to the above but ask her to sit on toilet in pull-up to poo. (assuming she is happy to sit on toilet, for wees?) + stickers/rewards.

- Then you can move to putting the pull-up under the loo seat so she can still feel it, lowering it over time.
- Using smaller and smaller pull-ups until they don't fit and she is then a 'big girl' and can try without
- Cutting hole in pull-up which you make bigger over time.

All the above comes from a 'continence-awareness' organisation's leaflet I have on the subject, out of print sadly)

It can take a long time time and takes equal work at home as with you. I have been through it and we got there in the end!

[TinyTinker]

I have read up and understand all about the vicous circle of having a hard/hurty poo then not wanting to go again, so holding it - getting constipated again etc.....she has been to the docs because of the blood etc, and has had laxatives.

She isn't doing loose poop, like when liquid poop goes passed the hard bit etc, she is doing a formed sticky poop in her knickers then stopping herself, but since mum said she 'can poop' in her knickers she is letting more out. I understand that mum said to do this to prevent her holding it in, but she doesn't say anything and it seeps through her tights/trousers etc and it's only when you smell her that you know about it - so I'm finding it not very hygienic for the other children - as she carries on playing after, sitting on things etc. So whereas I know I need to help sort out this issue with her and work with mum - it's difficult in the childcare setting when child has been given permission and told it's okay to poop your knickers.

She doesn't say/or possibly doesn't know in advance enough to put a nappy on just to poop in. My own daughter did this on potty training, would wee happily in potty and toilet but would ask to put a nappy on to poop, then we took it straight off etc.

I was wondering about using 'dry like me' pads to make the transition more hygienic, rather than putting nappies on.

I do have a water only policy in their bottles/cups that they have access to all day, as they get left down or tipped by younger children and my house is fully carpeted and upholstered, so with juice stains it looks pretty grim quite quickly. Most nurseries and pre-schools I know have the same policy and they are only allowed water at school. Parents supply their own bottles/cups so I don't choose or buy them for them. Was thinking that while she is sitting at the table for snack/lunch to give her juice to finish straight away, not leave to sip at throughout the day. guessing will have to give all the others juice at this time too tho. lol

[JCrakers]

Ok so she's not constipated..

I would still encourage her to drink more so she will wee more and I would try what moggy suggested.

Regarding wees, I would just take her to the toilet every 20mins just like you would if you were potty training. Make it a regular thing instead of asking her if she needs to go.

Tell her you are not allowing her to do poos in her pants like she does at home but say you are willing to use a pull up if she feels she needs to. Show her and place it somewhere where she knows where it is.

If and when she progresses with using the pull-up, advance onto keeping the pull up in the toilet and so on.

Just reread your last post and Yes i would go with the pads.

[Kerry30]

My friend once told md her son wouldnt poo on the potty or toilet when she started training him because (amd he told her) he thought his insides were falling out. So who knows what children are thinking!
I had an lo who me and mum quickly realised he didnt like the phrase about being a 'big boy' or anything that referred to him growing up. Stopped using those phrases and think it just took the pressure off abit. As well as some of the things others of you have suggested.

[shortstuff]

I have heard that if you get a child to blow up a balloon (under supervision of course) they cant hold their poo. So maybe try this while on the loo? After a few tries maybe lo will realise it is ok?

[lollipop kid]

I have heard that if you get a child to blow up a balloon (under supervision of course) they cant hold their poo. So maybe try this while on the loo? After a few tries maybe lo will realise it is ok?

I've heard the same thing, but using bubbles. I'm putting some in my loo right now (might even try it on myself!)



L