quick 48hr exclusion question

[jaykay79]

hi, could you let me know what I should do here. mindee came yesterday and at dinner time vomited, big time. rang mum to collect who was none too happy, she arrived and announced after 5 seconds he was clearly not unwell and could she bring him back tomorrow. I said no and said as per the 48 hr rule I could not accept him back until Wednesday dinnertime, she asked for Wednesday morning, I again said no. she has been texting me last night and today telling me how perfectly fine he is nothing wrong with him etc etc. she has now text me again saying that as "it clearly isn't a bug" can she bring him back in the morning instead of the afternoon. I really want to say no. what would you do? she is forever trying to get around my rules regarding sickness and I get the feeling if I give an inch she will take a mile, and the next time he is ill I will then have the bend the rules again? and then the other parents will want the same. if you agree I should say no, is there a nice way I can word it? x

[dawn100]

Don't be bullied. The 48hr rule is there for a reason, point out to mum if you or your family catch it you would have to close and it could inconvenience her for even longer.

[Tulip]

Good advice from dawn above, perhaps print off your sickness policy and hand it to her. Also stick to your guns, she's the pushy type, you're in charge, its your business and you definately don't want the sickness bug. Good luck, let us know how you get on x

[jaykay79]

so I have replied saying that : as a registered childminder, I have to adhere to the policies regarding sickness, and 48 hours is the minimum exclusion period. I have to exclude for vomiting regardless of the cause. during my inspection, my exclusions for any sickness are checked and I am reminded of the importance of preventing the spread of any infectious diseases. I don't want to appear inflexible or unhelpful but I simply have to adhere to the rules when breaking them would pose a risk to the other children here. I sent that over 10 mins ago and my iPhone shows me she has been writing her response ever since, this is not goona be pretty :/ ....

[CookieCutter]

I know it's easier said than done, but you definitely have to stick to your guns. Especially with a pushy parent, otherwise she will walk all over you. I feel your pain, I know it's not easy to stand up to parents. The simple fact of the matter is that lo vomited and you can't be sure it's not contagious. I think she would struggle to find another cm/nursery/school who would take lo within 48 hours of vomiting, but she can dislike it all she wants. It won't get her very far.

[bunyip]

Hi Jaykay

Good for you, for being strong.

Here's a quick cut/paste from my 'repeatables' folder, so apologies to anyone whose already read it.

Really this isn't about my policy, your policy, anyone's policy. It's about the welfare of everyone at your setting and about our legal responsibilities. It's not a CM's rules: it's the rules of the Health Protection Agency and every local Environmental Health Officer in the UK.

Breaking the 48 hour rule can see you being closed down, sued and you might at worst even end up killing a child. You might like to remind your client of this and be clear that you won't tolerate being 'leaned on' as she appears wont to do. Instead of bullying you, she might like to use her powers of persuasion to ask her boss for some time off work to care for that poor child. When she became a parent, she should've realised that her annual leave migth occasionally be used to promote the welfare of that new little person in her life: she doesn't have to spend all four weeks in the Algarve, just as you don't have to agree to destroy your business for the sake of her lack of consideration.

Here's the science bit (cue Jennifer Aniston smiling and flicking her hair back.) Your body contains more bacteria than it does your own body cells (in fact, only about 10% of your body is really ‘yours’.) In the right place these are quite safe and they do a mighty fine job; in the wrong place they can kill. That's why , when god designed your body, she put your bottom a long way from your face. There's some pretty deadly stuff in your lower intestine, just below your belly button there's a whole colony of E-coli just for starters. Partly-digested food and stomach acid isn't too great to have around either. The danger with diarrhoea and/or vomiting is that it can flush a lot of this 'bad' bacteria out of the body and (via contact, proximity or even airborne transmission) into your food chain with very nasty, potentially fatal results. And it can see EHO closing you down faster than you can say "Wishaw family butchers".

Make it clear that your policy isn't just a personal decision: it's a reflection of a legal obligation to keep your clients' children alive. Stay strong. Good luck.

[jaykay79]

I like that thanks deffo a good bit of material in there. I don't get people who disregard rules implemented for their own childrens safety. well we are an hour and a half on and she is still typing her message to me, either it is the longest message in the world or she is constantly editing the bits where she wants to murder me x

[dawn100]

I like that thanks deffo a good bit of material in there. I don't get people who disregard rules implemented for their own childrens safety. well we are an hour and a half on and she is still typing her message to me, either it is the longest message in the world or she is constantly editing the bits where she wants to murder me x

You must share what her response is, if its taking that long to write!

[jaykay79]

I will ! after all this hype she will probably just decide not to reply at all!

[playdayz]

I will ! after all this hype she will probably just decide not to reply at all!

Is the message that long ya still reading it ? Lol

[jaykay79]

yes, she I still typing it lol no not really, she obviously decided against sending anything at all, as I have received nothing and she had stayed away this morning. she did try ringing me but I ignored the call as I was busy at the time, but I know this was only so she could cry at me, this is her favourite weapon and it has gotten her results in the past so she tries it every time now, not falling for it anymore x

[rickysmiths]

I was going to say phone her. I never discuss anything important via FB (not that any of my parents are my friends anyway!) or via text. However if she reacts like that on the phone it sounds as if you have done the right thing.

[jaykay79]

just to go off topic for a min...... he is back now and mum (dad dropped off thank god) mum text to say not to let him overindulge as he has been off his food! (but mum? you have been texting me constantly the last 48 hrs telling me how healthy he is, no symptoms whasoever?!?) anyway, a side issue we have going on, on Monday morning (before the vomiting) mindee came in pants "fully potty trained now" says mum, half an hour later we have a puddle on the floor, changed him into his spare clothes (only one set provided.) an hour later, another puddle on the floor, clean him up and have to put him in my daughters clothes (stuck a pull up on him also) explained to mum that as per my potty training policy, lo cannot come in pants until he has demonstrated the ability to ask to use the potty himself and then go ahead and do so (something along those lines), 2 accidents and it's back in pullups. so this afternoon he has arrived again in pants, one spare change of clothes again and no pull ups (I specifically told her we needed more as we ran out on the Monday morning), luckily my friend had some we could borrow so I have put him straight in a pull up before he pee's all over my carpet again. text mum reminding to bring more pull ups tomorrow. she replies saying she deliberately did not bring them as she wants to discuss it further with me. now my potty training policy is very clear, so I have asked her have I given her a copy of it (I have). she is once again trying to find ways around my policies. would you stand firm on this one also? I explained how for hygiene reasons I could not have him weeing everywhere with other children crawling around, but still she won't send pull ups? x

[shortstuff]

I would stand very firm and even turn her away at the door is she tries it again x

[rickysmiths]

I don't potty train at all. I support an potty trained child to continue and except that there may be an odd accident. Los always continue with nappies for naps as well. I would not accept your situation. I would be advising the parent to take a week off work and really crack it and then I will support but not until then.

If she left the child with inadequate clothes I would be ringing her to collect when the first change of clothes is used and I would be saying I have no more clothes will you bring some now please or I would have given her the child back this morning and told her to go home and get what was needed because you have no spares and he can't get through the day. I would also by a pack of nappies and bill her for them. I refuse to use pull ups. They are horrible and they are not designed to be used as a nappy anyway, it is a night mare changing them because you have to undress the child which can be impossible if you are out. As far as I'm concerned they are an expensive marketing mans dream to make parents spend money needlessly. lol!

[jaykay79]

thing is (according to mum) lo is fully potty trained at home with no accidents whatsoever, yet here he just wee's where ever, when ever. she claims she has read my potty training policy "many times". if that is the case, then I am very confused as to what there is we are supposedly going to discuss in the morning (when she will no doubt turn up with no pull ups and child in pants) here is the important passage from my policy...

"When you believe your child is ready to be potty trained, you are required to start the process at home over a holiday period or at the least, a long weekend. I would require your child to wear either pull ups or at least trainer pants until they can actually ask to use the toilet before they require it and can control their bladder / bowels a few moments beyond that announcement. Normal pants can only be used here on their own once your child has demonstrated full bladder and bowel control and asking for the toilet, we will discuss at the time when necessary. If using pants please supply some nappies / pull ups for outings and sleep times until child is fully trained."

surely that does not leave room for manoeuvre? child has never once asked to used the toilet/potty or made any attempt to use it. so I think I am going to have to stand firm as you say and turn her away at the door if she continues to argue this point and ask her to return with pull ups x

[Blueeyedminder]

I believe you should stick by your policy 100% Potty training is difficult on it's own let alone when you're caring for another 1 or 2 children. If there's an accident you've got to clean that up whilst supervising up to three children? It's just too much! I don't potty train my mindee's. I have one little girl who's potty trained at home as mum allows her to wear nothing but obviously I can't allow that here, so mum is happy enough to bring nappies. If the child asks to use the toilet/potty then great but I do no allow children to come in pants until they are fully potty trained.

[rickysmiths]

thing is (according to mum) lo is fully potty trained at home with no accidents whatsoever, yet here he just wee's where ever, when ever. she claims she has read my potty training policy "many times". if that is the case, then I am very confused as to what there is we are supposedly going to discuss in the morning (when she will no doubt turn up with no pull ups and child in pants) here is the important passage from my policy...

"When you believe your child is ready to be potty trained, you are required to start the process at home over a holiday period or at the least, a long weekend. I would require your child to wear either pull ups or at least trainer pants until they can actually ask to use the toilet before they require it and can control their bladder / bowels a few moments beyond that announcement. Normal pants can only be used here on their own once your child has demonstrated full bladder and bowel control and asking for the toilet, we will discuss at the time when necessary. If using pants please supply some nappies / pull ups for outings and sleep times until child is fully trained."

surely that does not leave room for manoeuvre? child has never once asked to used the toilet/potty or made any attempt to use it. so I think I am going to have to stand firm as you say and turn her away at the door if she continues to argue this point and ask her to return with pull ups x

That is very clear and she must stick to it. It doesn't really matter how the child is at home it is how they are with you that matters and as we all know children do different things at home and with us. However in my long experience it is rare that a child who is really fully trained will revert right back because they are with you so I would strongly suspect he is not trained at home and it is something mum had decided needs to be done.

I would stick to my guns and the letter of my Policy.

[jaykay79]

thanks rickysmiths, I will, tomorrow will be day 4 of all this bull sh1t with her so I've pretty much had enough of it by now x

[smurfette]

thanks rickysmiths, I will, tomorrow will be day 4 of all this bull sh1t with her so I've pretty much had enough of it by now x

Hugs for u sounds like a difficult mum alright! She either needs to provide pull ups or at the very least lots of changes, whether she likes it or not he is having lots of accidents at yours which can't continue. I would say mum is trying to get u to do it like rs says!