epi-pen training

[lulubelle]

when i done my first aid course we were shown how to do an epi-pen but were told if we ever needed to do one we should have proper training. i now have a little one starting in sep who has a severe allergy to hazelnuts and uses an epi-pen.

how to i go about training? mum said all she had was the pharmasist showing here what to do!

do i need to risk asses? list training anywhere?

[catlyn]

speak to your health visitor or school nurse...I used to work with the nurses and we often did training on epi pen use for parents and teachers. How old is the child?? if at school or nursery then they should already have a plan in place (they do in our area)

[Goatgirl]

I look after a little one with an epipen. His Mum asked her GP to arrange training (it has to be personal to the child) and as he was also going to preschool I went along and 'joined in' the training for the pre school staff.

I found it really useful as the trainer went through a care plan with the staff, so I used that as the basis for my own

Hope it goes well

best wishes,
Wendy

[Babycat]

You cannot hurt a child if you administer epi-pen in the wrong place. But training wouldnt go a miss!

I dont think you need to update risk assessments for the epi-pen as long as you follow the guidelines you have on storing it as medicine.

What I would check in RA's is the risk of exposing any nut based foods to mindee. I would also do a quick form (if you dont already) to sign in and out the epi-pen as you may be held responsible if the epi-pen doesnt go back and is needed (edit- and a form to say that the parent understands that you cannot guarentee the mindee will not come into contact with it even with your procedures). Also get a tub with a lid and cut a hole in the lid and glue the lid on the box and label it sharp objects and add this into your RA incase of use. (just edit to say most of new epi-pens needle goes inside after use but just to be safe)

Be sure to check the date on the epi-pen supplied they do go out of date.

Sorry cant think of anything else right now! If I do I'll pop back and annoy everyone! x

[loocyloo]

i had a nurse out from the allergy unit to train me. as i would be having child before nurse could get out to me, i had a phone interview where i had to explain what i would do when/if i needed to use the epi pen.

they then apparently 'signed me off' on mindees medical notes, so that if i had had to use it, they were satisified i knew what to do!

previously i had been trained at nursery.

[VINASOL]

I was told by my Ofsted Inspector (and the woman who trained us in paediatric first aid) that unless i had proper training (GP/Hospital) then it could invalidate my insurance and then liable to be sued by the parent ...that I must NOT be shown what to do by a parent - from the point of view that what if the parent mis-understood what they were supposed to do.

Don't want to scare you or anything, as always everyone gets different information.x

[lulubelle]

i spoke to ofsted and this is what they told me, then got them to email it to me so i had 'proof' i have spoken to district nurses etc and local council but they didnt have a clue!

You must ensure you adhere to the requirements of the Early Years Foundation Stage (EYFS) and the Childcare Register where appropriate. It is a specific legal requirement of the EYFS that providers must obtain prior written permission for each and every medicine from parents before any medication is given.



You should also pay regard to the EYFS statutory guidance. Whilst it is not a specific legal requirement to adhere to the statutory guidance you will be expected demonstrate how you continue to meet all the specific legal requirements if you choose not to. The EYFS statutory guidance states:



"Providers should ask parents about the medicines that their child needs to take and provide details of any changes to the prescription or the support required. If the administration of prescription medicines requires technical/medical knowledge then individual training should be provided for staff from a qualified health professional. Training should be specific to the individual child concerned."



For the purpose of clarity Ofsted understands 'prescription medicines' as referring to any medicines recommended by a nurse or pharmacist, or an ordered use of medication by prescription made by a doctor or dentist. Under this definition use of an Epi-pen or insulin would be considered prescription medication.



Our interpretation of this guidance is that childcare providers should be trained by a qualified health professional to administer medication such as epi-pens, insulin etc. It is for providers to decide what level of training is required they possess sufficient knowledge and skills to ensure the welfare of children. Training may be achieved through a standard first aid course or you may need to seek additional guidance by consulting a medical professional. Technical and medical guidance on general administration should come from health professionals rather than the child's parents.



The reference to training being specific to the individual child concerned we interpret to mean that you need to be aware of the medication needs of the individual child, such as dosage, when to administer, circumstances that may cause an allergic reaction etc. This does not mean that the child's own doctor or nurse has to provide the training on how to administer such medication. You should communicate with the parents to ensure that you follow similar procedures to the parents e.g. if giving an insulin injection how is the child prepared, soothed and comforted by parents as well as where the injection is given and how much.



If you feel you have sufficient understanding of how to administer the epi-pen/insulin from first aid training it may be sufficient to ask parents for training and advise specific to their child

[srobertson]

You cannot hurt a child if you administer epi-pen in the wrong place. But training wouldnt go a miss!

THIS PERSON IS WRONG!!! You CAN hurt a child if you administer the epipen in the wrong place! It must only ever be administered to the upper,outer thigh, to ensure it is injected into muscle, if it is injected intravenously (into a vein or artery) this can cause major problems with the heart and also the brain. However, if you administer an epipen when it isn't NEEDED (for example if you were unsure so administered it just in case), the child should be fine, as long as it was injected in the correct place.

My 15 month old has a nut allergy and has to carry epipens. He is due to start part time at our local preschool and have been told by my gp practice that they do not organise training. I have had training myself and I have a dvd with a trainer pen so it looks like it will be up to me to ensure all the staff are trained. I have been searching for information on regulations for schools/preschools and nurseries to investigate whether my training will be sufficient and to see what other people have done in my position. That's how I have come across this thread. I couldn't pass by without registering so that I could comment on such an important issue.

[k1rstie]

My 15 month old has a nut allergy .

Sorry to ask on this important thread.

Hi, I have a daft question about allergies that I can't find the answer to.

A hazelnut is a nut because it grows on a tree, a peanut is not a nut because it grows under ground - and is an allergen in is own right.

My question - is a coconut a nut? It does not grow on a 'tree' but on a palm tree, and is a member of the palm family.

Cheers.

[moggy]

Sorry to ask on this important thread.

Hi, I have a daft question about allergies that I can't find the answer to.

A hazelnut is a nut because it grows on a tree, a peanut is not a nut because it grows under ground - and is an allergen in is own right.

My question - is a coconut a nut? It does not grow on a 'tree' but on a palm tree, and is a member of the palm family.

Cheers.

By the dictionary, Nut = 'a fruit consisting of a hard or tough shell around an edible kernel.' Coconut does not have a 'kernel' so debatable.

In terms of allergies:

Here Frequently asked questions about food allergy - Anaphylaxis campaign it says:

Q2: Should people with nut allergy avoid coconut?

A2: The coconut is a member of the palm family and only distantly related to the tree nut. However, because of its name, people with nut allergy often feel they must avoid it at all costs. The coconut does not appear on Europe’s list of tree nuts that must always been labelled on food packages, but in the U.S. coconut is classed as a tree nut for labelling purposes.

The key question is whether coconut is likely to trigger allergic symptoms in people with tree nut allergy. We believe this is highly unlikely for most people with tree nut allergy. The botanical distance between coconuts and tree nuts would suggest that most people with tree nut allergy can tolerate coconut. There are bound to be exceptions to this, but if you are allergic to nuts and have never had a reaction to coconut it is likely that coconut poses no greater risk than many other foods. Check this with your allergist.

[Simona]

THIS PERSON IS WRONG!!! You CAN hurt a child if you administer the epipen in the wrong place! It must only ever be administered to the upper,outer thigh, to ensure it is injected into muscle, if it is injected intravenously (into a vein or artery) this can cause major problems with the heart and also the brain. However, if you administer an epipen when it isn't NEEDED (for example if you were unsure so administered it just in case), the child should be fine, as long as it was injected in the correct place.

My 15 month old has a nut allergy and has to carry epipens. He is due to start part time at our local preschool and have been told by my gp practice that they do not organise training. I have had training myself and I have a dvd with a trainer pen so it looks like it will be up to me to ensure all the staff are trained. I have been searching for information on regulations for schools/preschools and nurseries to investigate whether my training will be sufficient and to see what other people have done in my position. That's how I have come across this thread. I couldn't pass by without registering so that I could comment on such an important issue.

totally agree with you...Epipen is administered in the upper thigh and all F/Aid courses cover how to administer it.
any cm in doubt can contact the nurse at their surgery to get given the chance to use a fake Epipen...very important to be confident

[k1rstie]

Thanks Moggy. So peanuts and coconuts are not nuts, isn't that interesting?

Would you record the 'may contain ' xyz's on your allergen paperwork. I do , but put it in brackets.

Thanks again for your expert answer Moggy

[KateA]

I was told by my Ofsted Inspector (and the woman who trained us in paediatric first aid) that unless i had proper training (GP/Hospital) then it could invalidate my insurance and then liable to be sued by the parent ...that I must NOT be shown what to do by a parent - from the point of view that what if the parent mis-understood what they were supposed to do.

Don't want to scare you or anything, as always everyone gets different information.x

hi I was given this same advise recently and was also told to phone ambulance rather than use a epi pen let the paramedics do it x

[Daisy1956]

From my other posts people may know that I have had problems getting training for an epipen. My training was done with the allergy nurse she was very good. Training in school is done by the school nurse in this area. Peanuts are related to legumes (beans and peas). Hope this helps.

[Simona]

If you are in any doubt call the child's surgery and get the nurse to train you...there is some very worrying advice here.

Epipen must be administered immediately...that is why parents or anyone in charge must carry it at all times or be very close to where it is kept
An ambulance could take too long and ...in some cases...children can go into anaphylactic shock

Don't be in any doubt but if you have been trained in F/Aid Epipen administration has been part of the course for several years...the new certificates will confirm that we have done this procedures

[rickysmiths]

If you are in any doubt call the child's surgery and get the nurse to train you...there is some very worrying advice here.

Epipen must be administered immediately...that is why parents or anyone in charge must carry it at all times or be very close to where it is kept
An ambulance could take too long and ...in some cases...children can go into anaphylactic shock

Don't be in any doubt but if you have been trained in F/Aid Epipen administration has been part of the course for several years...the new certificates will confirm that we have done this procedures

That is actually not the case Simona. I did my First Aid Last month and we were shown very briefly how to use an Epipen with the advise that if a child with one comes to us we would need training from their GP or GP nurse.

It also does not detail anything on my Certificate. Nor did it on the last two certificates nor the ones for my Assistant for the last 3 training's nor have they ever been given Epi Pen training as part of their First Aid Course.

What we did as a group of Local Childminders was when we had a Network meeting last year at our Children's Centre we asked a local HV to come and give us training.

[rickysmiths]

hi I was given this same advise recently and was also told to phone ambulance rather than use a epi pen let the paramedics do it x

If you have an Epi Pen you must us it if it is needed that is why you have it and the parents might have something to say if you didn't and something happened to their child. It also might equally invalidate your PLI insurance if you had it and didn't use.

If you do use you write on the child's hand when it was given and what dose. Even better send the spent pen with the child to hospital. An Ambulance or Para Medic may not get to you on time.

I don't want to scare you but once if my father hadn't taken immediate action and had waited for the medics my Mum would have died her reaction to a wasp sting was so sudden. He was really shaken by the whole thing.

[Simona]

That is actually not the case Simona. I did my First Aid Last month and we were shown very briefly how to use an Epipen with the advise that if a child with one comes to us we would need training from their GP or GP nurse.

It also does not detail anything on my Certificate. Nor did it on the last two certificates nor the ones for my Assistant for the last 3 training's nor have they ever been given Epi Pen training as part of their First Aid Course.

What we did as a group of Local Childminders was when we had a Network meeting last year at our Children's Centre we asked a local HV to come and give us training.

I am sorry if your training did not include how to use Epipen or 'auto-injectors' as they are now called

I too attended my training last month and what I have reported her is what the qualified and accredited trainer told us.
I have no reason to disbelieve him and we had an extensive session of use of Epipen and marked on it too.

My certificate shows very clearly I have undergone this training...sorry if we seem to have different practices in every blooming LA or those we pay to create a universal policy on this matter.

I have had children with Epipens for years...I have one now and I am totally confident in what I MUST do to comply with EYFS...in the past I have been trained by the nurse at the child's surgery...this is not now required in my case as I am fully trained and confident.

Anyone not sure please raise it with you EY team...they are there to advice on this.

[moggy]

Thanks Moggy. So peanuts and coconuts are not nuts, isn't that interesting?

Would you record the 'may contain ' xyz's on your allergen paperwork. I do , but put it in brackets.

Thanks again for your expert answer Moggy

Which allergen paperwork?
I am fulfilling the new Allergen regulations without any new paper work.