ncma vs morton michel starter packs

**kayjay** · 03-12-2011, 10:21 PM

Hi all, I have been at a pre-reg information session today and we were shown a couple of starter packs - one from ncma and one from morton michel. They both looked good, but could anyone give me any tips on which they think is best? Are these worth the investment?

Thanks for reading

Penny1959 · 03-12-2011, 11:22 PM

Both do the job and contain everything you need - different styles though and so that will be a personal choice thing.

I am known as 'a NCMA' member and so tend to have NMCA stuff - but hopefully someone will be a long later to give information on MM stuff

I like the NCMA one -as like having the different, separate books within the pack.

With NCMA you can buy all the books in the pack seperately - so if money an issue that might help spread the cost.

NCMA publications are more expensive if you are not (or not going to become a member) and membership itself is quite ewxpensive especially when first starting out.

However if weighing up total cost and exploring differences - it is worth noting that NCMA membership does make you part of a member led organisation who represent members at government level and who influence government policy (lots of threads on here about NCMA).

Penny

**sarah707** · 04-12-2011, 08:41 AM

It depends on who you take your insurance with... if you go with NCMA then you will need to use their paperwork or you will not be covered in the event of a problem.

If you choose MM for your insurance company you are able to design your own paperwork OR buy their starter pack, it's up to you.

Hth

**miffy** · 04-12-2011, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by sarah707

It depends on who you take your insurance with... if you go with NCMA then you will need to use their paperwork or you will not be covered in the event of a problem.

Hth

I thought you just needed to use NCMA contracts to be covered by their legal services?

Miffy xx

**sarah707** · 04-12-2011, 10:26 AM

Originally Posted by miffy

I thought you just needed to use NCMA contracts to be covered by their legal services?

Miffy xx

I always advise newbies who are insuring with NCMA to start off with the package of NCMA paperwork Miffy.

I find that it saves a lot of misunderstanding in the long run especially if they are not too confident about putting their own stuff together until they have been working for a while.

There is a further issue in that MM contracts contain a significant error on them relating to emergency permission which they tell me will be addressed next time they look at updating them however as far as I am aware it is still there.

So I cannot in all conscience recommend MM contracts although the paperwork package they provide is generally excellent quality and as you know I am a strong advocate of MM insurance for the extra protection it has provided in the past in cases of non payment of fees by parents.

I hope that clarifies

**rickysmiths** · 04-12-2011, 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by miffy

I thought you just needed to use NCMA contracts to be covered by their legal services?

Miffy xx

If you want legal representation the expect you to use the Attendance register and it should be signed by childminder and the parent.

**kayjay** · 04-12-2011, 07:46 PM

Thankyou for your replies! If I understand correctly, then, you could be insured by MM and using your own/NCMA contracts, but not the other way round? I would definitley want to be working from some kind of template as I'm starting out, so I will likely be purchasing one or the other. Food for thought... being insured for non-payment of fees sounds like a good plan if it's possible! K

**sarah707** · 04-12-2011, 08:26 PM

Originally Posted by kayjay

being insured for non-payment of fees sounds like a good plan if it's possible! K

Just to clarify that point... I worded it very carefully in my post.

Both companies - NCMA and MM - insure you for non payment of fees. In fact the cover and extras offered are similar but there are some differences you would need to research.

however MM have always had a better reputation for supporting childminders in the unfortunate position of non-payment.

I understand NCMA have recently changed their underwriters but do not have any evidence whether things have improved or not so i cannot comment on current support.

Hth

Penny1959 · 05-12-2011, 01:44 PM

I agree with Sarah - when starting out it is better to use either the MM pacage or the NCMA one - and keep everything with one company DO NOT mix and match!

This is the advise I gave when I worked for the LA and was not allowed to give a personal opinion

Rickysmiths is right about NCMA and support in contract issues - they would like members to use all their paperwork - that way it should be ;water tight' - if filled in correctly.

Sarah is right NCMA have recently changed the company who provide legal support - it is supposed to be much better - but I have not had any information on this - as to if true or not.

Ncma have been made aware (via my questionnaire responses) that members and non members do not llike certain aspects of contract support - including the need to continue to provide care if a parent has not paid. In fact the chair of NCMA was not aware of this - and though (personally) that it was not good and would the situation worse / have more to recover. The situation is being looked into by NCMA.

Personally I have my own system for ensuring I get paid by parents and so don't need this aspect of the insurance cover - which is as well as I don't use NCMA contracts or attendance book (as neither meet my needs)

Penny

**13Katrina** · 23-12-2011, 03:11 PM

Hi Penny,

I just wondered if you mind sharing your fees/payment system/policy.

I'm in the process of registering as a childminder and in my area the starter pack from NCMA plus insurance is offered as part of the local authority's start up pack.

I'm worried about having to take children if parents have not paid but am also a little wary of not using the NCMA contract as a new childminder if my insurance is via their organisation.

Thanks.

Katrina x

Penny1959 · 23-12-2011, 03:44 PM

Originally Posted by 13Katrina

Hi Penny,

I just wondered if you mind sharing your fees/payment system/policy.

I'm in the process of registering as a childminder and in my area the starter pack from NCMA plus insurance is offered as part of the local authority's start up pack.

I'm worried about having to take children if parents have not paid but am also a little wary of not using the NCMA contract as a new childminder if my insurance is via their organisation.

Thanks.

Katrina x

If you pm with you your email address I will send you my contract guidance notes. However I think as a new childminder you do need to be very, very careful about doing your own contract.

With using the NCMA one the best way to 'make it work for you - would be to have one months payment up front before child starts.

Although I don't do this - Some also charge a deposit to cover the notice period - so when partents give notice they don't pay for that last month- this also means if they leave with out giving notice the childminder keeps the deposit and is not out of pocket and has some money to cover bills while advertising for new children.

It is one of the main drawbacks of childminding though - income can go up and down throughout the year - and completely beyond your control.

Penny