4 YEAR OLDS IN FULLTIME SCHOOL!

Pipsqueak · 31-01-2008, 02:47 PM

Originally Posted by Banana

They do not return to under 5's during holidays

xx

Thankfully - it would be most confusing for the little ones who wouldn't know their correct age!!!!

Let alone for us!!!

**Rubybubbles** · 31-01-2008, 02:55 PM

OKay so thats sorted for now.........................................

What about in Sept? (hides in corner, but does want to know!!)

**tomy12** · 04-02-2008, 07:23 PM

dear all
i asked the same question and this was my reply
Dear Mrs Curtis
Please be advised that if a child is 4 years of age,is going into fulltime education then they will be counted as a 5 year old in your registered numbers.
please note however should this apply to you,then you should put this in writing providing a signature to the ofsted inspection surpport team.
should you require the address to send this to please provide me with your registration number and we will be happy to assist you
regards suzie bundock

so does this mean i have to apply in writing to have a child who is 4 but in full time education to comply with my registration?
any advice welcome

claire

Pipsqueak · 04-02-2008, 07:26 PM

Originally Posted by tomy12

dear all
i asked the same question and this was my reply
Dear Mrs Curtis
Please be advised that if a child is 4 years of age,is going into fulltime education then they will be counted as a 5 year old in your registered numbers.
please note however should this apply to you,then you should put this in writing providing a signature to the ofsted inspection surpport team.
should you require the address to send this to please provide me with your registration number and we will be happy to assist you
regards suzie bundock

so does this mean i have to apply in writing to have a child who is 4 but in full time education to comply with my registration?
any advice welcome

claire

Thanks for that but I will ask the same question as you - does that mean then that we have to inform OFSTED and our rising 5's we don't just assume that they are counted into our next age bracket.

Phew blimey this subject is exhausting!!! If it ain't one thing tis another..

**berkschick** · 04-02-2008, 07:34 PM

I THINK you have to inform OFSTED so that they can send you out an amended certificate.

**tomy12** · 05-02-2008, 12:44 PM

hi all

had a reply today saying i have to inform ofsted if i have any aged 4yrs but go to full time school, so i can count them as a over 5 .
do you think i will get in trouble for already treating one as a over 5 as i didn't know we had to inform ofsted as its in the standards that a child who goes to fulltime schoolbut is 4years old can be counted as a over 5 for our numbers.
shall i say i have a 4 year old i treat as a over 5 already??
what shall i do as i will have another come sept that will be 4 but going to school and will be with me just in school hols.
what would you do,i am really worried now that i have done some thing wrong.
claire

Pipsqueak · 05-02-2008, 12:47 PM

Given the amount of confusion between us and the conflicting information (and lack of) we receive then I would say you wouldn't get into trouble as I don't see how OFSTED could even justify a ticking off.

Wouldn't worry about it.

**wendywu** · 05-02-2008, 02:49 PM

Well i never knew we had to inform them of this fact.

What makes me laugh is that if we conducted our business this way, not being sure of facts, changing contracts and policies at a moments notice to suit ourselves, Ofsted would throw the book at us.

Perhaps they need a few policies themselves.

Pipsqueak · 05-02-2008, 02:53 PM

Shall we offer to write them

**sarah707** · 05-02-2008, 03:10 PM

I've always said if Ofsted were a business they'd have gone bust years ago! Their total inefficiency is overwhelming sometimes!

**gailee** · 01-03-2008, 08:44 PM

so if a child is 4 years and in 10 hours a week are they classed as rising 5???
so if a child is in nursery and is 4 which is 10 educational settings a week that makes them a rising 5 ??? is this correct ??? gail

**ruby** · 01-03-2008, 09:37 PM

i think it is only for children who go to main school not nursery

we are different in Wales but i am sure some one will be along to help you

cathy

Pipsqueak · 01-03-2008, 10:36 PM

A 4yr old has to be in full time education, ie at school all day - they are then considered rising 5.
If they are 4 and in their nursery sessions then they are still considered 4 (my neice is - she is in reception at school but only attends 9am till 12.30pm 5 days a week and is considered 4 not rising 5) how confusing is that!

**Heaven Scent** · 03-03-2008, 12:14 AM

Someone here has a daughter whos birthday is the 5th Sept just wanted to begin with so have I. Now I've tried to read all 3 pages of this thread and gave up after 1.5. I know what you are all saying and what Ofsted are saying but aren't they contradicting themselves. Its ok to have a 30:2 ratio to these poor babies in a huge school where they have to look after themselves in toilets and sort themselves out at lunchtime carrying loaded trays across lunch halls and sorting out battles when another kiddie sits in their place and then they have to spend their free time playing with very limited resources and equipment on a concrete or tarmac playground together with between 90 and 180 other KS 1 children. But on the other hand in the hols they are saying that they cannot be in a nice clean caring environment where their food is handed to them and they are helped to the loo have suitable play equip etc etc etc unless they are wrapped up in cottonwool and are in a ratio of 3:1 under 5's plus 3 others under 8 that is riduculous as I imagine children will be coming and going in the hols so not all places will be taken...... What a load of s**te.

Celine

**Saz** · 06-03-2008, 12:46 PM

I had my pre-reg on Monday and my dd, aged 4, attends full time nursery school. Inspector said she would not be classed as over 5. In the school holidays she would be at home therefore counted in my numbers. I will have to wait until she is officially 5 in December, even though she starts reception class in September.

**deeb66** · 06-03-2008, 02:06 PM

I have heard this information directly from Surrey's Early Years Team who have checked with Ofsted to clarify this situation.

The rule is if the child is in full time school (i.e. all day!) then they are classed as over 5 and therefore falls into the 5-8 bracket. This includes school holidays.

This rule has been in effect for quite a few years now.

EYFS - September 2008

If the child is rising 5 but in full time school then as far as your ratios are concerned they still fall in the 5-8 bracket during school holidays but......

And this is what has caused the confusion..........

If they are still 4/5 in the school holidays you have apply EYFS and carry out the Practical Guidence part of it which means doing planning, observations and applying the 6 areas of development (KUW, PSED, PSRN, CLL,PD & CD).

If you think about it logically this would make sense as the child that is rising 5 or who has just passed 5 and at full time school is in Reception Class and the school would be delivering EYFS so we have to do it in the school holidays to provide continuity.

YOUR RATIO'S WILL NOT BE AFFECTED.

I hope this makes sense!

**Sarsar3NCH** · 06-03-2008, 02:08 PM

Thanks Dee xx

**miffy** · 06-03-2008, 06:47 PM

Originally Posted by deeb66

I have heard this information directly from Surrey's Early Years Team who have checked with Ofsted to clarify this situation.

The rule is if the child is in full time school (i.e. all day!) then they are classed as over 5 and therefore falls into the 5-8 bracket. This includes school holidays.

This rule has been in effect for quite a few years now.

EYFS - September 2008

If the child is rising 5 but in full time school then as far as your ratios are concerned they still fall in the 5-8 bracket during school holidays but......

And this is what has caused the confusion..........

If they are still 4/5 in the school holidays you have apply EYFS and carry out the Practical Guidence part of it which means doing planning, observations and applying the 6 areas of development (KUW, PSED, PSRN, CLL,PD & CD).

If you think about it logically this would make sense as the child that is rising 5 or who has just passed 5 and at full time school is in Reception Class and the school would be delivering EYFS so we have to do it in the school holidays to provide continuity.

YOUR RATIO'S WILL NOT BE AFFECTED.

I hope this makes sense!

Thank you Dee

I think I have the ssolution - if I just look after teacher's children then I won't need to deliver EYFS once they are at school for 10 sessions a week whether they are 4 or 5 cos they won't come in the holidays - perfect

miffy