Does anyone NOT do learning journals?

[Wendybird]

If not, what do you do instead?

I am finding that I have so little time in the evenings due to having two of my own (1 who doesn't sleep well) that I am getting behind and I find them stressful to get done and I'm not sure who I am doing them for? I feel I meet the EYFS requirements in the work that I do with the children and that the documentation is showing that off to the parents (and Ofsted) but my parents seem to value the in-depth e-mails I send far more than the journals.

Just looking for more efficient alternatives if there are any

[Ripeberry]

You need to be able to show how the child is progressing and how you meet his or her needs and that you are following the child's interests. If you e-mails show that then OK.
It's up to your how you document it, but when Ofsted come they want evidence so keep all the e-mails if you can.
I used to get bogged down with the Learning Journeys and dreaded doing them but then I made them simpler and it was much less stressful

[Chatterbox Childcare]

Can you not print off the emails and add a photo and just put it in the file

Ofsted will want to see a starting point and a journey and these would be the journey

I do LJ for the smaller ones but scrapbooks for the 4+ and they glue the photo's and craft work in themselves

[Wendybird]

I do a very thorough Initial Assessment at the beginning with each child (this can take weeks, depending on how quickly they settle). Would it be enough to do this roughly every six months or so and then just pop pictures and short captions scrapbook style into the learning journal? I have got to get it simplified enough that I don't put it off so much and that it doesn't take up all my free time. It is really clear from my setting that I follow the children's interests as I make toys and activities for them based on their interests and next steps. And I do keep all the e-mails as well and could print them off for Ofsted.

Do those who use an online system like Noble Minder or ****** find it simplifies their paperwork? I'm really wanting to go minimalist and I don't think I'm that bothered about Ofsted gradings and I'm not due an inspection for another 3 years - by which point it will all have changed anyway

[francinejayne]

Do those who use an online system like Noble Minder or ****** find it simplifies their paperwork? I'm really wanting to go minimalist and I don't think I'm that bothered about Ofsted gradings and I'm not due an inspection for another 3 years - by which point it will all have changed anyway

I find the babes days system has made my paperwork much easier - I would not go back to paper files now!

[Trpta108]

I find the babes days system has made my paperwork much easier - I would not go back to paper files now!

Same here.

[jumpinjen]

Can you not print off the emails and add a photo and just put it in the file

Ofsted will want to see a starting point and a journey and these would be the journey

I do LJ for the smaller ones but scrapbooks for the 4+ and they glue the photo's and craft work in themselves

Good idea - you sound like you have been duplicating if you do them twice like this - you could expand on the e-mail by highlighting and adding L and D's on the side as well as pics, then you have shown to both parents and ofsted,

Jen x

[mrs robbie williams]

I do lj's for my eyfs lo's but i only put artwork, photos and monthly obs in there, it sounds like im not putting enough in there
I do daily diaries and these are a5 books that go between me and parent.

[Heaven Scent]

Some of the older minders in my area are spending a great deal of time on Daily Diaries and not doing the LJ's and that is totally the fault of the Childminder support workers at the council because they never stopped prattling on about Daily Diaries for the first couple of years after EYFS came out - they are not a legal requirement but you LJ's are -

LJ's are where you show what the child was doing - why they are doing it and how you are going to develop their interest or skill (Next Steps)

These files should be shared (shown to) any other setting your child attends and should tie in with the LJ's that they do.

For a full time child you will only need 3 or so observations per month - I was doing that per week and it was way too much work and I was failing greatly.

Cut down on what your are sending to parents - you speak to them at pick up - create some sort of simple proforma where you just fill in gaps or highlight stuff for your daily diary so that if you omit to tell the parents something then you will have it covered in what you email. Unlike a nursery where staff work early and late shifts and may be part time the Key worker may not be there when parents drop off and/or pick up which is why daily diaries are necessary and invaluable we do see parents at drop off and pick up and every time they do so. - Keep daily diaries/reports to a minimum.

Like you I get a great deal of information from the parents and children (if relevant) before and just as they start and then use that as my starting points and go from there I use this as the first pages of the learning journey.


With regard to your observations they only need to be a "snap shot" of the activity or what was said. So all you need is a photograph or a post it note stating exactly what is happening or what was said by the child (with a brief background to what the child is doing or where he/she is when she said it) - then write a brief description of why you believe the child is doing it - (no need it back it up with quotes from early educators etc as you would when training). Lastly put some "next steps" - these are ideas (not set in stone) that you may use or introduce the child to to help develop their interest or area of development - these may never happen and don't worry about it - its a good idea to number your observations and each page - (I do all my LJ's on the computer and fit 3 observations to a page).

Mixed in amongst the observations you can have comments from parents or photos that parents send you and use them as one of your monthly observations this shows you working in partnership with parents and gives you an insight into what they so at home.

Ask parents for photos of your child at home with people who matter to them and add them to the LJ when you get them.

Every now and again I add a series of photos (mine are small that I add electronically i.e. copy and paste and reduce in size - if I can do it its easy) of special outings or occasions such as when we visited the fire station - I just put a heading "Fire Station Visit" - I don't write anyting about it the photos say it all. I do this too if the children are invited to a child's birthday party during my minding hours or if I can attend a child's nativity play or sports day during my work hours (this is excellent for showing working in partnership with both parents and other settings/professionals.

When it's the child's birthday - I take a photo of them with the cake I buy them and put a heading Happy Birthday "Aimee Sue" (not the real name of any child I ever cared for).

There are two reasons I suggest you have the pages and obs numbered the first is because you cannot observe everything and so need to have some sort of tracking system - I find the easiest way to do this is print off the Early Learning goals or Development matters and if you observe one highlight it and reference it with your observation and page numbers - you can fill out any gaps in an age range by observing a child for a few days and highlight the area if the child has reached it and date it the date you checked - if you cant see a child doing something ask parents or the preschool and highlight that too and write mum, dad or preschool in the box again shows you are working in partnership - I also ask to see the child's LJ's from other settings and take photo's of them which I add to my LJ's to show I've seen them - sometimes too I add comments to the comments sections - but my local pre-school and school are happy with that others may not be so you must ask - by me doing so shows they too work in partnership so its in their favour too.

The second reason is when a child covers a next steps and I observe it I then cross reference it to the previous observation with the number of the observation and the page its on (e.g. 21:7)


When a child attends a new setting I hand them the LJ's to look at and get them to sign a sheet that parent also signs to say they have seen it and I put that into the LJ when I do that.

As the child does some activites or crafts etc for special occasions or when they start to write meaningfully I take a photo of them doing it and keep a sample of what they have done then slot that into the LJ at that point.

When a child leaves a setting say pre-school to attend school I ask parents for the LJ and I slot it into mine then when they leave school and get theirs I do the same and it makes a really nice record of your childs early years.

If you come up against resistance to any of the above from parents or schools etc then make a note of it date it - sign it, if possible get parents to sign it and put that note into the LJ at the relevant point. This way when an inspector is looking through it she can see that you have done everything in your power to ensure you have met the requirements.

The idea of a LJ is that it is a complete record of the childs early years and it should flag up any areas of difficulty or developmental delay the child may be experiencing and if this manifests itself in every provision the child attends and at home. Relevant sections should be able to be passed to H.V's and doctors etc. but it doesn't work that way in practice because they are not kept in the loop and some pre-schools/nurseries and schools don't value what we do so we are in a bit of a no win situation. At the end of the day we need to look after ourselves and our reputations so we need to show we are doing what is expected of us but at the same time without near killing ourselves in the process.

LJ's are also a snap shot of what you do with the children in your care that is used as an aid when inspectors are making judgments of your provision. There is no set way to do it so do it to suit you. I do it this way to cut down on ink, paper, expensive photographic paper and the expense of developing photographs. I don't print them off straight away in case changes have to be mad or in case I've made some sort of mistake or remembered something that would be good to add and I keep the sheets in the front of a plastic wallet file which I have for each child.

Keep everything simple and short and sweet - so its neat tidy and makes easy reading for parents & the inspector and keeps your work to a minimum.

I hope this helps.

[Bridey]

Heaven Scent - that is a wonderful post full of lots of very useful advice! Thank you, I will printing it off and reading it very carefully

[rickysmiths]

Some of the older minders in my area are spending a great deal of time on Daily Diaries and not doing the LJ's and that is totally the fault of the Childminder support workers at the council because they never stopped prattling on about Daily Diaries for the first couple of years after EYFS came out - they are not a legal requirement but you LJ's are -

LJ's are where you show what the child was doing - why they are doing it and how you are going to develop their interest or skill (Next Steps)

These files should be shared (shown to) any other setting your child attends and should tie in with the LJ's that they do.

For a full time child you will only need 3 or so observations per month - I was doing that per week and it was way too much work and I was failing greatly.

Cut down on what your are sending to parents - you speak to them at pick up - create some sort of simple proforma where you just fill in gaps or highlight stuff for your daily diary so that if you omit to tell the parents something then you will have it covered in what you email. Unlike a nursery where staff work early and late shifts and may be part time the Key worker may not be there when parents drop off and/or pick up which is why daily diaries are necessary and invaluable we do see parents at drop off and pick up and every time they do so. - Keep daily diaries/reports to a minimum.

Like you I get a great deal of information from the parents and children (if relevant) before and just as they start and then use that as my starting points and go from there I use this as the first pages of the learning journey.


With regard to your observations they only need to be a "snap shot" of the activity or what was said. So all you need is a photograph or a post it note stating exactly what is happening or what was said by the child (with a brief background to what the child is doing or where he/she is when she said it) - then write a brief description of why you believe the child is doing it - (no need it back it up with quotes from early educators etc as you would when training). Lastly put some "next steps" - these are ideas (not set in stone) that you may use or introduce the child to to help develop their interest or area of development - these may never happen and don't worry about it - its a good idea to number your observations and each page - (I do all my LJ's on the computer and fit 3 observations to a page).

Mixed in amongst the observations you can have comments from parents or photos that parents send you and use them as one of your monthly observations this shows you working in partnership with parents and gives you an insight into what they so at home.

Ask parents for photos of your child at home with people who matter to them and add them to the LJ when you get them.

Every now and again I add a series of photos (mine are small that I add electronically i.e. copy and paste and reduce in size - if I can do it its easy) of special outings or occasions such as when we visited the fire station - I just put a heading "Fire Station Visit" - I don't write anyting about it the photos say it all. I do this too if the children are invited to a child's birthday party during my minding hours or if I can attend a child's nativity play or sports day during my work hours (this is excellent for showing working in partnership with both parents and other settings/professionals.

When it's the child's birthday - I take a photo of them with the cake I buy them and put a heading Happy Birthday "Aimee Sue" (not the real name of any child I ever cared for).

There are two reasons I suggest you have the pages and obs numbered the first is because you cannot observe everything and so need to have some sort of tracking system - I find the easiest way to do this is print off the Early Learning goals or Development matters and if you observe one highlight it and reference it with your observation and page numbers - you can fill out any gaps in an age range by observing a child for a few days and highlight the area if the child has reached it and date it the date you checked - if you cant see a child doing something ask parents or the preschool and highlight that too and write mum, dad or preschool in the box again shows you are working in partnership - I also ask to see the child's LJ's from other settings and take photo's of them which I add to my LJ's to show I've seen them - sometimes too I add comments to the comments sections - but my local pre-school and school are happy with that others may not be so you must ask - by me doing so shows they too work in partnership so its in their favour too.

The second reason is when a child covers a next steps and I observe it I then cross reference it to the previous observation with the number of the observation and the page its on (e.g. 21:7)


When a child attends a new setting I hand them the LJ's to look at and get them to sign a sheet that parent also signs to say they have seen it and I put that into the LJ when I do that.

As the child does some activites or crafts etc for special occasions or when they start to write meaningfully I take a photo of them doing it and keep a sample of what they have done then slot that into the LJ at that point.

When a child leaves a setting say pre-school to attend school I ask parents for the LJ and I slot it into mine then when they leave school and get theirs I do the same and it makes a really nice record of your childs early years.

If you come up against resistance to any of the above from parents or schools etc then make a note of it date it - sign it, if possible get parents to sign it and put that note into the LJ at the relevant point. This way when an inspector is looking through it she can see that you have done everything in your power to ensure you have met the requirements.

The idea of a LJ is that it is a complete record of the childs early years and it should flag up any areas of difficulty or developmental delay the child may be experiencing and if this manifests itself in every provision the child attends and at home. Relevant sections should be able to be passed to H.V's and doctors etc. but it doesn't work that way in practice because they are not kept in the loop and some pre-schools/nurseries and schools don't value what we do so we are in a bit of a no win situation. At the end of the day we need to look after ourselves and our reputations so we need to show we are doing what is expected of us but at the same time without near killing ourselves in the process.

LJ's are also a snap shot of what you do with the children in your care that is used as an aid when inspectors are making judgments of your provision. There is no set way to do it so do it to suit you. I do it this way to cut down on ink, paper, expensive photographic paper and the expense of developing photographs. I don't print them off straight away in case changes have to be mad or in case I've made some sort of mistake or remembered something that would be good to add and I keep the sheets in the front of a plastic wallet file which I have for each child.

Keep everything simple and short and sweet - so its neat tidy and makes easy reading for parents & the inspector and keeps your work to a minimum.

I hope this helps.

Lots of lovely info.

However just to be clear. LJs are not a legal requirement.

You do not have to do them. What you do have to demonstrate is that you know the children you care fore and the stage they are ate in relation to their age and stage, and show you know how they are progressing and demonstrate how you are doing this.

In theory you could actually achieve all this within a SEF and never complete an LJ. If you write a detailed Daily Diary you are also fulfilling all the requirements. Sorry.

I would never do this in an actual learning journal as it is so negative especially with regard to the parents, how to make them feel bad in one easy lesson. If I invite a parent to contribute I make a separate note which is kept in the children's file and then I comment and quote if no contribution is made. I have found over the years of EYFS that my parents will very rarely evr write comments in the LJ so I note any they make to me on the sheet. My inspector did comment at inspection and I showed her the record sheet, she didn't like that they hadn't written in the LJ but I asked her what was I to do stand over them while they did it?!! You can only go so far and the same goes with schools. The ones here are really bad.

On this I must say that of all the LJ I have seen from other providers have been woefully bad compared to mine and those of most of the cms I know who are clearer and more detailed. Most i have seen refer to the areas of learning with letter but there is no explanation for the parents as to what they mean? I have seen one recently where identical observations with the same next steps were done on a child with a gap of 3 mths between them I was proudly presented with the LJ of a lo who had been with his previous cm for 18mth. Well what can I say, it comprised of 4 A4 photos printed on paper all taken on the same day and two A4 sheets with a 2 line written observations for each month but the last 6 had all been written the same day!! I actually went back to the parents and asked for the rest I was shocked and so were the parents when they saw mine

[JCrakers]

I do all my paperwork in the day. Theres no way after a 10hr day that Im going to sit down and do LJ After 6pm is my time and work finishes, and definitly not weekends either.

Can you fit it into your day?..find time when the children are having free play? If Ofsted are wanting all these requirements then they need to understand that they are not going to be done out of hours

[rickysmiths]

Yes Crackers once a child's file is up and running I could do most of it during the day.

My LJ are like a scrap book and written from the child's point of view like a diary.

I use coloured post it notes to jot down mini obs as they happen, I have them on the table and so I can very easily make a note. I carry a little note book when i am out for the same thing. If I don't do this I forget when I have several los.

I then take loads of photos.

I do a more formal Observation every 2-3 months and this will have next steps on. This will be on one area of learning only as a focus.

I use the NCMA stickers to identify the areas of learning a post it or photo fall into and there is a guide to the areas of learning for the parents in the front of the LJ.

I also leave clear boxes for parents comments if they want to make them but they rarely do.

Ofsted loved them and they are quick and simple.

[VeggieSausage]

I find the babes days system has made my paperwork much easier - I would not go back to paper files now!

same here.....how do you share your plans with parents or do you not?

[MagdalenaS]

Hi
I just about to get membership for babes days. Could you tell if you still keeping anything on paper? If yes what it is and how you show OFSTED your work. Are they coming and you simply give them access to you page?

I find the babes days system has made my paperwork much easier - I would not go back to paper files now!

[Kimmy050983]

I used to get really stressed out about LJ - but now I am doing them much much simpler. The preschool Jamie goes to had a good ofsted rating and all they do is a book with photos and descriptions.
That's all I do and I put my planning (very simplified also!!) separate.
I have found that stressing about doing the "perfect" LJ brings me nothing but stress and I procastrinate with them. doing it the simple way makes me keep them updated much easier!!!

[loocyloo]

I was proudly presented with the LJ of a lo who had been with his previous cm for 18mth. Well what can I say, it comprised of 4 A4 photos printed on paper all taken on the same day and two A4 sheets with a 2 line written observations for each month but the last 6 had all been written the same day!! I actually went back to the parents and asked for the rest I was shocked and so were the parents when they saw mine

i've JUST been shown the LJ for a child that started with me in SEPTEMBER. the previous setting had only just given it to mum ... 'they were busy' there were a few photos for each of the first couple of months child was there, and then just a photo or, maybe 2, a month, for the rest of the 8 mths child had attended. these just had headings 'construction' 'water play' and that was it. then there was a grid showing where they considered child to be, and in what age/stage etc. i'm not sure its the same child i care for! what horrified me most, that the child was there from 9mth - 20mth and in that time started to walk/talk etc! (edited to say, i think this had pretty much mainly been written on the same day, as all in the same colour, style & i could see the dents from writing on other pages )

i aim to just do a photo or 2 ob a week, but sometimes, what they are doing is so exciting, i just have to photograph it!!!

[Heaven Scent]

Lots of lovely info.

However just to be clear. LJs are not a legal requirement.

You do not have to do them. What you do have to demonstrate is that you know the children you care fore and the stage they are ate in relation to their age and stage, and show you know how they are progressing and demonstrate how you are doing this.

In theory you could actually achieve all this within a SEF and never complete an LJ. If you write a detailed Daily Diary you are also fulfilling all the requirements. Sorry.

I would never do this in an actual learning journal as it is so negative especially with regard to the parents, how to make them feel bad in one easy lesson. If I invite a parent to contribute I make a separate note which is kept in the children's file and then I comment and quote if no contribution is made. I have found over the years of EYFS that my parents will very rarely evr write comments in the LJ so I note any they make to me on the sheet. My inspector did comment at inspection and I showed her the record sheet, she didn't like that they hadn't written in the LJ but I asked her what was I to do stand over them while they did it?!! You can only go so far and the same goes with schools. The ones here are really bad.

On this I must say that of all the LJ I have seen from other providers have been woefully bad compared to mine and those of most of the cms I know who are clearer and more detailed. Most i have seen refer to the areas of learning with letter but there is no explanation for the parents as to what they mean? I have seen one recently where identical observations with the same next steps were done on a child with a gap of 3 mths between them I was proudly presented with the LJ of a lo who had been with his previous cm for 18mth. Well what can I say, it comprised of 4 A4 photos printed on paper all taken on the same day and two A4 sheets with a 2 line written observations for each month but the last 6 had all been written the same day!! I actually went back to the parents and asked for the rest I was shocked and so were the parents when they saw mine

Rickysmiths, - would never ever write anything negative about a child or the parents anhywhere never mind in a childs LJ. I have worked in the world of Childcare for the past 25 years and have always had fantastic relationships with every family I have ever encountered. I was referring to other settings not working in partnership in return for our efforts to work with them.

[Bridey]

Rickysmiths, - would never ever write anything negative about a child or the parents anhywhere never mind in a childs LJ. I have worked in the world of Childcare for the past 25 years and have always had fantastic relationships with every family I have ever encountered. I was referring to other settings not working in partnership in return for our efforts to work with them.

Reading back I think you put the word "parents" in accidently where you maybe meant to say "playgroups"

(In the blue highlighted bit of Rickysmiths quote - I must admit it made me gasp when I read it! lol)

[Heaven Scent]

Reading back I think you put the word "parents" in accidently where you maybe meant to say "playgroups"

(In the blue highlighted bit of Rickysmiths quote - I must admit it made me gasp when I read it! lol)

Oh sorry - I was rushing about like a headless chicken this morning trying to get things done before children came and seeing to my own so kept having to leave it and come back to it.