Preparing children for school with 'Structured Learning'
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    Default Preparing children for school with 'Structured Learning'

    I have just been watching BBC Breakfast, when they did a piece about how Childminders and Nurseries should be teaching children letters and words, before they start school and that we are failing children by not doing this.

    Now don't get me wrong, I do talk about letters, words, numbers etc with children, but not in a 'structured' way.

    Is is just me, or are little children, not allowed to be little children any more? I mean, they are not even 5 years old for heaven's sake! I absolutely hate all this, feels like there is so much pressure for children to reach goals, by certain age, and if they don't it is the childcare system who is failing them.

    I am slowing losing my love for Childminding, it no longer seems to be about the 'children' but more about targets!

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    "He will add: "What children facing serious disadvantage need is high-quality, early education from the age of two, delivered by skilled practitioners with degrees in a setting that parents can recognise and access easily. These already exist. They are called schools." "

    Well... seems us "unskilled" practitioners, just do not cut the grade! Do these people actually live on this planet???

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    The story was just on again, the guest said that children need to be taught how to learn, and they need space to run and to play...the BBC presenters asked some really clever questions, it all made sense, question is whether we'll still be able to do what most of us know we do well which is foster the characteristics of effective learning, or whether the failings of a few will mean we're all more and more tightly managed. I get that some children aren't being given the best start, I get that some children hear 1 million fewer words than others, but surely the focus should be on helping them, not changing something which is working across huge areas of the country.
    Ah well, back to the coal face!!!

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    My daughters went to school knowing how to write their name and that was probably about it - my eldest daughter has just completed her Masters Degree so not knowing anything more than how to write her name hasn't prevented her from reaching her full potential. We should be moving towards the Scandanavian way of children going to Kindergarten until they start school at 6 - with play based learning, I thought this was the way we were heading with children learning through play, but the Government seem to have done yet another U turn!

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    In our local primary school we are asked not to teach children how to read etc before school as they learn the phonics alphabet and most parents were not getting the letter sound correct. We will soon be teaching them different languages and stuff while they are in the womb.
    Cm'S really are getting a slating lately.
    Tess1981

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    After hearing this on the news I really feel like crying and giving this wonderful job up, I have been childminding for 18 years and love it but Ofsted are making me feel like I'm a rubbish childminder.

    My parents think I do a wonderful job so why do I have to keep proving myself to Ofsted. I know when we play we talk about colours, we count and we socialise with others. Surely that's how we teach children not testing them when they're 2

    Let children be children, they have years ahead of themselves to learn and sit still in a classroom, my son is 20 and at Uni, he has another 2 years to go before he looks for a job.

    Surely we should let children enjoy their younger years.

    Oh yes, and what about having a go at parents not getting THEIR children ready for school
    Last edited by cherry; 03-04-2014 at 07:28 AM.
    Cherry x

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    Quote Originally Posted by tess1981 View Post
    In our local primary school we are asked not to teach children how to read etc before school as they learn the phonics alphabet and most parents were not getting the letter sound correct. We will soon be teaching them different languages and stuff while they are in the womb.
    Cm'S really are getting a slating lately.
    One of my 4 year old mindees can sit and write his name and likes watching Jolly Phonics on utube but neither of things are following HIS interest which is being an explorer - I only have him one day a week but we spend that day mostly out in the woods - he can identify and name about 20 different plants and trees - mostly taught to him by me as most parents admit that they can't tell the difference between a daisy and a dandelion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hectors house View Post

    One of my 4 year old mindees can sit and write his name and likes watching Jolly Phonics on utube but neither of things are following HIS interest which is being an explorer - I only have him one day a week but we spend that day mostly out in the woods - he can identify and name about 20 different plants and trees - mostly taught to him by me as most parents admit that they can't tell the difference between a daisy and a dandelion.
    Likewise. I have 3 mindees starting school in sept. 2 can write their name and recognise/write most of the alphabet, count and recognise numbers to 20 and in fact count far beyond. They are very articulate. However both also love to be out and about playing in the woods. My 3rd mindee only comes 1 day a week. ..The other 4 are spent at a very academic school nursery ... LO can recognise name and write first letter. Can count and does recognise numerals to 5 but other than that is totally un interested and just wants to construct paint and play outside.

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    I got angry the moment the sharp-suited BBC Breakfast presenter, Charlie 'No Fit' Stayt, opened his thick barman's mouth and declared, "When parents leave their child with a nursery or CM, they want to know they will be cared for and taught the things they need to be ready for school" (I'm paraphrasing, but that was pretty much it.)

    Given the media's love of 'free speech' and the government's passion for 'choice', do parents really have to be constantly told what they want like this? Does anybody believe they want their children to be schooled from the womb like this? No. But if you keep saying it, parents start acting like it from a mixture of parental angst and guilt that their child will fall behind if they're not shoved into this infernal system of hot-housing them through the University of Toddlerdom, when all they really want is to be cared for and given the chance to have a childhood.

    I also hate the way we get sucked into it all. We can object as much as we like, but if we don't toe the line, then we're seen as part of the problem and we're "failing the children". And don't we just get drawn into it oh so easily by the lure of wanting to be seen as "Early Years Professionals" ?

    Sadly, we are being led by the nose ever farther away from what parents (our paying clients) actually want, and what children actually need. Maybe this is why I'm never offended by the "glorified babysitter" comments. I'd far rather be that than the person who forces children to abandon their childhood to enter the rat race the moment they can walk.
    Last edited by bunyip; 03-04-2014 at 07:55 AM.

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    Did any of you see the interview with Gill Jones EY from Ofsted?

    She talked sense and was at the meeting last week with Truss and Truss effectively blanked he! She spoke a lot of sense and said it was the under privileged 2year olds they were most concerned about and needed to get into high quality care which were childminders and nurseries. She said they needed to play with playdough, get outside and do all the things children need to do and not sit at desks.

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    And another thing..........

    The TV piece kept banging on about children in 'disadvantaged' areas being least likely to achieve. Now it rather assumed this is entirely due to those children having cr4p nurseries and cr4p CMs, without presenting any evidence to support that assumption. Although I guess that's some sort of progress from the usual assumption that they're genetically disposed to failure on account of their parents being morally-repugnant wastrels who deserve nothing out of life if they can't be bothered to go to a good school, but at least we need someone to do the cleaning and sweep the streets/work the mines, cotton mills, etc. You know, the good ol' Victorian values which coupled with centuries of slavery to make Britain Great.

    I mean, is it just possible that the nurseries/CMs are doing a perfectly good job but those disadvantaged children aren't coming into contact with them? Why on Earth should they when the failure of successive UK regimes to provide a working economy means their parents have no jobs and no hope of gaining work - so why send the child out when they can be cared for at home?

    Maybe it's simpler than that. Maybe these children are already written off by a system that lets them be disadvantaged and live in poverty, because it's geared up towards the super-rich classes who obviously deserve their wealth on account of: having rich parents; gambling with other people's money; doing -all whilst other people work for them; being able to sing for 3 minutes; being able to kick/hit/catch a ball or run round in circles rather well.............

    Priorities, eh.....?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rickysmiths View Post
    Did any of you see the interview with Gill Jones EY from Ofsted?

    She talked sense and was at the meeting last week with Truss and Truss effectively blanked he! She spoke a lot of sense and said it was the under privileged 2year olds they were most concerned about and needed to get into high quality care which were childminders and nurseries. She said they needed to play with playdough, get outside and do all the things children need to do and not sit at desks.
    I am afraid that Gill Jones has probably visited very few settings where this is everyday good practice

    We know there is poor practice out there so it would be better to address that and not make sweeping statements about EY in general and those who, against all the odds, try their very best
    No one denies that some need to improve but until HMCI is able to engage and listen with us his report will do nothing
    He should stop the DfE from cutting funding and removing support from those who need it most

    To be told that 'the least able should not teach the most vulnerable' by Gill Jones is not just offensive but insulting...
    if some cms are not delivering good quality care why exclude them from being qualified at Level 3? why take away LA support? why abandon independent cms to fend for themselves?


    Judging by the reaction this morning on twitter we are all enraged but what will words do?
    This has got nothing to do with education...this is politics at its very worst....this is a drive to put children in schools to save money and lower cost of childcare
    we now know who is driving all the reforms in EY and EYFS...not the DfE but HMCI himself...he should put his own house in order
    Oh and lets not forget the general election!!.

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    Why is it assumed that just because parents are unemployed children are not achieving their potential. I have minded children from single parent and unemployed families, they were just were the should be on the early outcomes, valued and happy . I wish people wouldn't judge by income.

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    I emailed Jeremy vine at radio 2 earlier. Maybe they will cover it.

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    Here is the Ofsted report...you will clearly see what the agenda is...Ofsted driving policy rather that regulate the provision
    Schools are better, pupil premium to go to schools, 2 year olds will do better in schools and yet...78% of providers are now good/outstanding...childcare system is a mess etc etc etc

    Ofsted | Ofsted Early Years Annual Report 2012/13

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    Why do Nuseries and Childminders always get lumped together in the same headlines? There is a world of difference.

    I heard this on Five Live this morning that we were being criticized again this time for children starting school not being able to speak. The lady talking about it said children were arriving at school unable to speak because they had never been spoken to or had always had a dummy in their mouth. WHAT? What has this got to do with Nurseries and Childminders? I guess this must happen in some homes but surely this is an issue of neglect by parents (not child care providers) and should be investigated by social services.

    I always take the dummies out when the babies arrive and leave them in the bag till home time.


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    I take dummies too... They get them at sleep time or if they are very cranky and upset.
    My sil let's her son have it all day and he is for playschool in September and speech is delayed. He is not in a cm or nursery so who does the professionals blame there.
    And we do talk to the children. We are on our own mostly all day so off course we talk and interact with the children. How else would they get to understand the running of . my home or how would I know what they want.
    Tess1981

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    "He will add: "What children facing serious disadvantage need is high-quality, early education from the age of two, delivered by skilled practitioners with degrees in a setting that parents can recognise and access easily. These already exist. They are called schools." "

    It will be very interesting to see all these graduates who are willing to work with young children from very difficult family situations on the pittance the government is offering. Teaching them in a school setting with no sleep/rest area required. Have the people making these changes ever been anywhere near a tired, hungry/ non toilet trained two year old?? Who's early influences have often been very negative/frightening/abusive.

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    I think he's missing the point. Parents have a duty to help their child develop the skills they need to start school. A responsible parent, whatever their background is, will do this. All nurseries and childminders can do is add to these skills (if these kids even attend such places). What we do for these children is next to useless if parent's are not doing their job too. This just gives irresponsible parents permission to carry on being irresponsible.

    It's not addressing the real problem.

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    Ah yes but as changes to secondary schools are happening where its becoming looked down on children doing art, music, dance pe.

    Start them early in school stop any sort of creativity reading writing and maths are the only thing that matters and it will stop any child from wanting to do anything creative.

    Where will our musicans, writers etc come from. Its a sad state of affairs for any child 0-18 years old
    When someone tells you nothing is impossible, tell them to go slam a revolving door

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