4 YEAR OLDS IN FULLTIME SCHOOL!

[sarah707]

This question may not make any sense to anyone else other than me so please bear with me.
If the rules change in Sept and we can only class 4 year olds as a rising 5 during term time, what happens to the kids that we are already minding and are still under the age of 5, Im sure this is going to happen in some circumstances. Like I say maybe its just me. Samx

It's not just you Sam, it's a perfectly valid question... let's hope someone from Ofsted comes up with an answer before then or they will be granting an awful lot of variations for continuity of care

[Trouble]

this means i was illegal for 12 months because i was told she was called as 5

[mrsbumbles]

What happens is, the parents of 4yr olds in full time school will hve to pay a full time retainer during term time for the whole year or untill the child turns five, for the use of holiday care, which is what? 12 weeks a year? so a space is available with their childminder in their under 5s ratio during school hols, cant see any parent agreeing to that!! ridiculous!!!

[Blaze]

Right everyone ring OFSTED & try & get this writing...I'm on the phone as we speak!

[Blaze]

Ok...the holiday & term time business applies for your own children...the 10 educational sessions applies to minded children...am trying to get this in writing!
Tasha

[manjay]

I am soooo glad I live in Wales!!

amanda xx

[emma04]

Hi All

I'm really sorry to have caused such controversy, but i am sooooo racked off with Ofsted, when i called today (for the second time to clarify this argument) i told the guy on the phone that he'd better get some more staff in to man the phones cos he was going to get alot of calls! He seemed to think that everyone knew and that i was the one being thick!!

I really didn't mean to send everyone into a frenzy, but there was no point keeping the info to myself. I just hope that after all of the calls, they will finally get this whole shambles worked out for the sake of all our sanity's!!

Don't know what else to say so i will go into hiding for a bit. I want to reassure all that have replied, that i am not the sort to get the wrong end of the stick..... i was on the phone to the poor bloke for over 30 minutes arguing it out (he must of thought i was a complete FRUITLOOP!!)

[mrsbumbles]

Dont go into hiding Emma, you put forward a good point, and thats what this forum is for.
I still dont understand what difference it makes wether the rising 4yr old is your child or a mindee in the school hols, surely this is not practising equal opps?

[Sarsar3NCH]

The other point to this is that it is not just til the childs fifth birthday it is 'until 1st September following his or her fifth birthday' which obviously extends the problem further

Sarah

[ajs]

OMG THIS IS RIDICULOUS OFSTED ARE SO BLODY STUPID WHICH IS THE RIGHT ANSWER ARE WE ALLOWED TO HAVE RISING 5 ALL YEAR LONG IN THE 5 - 8 RATIO OR THE UNDER 5 RATIO
it doesn't actually affect me in any way as my mindees are all too young but youd think that at least one of us would get the same answer

[Lou]

Sorry i have only just got back on here since earlier.

Well i too rang OFSTED and they reiterated what Emma said.

THey said my daughter is in over 5s in term time and under 5s in hols.

I asked what if i have 3 under 5s and then there is hols and my daughter is at home?

He said i would have to apply for a variation.

Well i was not happy, asked how the hell i was supposed to know this????

Well im quite lucky as i only have 2 under 5s at mo, and dd turns 5 in may so should be ok, but even so, if we didnt clarify all this, and ofsted turned up then i would be in the wrong even though they havent made it clear???

Hmmm wheres that other thread? "worst thing about this job???"

OFSTED

[Kelly]

I can't quite believe what a fundemental **** up this is!!!! My son is 4 in school full time. In September I had a new registration certificate issued including him in my over 5's (I did make it clear it was my son) no one said anything about this term time only thing. I have filled his space full time (now have three under 3's). I would not be prepared to loose this income, I will keep quite for the time being and keep watching the thread....

[Banana]

Lou I hope you are kidding!!!

If you have been told that then you wait until 9am monday morning!!
I am going to call them and RANT RANT RANT!!

This is ridiculous!! Because here's my thinking.

Even if you have a child who is 4 at school and is classed as a 5 year old during term time but not out of term time then what happens when your child is at home as a 4 year old going to school in the morning - but you have say.. 2 one year olds and a 2 year old arriving at 7 and staying until 6pm (would be ****** knackered but im trying to just put a point across). So you would be over numbers in the morning and evening anyways... where is the difference if the 4 year old is there for 4 hours a day while the other children are there. Am i confusing everyone now? Im trying to write it simply.

My point is why is it okay to overlap for 4 hours in term time but when they are off school in holidays we would be over our numbers??

Im so mad... this isnt affecting me at the moment, izzy wont start school until 2009 (her bday is novemner so its not a huge wait) but for those who's child just turns 4 in time for school this will be a real problem!

And im mad that some OFSTED call handlers are Soooooooooooo Thick!! Not the first time there has been conflicting info on the forum from Ofsted and I can bet it wont be the last

x

[tomy12]

hi there
this is a good thread & i shall be keeping an eye on this.
I read the new eyfs bible to say that a child will count as a young one (under 5) untill the 1st of sept following their 5th birthday.
so my dd who will be 5 in sept 14th will be class as under 5 untill 1st sept 2009 then 13 days later will be 6.
be my network cordinator said i was being silly and the same rules appy when that comes in force sept as now.
but the new eyfs is ment to replcae the old national standards and will be the new bible we will have to go by?
claire

[Banana]

Thats not right... it cant be.

How can a six year old be classed as an under 5. Somethings not right here
x

[Lou]

Lana,

I promise thats the response i got.

I think i might ring again on monday morning and if i get the same response i wil ask for it in writing, seems odd they dont think to make this clear, hmmm what am i talking about they dnt make anything clear.

I have just had a thought.........................

I actually have the direct number of the lady who did my last inspection. she gave it to me as she had given me a number of dates when she might call and said i might need to contact her if all children were ill.
Would it be rude to ring her and discuss (not now clearly!!!!) and even ask her to pop round and talk it through???????????????

Anyway nice to know we are all clear on this now ha ha

[Banana]

Yeah, give her a call..... quick Q, how come she has given you dates where she might call.. wont you be notified of your next inspection... are inspectors just randomnly doing inspections now?

Im not clear in all this stuff, How was it possible to have a woman give me the wrong info at Ofsted today..... arent they all in the same office??? Dont they hear each other saying stupid things?
x

[miffy]

Ok...the holiday & term time business applies for your own children...the 10 educational sessions applies to minded children...am trying to get this in writing!
Tasha

Where in the national standards does it make this distinction between your own child and a mindee................cos I can't find it!

I really don't think this is correct - you can't have a child changing categories simply because it is school holidays.

Barmey!!!!!! Bet you don't get this in writing tasha

Miffy xx

[Lou]

Sorry Lana, no she did my inspection back in november, but when she rang she asked if there were any days i wasnt minding etc.

Then she gave me 3 possible days she might turn up, but as they were all 2 weeks away, she said i will give you my number just in case you all come down with something.

I have still got number.

Sorry didnt make myself clearer.

Just thought it might be an idea give her a ring as she was quite pleasant and see what she says???

anyway this is all a nightmare!!!

[Banana]

Oh right, sorry Lou, started panicking about random ofsted calls then for a surprise inspection - that would just make my day one of them lol

Its worth a try and see what she says. Maybe we should send a collective email showing our disgust at the differences in training given to Oftsed employees

x