Funded 2 year olds

[christine e]

Just wondering how many childminders are currently caring for funded 2 year olds and how many childminders have had enquiries for funded places from Sept?

I currently have one funded 2 year old and that is the only enquiry I have had - we were told that places would be in demand for the funded 2 year olds from Sept but it doesn't seem to be happening.

[FussyElmo]

Just wondering how many childminders are currently caring for funded 2 year olds and how many childminders have had enquiries for funded places from Sept?

I currently have one funded 2 year old and that is the only enquiry I have had - we were told that places would be in demand for the funded 2 year olds from Sept but it doesn't seem to be happening.

I had 1 enquiry and she never bothered to turn up and yet according to my do Im in a cluster where they are short of place

[Mouse]

I am registered to offer funding, but haven't actually had any space to take anyone on. I've had 2 enquiries.

From what I've found out, the local nurseries are full with 2yr olds. A new nursery is just opening up & has already got 2yr olds on it's waiting list. They're pushing everything through to be ready to open in Sept.

I think the problem is, parents don't know that childminders can access it. I know a cm in another part of the country who has a big advert on her front gate. She gets endless enquiries, yet she says the other cms in her area get none unless she passes the names on.

We were told that we were in an area of high demand and that they were crying out for childminders to take the 2yr olds. It does seem though as if the nurseries are getting all the work.

[bunyip]

I have had no enquiries.

I suspect the main reasons for this are:-

1. The LA has set up a weird system of an 'application window' in which parents are supposed to apply between a particular set of dates. I'm sure most CMs will bear me out on this: parents ask for care when they need care. They don't make enquiries because the LA has told them to do so at its own convenience.
   
   
2. The local Children's Centre was referring all applicants to nurseries and the odd pre-school. None were being referred to CMs or, to the best of my knowledge, even being told that the funding could be used by CMs. My local Children's Centre claimed that the local pacey office had told them that CMs' details could not be given out without specific consent, as a confidentiality issue (a bit illogical, as we have our details there online for all to see on the county providers list.) I must stress that I have been unable to verify this claim made by the children's centre. It took me a week of calls to the "2yo entitlement team" at county hall to get this rectified - they eventually promised to send a list of CMs to all children's centres, but could not guarantee it would arrive before the "application window" closed.

Well, there's nothing like a well-organised system that meets parents' needs.

.....................and this is nothing like a well-organised system that meets parents' needs.

[miffy]

I haven't had any enquiries.

I think the "window" for applications was very small and I didn't have any info about it until after the "window" had opened! Surely if a child is entitled they should be able to apply for it when they wish.

I don't think it's been well advertised (if it has been advertised at all) either nationally or locally. Can't make my mind up whether this is because politicians just want to say this is available but don't particularly want anyone to take it up or because they're frightened if everyone takes it up it will a) cost too much and b) there won't be enough places available.

Have no idea if CC has had any enquiries - will ask next time I go and if they have where are they sending them (would not expect CMs to be top of the list)

Miffy xx

[Mouse]

I have had no enquiries.

I suspect the main reasons for this are:-

1. The LA has set up a weird system of an 'application window' in which parents are supposed to apply between a particular set of dates. I'm sure most CMs will bear me out on this: parents ask for care when they need care. They don't make enquiries because the LA has told them to do so at its own convenience.
   
   
2. The local Children's Centre was referring all applicants to nurseries and the odd pre-school. None were being referred to CMs or, to the best of my knowledge, even being told that the funding could be used by CMs. My local Children's Centre claimed that the local pacey office had told them that CMs' details could not be given out without specific consent, as a confidentiality issue (a bit illogical, as we have our details there online for all to see on the county providers list.) I must stress that I have been unable to verify this claim made by the children's centre. It took me a week of calls to the "2yo entitlement team" at county hall to get this rectified - they eventually promised to send a list of CMs to all children's centres, but could not guarantee it would arrive before the "application window" closed.

Well, there's nothing like a well-organised system that meets parents' needs.

.....................and this is nothing like a well-organised system that meets parents' needs.

I disagree with point one slightly. Applying for a funded place is like applying for nursery or school. Parents generally know they have to do it before a certain date and can't leave it until the last minute in Sept. The majority of these funded 2 year olds are not from working families, so parents don't need childcare while they work - it's not a 'need' thing as far as that is concerned, but buying into the idea that if their 2 year old is being offered 15 hours free childcare, they might as well take it! And is 'childcare' even the right work to use? Would we use the world to describe a school nursery, or a playgroup? I don't see anything wrong with having the application window, as long as everyone knows about it!

The second point I agree with completely. I assumed parents didn't even know about the funding, hence the lack of enquiries, but that doesn't seem to be the case. The nurseries are full, but not the cms. Our LA did say that advertising the funding was up to us. I guess nurseries have a bigger budget for that - and bigger signs on their walls!

[christine e]

I have had no enquiries.

I suspect the main reasons for this are:-

1. The LA has set up a weird system of an 'application window' in which parents are supposed to apply between a particular set of dates. I'm sure most CMs will bear me out on this: parents ask for care when they need care. They don't make enquiries because the LA has told them to do so at its own convenience.
   
   
2. The local Children's Centre was referring all applicants to nurseries and the odd pre-school. None were being referred to CMs or, to the best of my knowledge, even being told that the funding could be used by CMs. My local Children's Centre claimed that the local pacey office had told them that CMs' details could not be given out without specific consent, as a confidentiality issue (a bit illogical, as we have our details there online for all to see on the county providers list.) I must stress that I have been unable to verify this claim made by the children's centre. It took me a week of calls to the "2yo entitlement team" at county hall to get this rectified - they eventually promised to send a list of CMs to all children's centres, but could not guarantee it would arrive before the "application window" closed.

Well, there's nothing like a well-organised system that meets parents' needs.

.....................and this is nothing like a well-organised system that meets parents' needs.

Yep application window closed 12th July for parents and providers are asked to submit their estimate form by 31st July although it is my understanding that if childminders send estimate form in late they would just be paid late - think parents can still apply after the 12th July but not sure about this - certainly if I came across a parent who I thought might be eligible I would encourage them to at least give county hall a ring. ~Recently spoke to our pacey team because I was concerned because I have two children starting school in Sept who in theory create two vacancies which I could fill with 2 year olds BUT they are only attending school for mornings for first week or so so their places are not freed up until a couple of weeks in so the 2 year olds would not be able to start straight away (not that I have anyone waiting to start bunyip but I want to be ready if they do lol), anyway had it confirmed that we can take the two year olds on after the start of term as long as we make up the hours any way we can so make the time up in school holidays or an extra hour each day etc

[bunyip]

Christine.

I was told the county would accept late applications for 2yo funding, but:

1. Applications would take "significantly longer" to process.
2. Funding might be "subject to budgetary constraints".

I presume that is LA Newspeak for "don't hold your breath."



Mouse (Hi )

In many ways I share your reservations about my earlier "point 1" and I think your points are very valid. But, without wishing to label or patronise those parents, I suspect they maybe the very people who need a system with more flexibility, and they've been offered one that is excessively rigid.

[christine e]

I disagree with point one slightly. Applying for a funded place is like applying for nursery or school. Parents generally know they have to do it before a certain date and can't leave it until the last minute in Sept. The majority of these funded 2 year olds are not from working families, so parents don't need childcare while they work - it's not a 'need' thing as far as that is concerned, but buying into the idea that if their 2 year old is being offered 15 hours free childcare, they might as well take it! And is 'childcare' even the right work to use? Would we use the world to describe a school nursery, or a playgroup? I don't see anything wrong with having the application window, as long as everyone knows about it!

The second point I agree with completely. I assumed parents didn't even know about the funding, hence the lack of enquiries, but that doesn't seem to be the case. The nurseries are full, but not the cms. Our LA did say that advertising the funding was up to us. I guess nurseries have a bigger budget for that - and bigger signs on their walls!

I have asked pacey if they will produce a poster promoting the reasons why a funded two year old would be better placed with a childminder and they have told me that they will produce one but of course these things take time it doesn't help that our local authority have produced a poster which says 'you may be eligible for a funded 2 year old NURSERY place - needless to say I have complained and a new poster will be produced hopefully before the end of the year

[Mouse]

Mouse (Hi )

In many ways I share your reservations about my earlier "point 1" and I think your points are very valid. But, without wishing to label or patronise those parents, I suspect they maybe the very people who need a system with more flexibility, and they've been offered one that is excessively rigid.

Our LA had to extend the deadline date due to complaints from parents & childcare providers. By the time it was published, parents had approximately 2 weeks to apply!

I do think the LA panicked, thinking they'd either run out of time or money to allocate to all these families, so set the deadline. As it turned out, few applied, so they then panicked that they wouldn't meet their quotas

Similarly, without being patronising or judgmental, once word got round that there was 'FREE' childcare available, there was a mad rush of applications. These parents who would not have otherwise considered a private nursery (due to costs & the fact they didn't actually need childcare), are suddenly all clambering to send their 2 year olds to the 'best' nurseries. Nurseries are signing them all up happily. Let's wait to see what happens next year when these 2 year olds become 3 year olds and the level of funding drops significantly. Will the nurseries be so keen to keep them on?

I still see no problem in setting an application date deadline, assuming parents who know about the funding. But I do agree that that the families who need additional time & support in applying shouldn't be overlooked.

[madredann]

I remember filling forms in for my daughter when she attended nursery at 3/4 for the nursery to re-apply for the funding. How often do you have to re-apply to get the funding is it every term?

[bunyip]

Nurseries are signing them all up happily. Let's wait to see what happens next year when these 2 year olds become 3 year olds and the level of funding drops significantly. Will the nurseries be so keen to keep them on?

Early evidence is disturbing. I have CM friends in the next county. Some have already had enquiries from parents about care for children when they turn 3, cos their nursery has suggested they might like to find alternative care. There is a £1.30ph difference in funding between 2yo's and 3-4yo's and we wonder if the nursery in question sees this as significant enough to start 'managing' its numbers.

[miffy]

Early evidence is disturbing. I have CM friends in the next county. Some have already had enquiries from parents about care for children when they turn 3, cos their nursery has suggested they might like to find alternative care. There is a £1.30ph difference in funding between 2yo's and 3-4yo's and we wonder if the nursery in question sees this as significant enough to start 'managing' its numbers.

I've read other reports about this happening - nurseries choosing to have two year olds and then not continuing with them when the funding drops at 3.

Then again here funding for 3 yo has not gone up for at least the last 3 years.

Miffy xx

[Simona]

Early evidence is disturbing. I have CM friends in the next county. Some have already had enquiries from parents about care for children when they turn 3, cos their nursery has suggested they might like to find alternative care. There is a £1.30ph difference in funding between 2yo's and 3-4yo's and we wonder if the nursery in question sees this as significant enough to start 'managing' its numbers.

Bunyip...this gives me great hope!!!!!!!!!!
Our funding for 2 yo is £6.10 and then drops to £3.50 when they reach 3

I look forward to being inundated with calls and receive such generous funding to keep my business sustainable!!!
I think the DfE is looking into this when they say they may introduce a national formula?
I shall put my feet up and wait for that as I have no intention of subsidising childcare and education in an area that is mostly affluent and for parents who earn 10 times what I do and appear to be going on holiday more often I have hot dinners!!!

[jadavi]

I have two year olds nursery funded hours but only people I found myself (had them from babies)
I challenged the local children's centre who have never sent me any but got nowhere.
I put an article in the free mag saying how a cm setting can suit some children better but no response.
Meanwhile nurseries locally have long waiting lists!!

[AgentTink]

Well CM's were i live have had no requests at all because currently we still need to be accrediated to offer this funding. They opened up the criteria to be accrediated to all childminders,, not just network childminders in March. I put my name down and i am still only half way through the process now and will not get seen again until September as my DO doesnt work the summer holidays!!!!!!!!!!!! And apparrenty they have a huge number of children wanting places!!!!!!!

I sent a email to head of early years last week after reading MAC and the LA satutory document for funding, which says all good and outstanding settings should be able to offer funding without any accrediatation, but as you canguess i am still awaiting a responce. What a joke, 6 weeks to september and even if these proposals come in, i will most probably not be able to get anyone until next year now.

Also in our area the referrals for funding comes through the HV team, so i have asked the question to Early Years how will the HV know if i even offer the funding. Yet again i am still waiting an answer.

Our funding money is also a £1.20 difference, so it will be interesting to see what happens when they turn 3

[teacake2]

In my area you cannot apply to offer the care for 2 year olds unless you belong to the partnership, also there is very strict criteria for the children to be eligible for funding at 2 so I can't see how the nurseries are getting so many children, there doesn't seem to be much need for it round here and the nurseries here still have vacancies for 2 year olds or so they say.
Teacake2

[Tazmin68]

Hi

I have a child under 2 year old funding. Our estimate date for September start is mid August. I do still have space available for 2/3 year olds. Again local children's centres, family support workers seem to push nurseries rather than childminders. I think thy seem to forget that childminders may have more flexibility than nurseries. I also think that because of the criteria that has to be met to access the 2 year old funding some parents might be embarrassed to ask.

[madredann]

Early evidence is disturbing. I have CM friends in the next county. Some have already had enquiries from parents about care for children when they turn 3, cos their nursery has suggested they might like to find alternative care. There is a £1.30ph difference in funding between 2yo's and 3-4yo's and we wonder if the nursery in question sees this as significant enough to start 'managing' its numbers.

Thats just awful continuity of care? preperation for school? its just nuts

[Mouse]

Early evidence is disturbing. I have CM friends in the next county. Some have already had enquiries from parents about care for children when they turn 3, cos their nursery has suggested they might like to find alternative care. There is a £1.30ph difference in funding between 2yo's and 3-4yo's and we wonder if the nursery in question sees this as significant enough to start 'managing' its numbers.

It makes you wonder if childminders will be called on for 0-2yr olds, then 3-4yr olds, with the nurseries taking the 2 years olds

It is all just one big mess