Today in Parliament

[Smiley]

Today between 11.30 and 12.15 Ofsted, ncma and daycare Trust. I will be on a nursery run!!
Parliament Live TV » what's on

[Maza]

Interesting! Wonder if DD will let me watch.

[AgentTink]

Thanks for this i know what i will be watching on the ipad whilst serving lunch today

[lozzy23]

Thanks for this i know what i will be watching on the ipad whilst serving lunch today

Me too, although need to go out on playgroup run at 12.10, will miss the finale.

[shortstuff]

thanks, ive put it on now in the vague hope i will hear some.

[teacake2]

Its talking about violence against women at the moment
Teacake1

[lisbet]

Thanks for posting that link

I thought the NCMA chief-exec did very well not to lose her temper with the Osfted EY director as she kept claiming that childminders were inferior to group care

ETA: And that guy who asked why the NCMA thought a 3hr inspection every 3 years was so good?! A. If you consider that schools and nurseries get a 2 day inspection every 3 years to cover a much bigger number of people/ paperwork etc, then childminders inspections are more robust! and B. All we know about agencies is that they will remove individual inspections, we have no guarantee that they will monitor more closely than the current Ofsted system - especially since they are going to need to be self funding, so quality may well slide!

[AgentTink]

Its talking about violence against women at the moment
Teacake1

Teacake I think you are on the wrong channel it is on a live stream on the internet, its in a room called The Boothroyd Room.. try this link on your computer

Player

It has finished currently,but you can rewatch it

[shortstuff]

Thanks AgentTink,

I'm obviously watching the wrong one too.

[AgentTink]

Thanks for posting that link

I thought the NCMA chief-exec did very well not to lose her temper with the Osfted EY director as she kept claiming that childminders were inferior to group care

I know, Sue Gregory just kept stating that too many children were entering school, "not school ready", and laying the blame at childminders door for this. Ofsted just keep using the stats that show less childminders have good or outstanding when compared to nurseries/pre-schools. they always fail to mention that 3x more children on in satisfactory pre-schools/nurseries when compared to childminders

Ofsted also fail to realise that not that many childminders offer FEEF so actually the majority of 3/4 years old get their FEEF in nurseries/pre-schools so surely a lot of the blame of children not being school ready is not our fault.

I could on but too angry right now. Im sure the transcript will be ready later on today

[Kiddleywinks]

Thanks for posting that link

I thought the NCMA chief-exec did very well not to lose her temper with the Osfted EY director as she kept claiming that childminders were inferior to group care

Liz was shaking her head so much I thought it was gonna fall off!
So, Ofsted are pushing for this as the inspectorate, because of course they're doing such a fine job at the moment aren't they?!
Grrrr!

At least the committee kept mentioning the lack of detail, and cost implications which are still as yet unknown.

Fuming.com
But big thanks to childcare trust and ncma for fighting our corner

[Kiddleywinks]

I made notes (badly I might add as I was getting incensed at Sue Gregory) but, until the transcript becomes available:

The agency model is not ofsted's remit
The marketplace is to be allowed to develop the model
Agencies will be held to account
Same regulations as now
Government is trying to square the circle
Too many children despite funding are still not ready for school (CM's are being blamed for this!)

Liz Bayram (NCMA)
On Tuesday Liz Truss implied half of cm's had been driven out
NCMA do not agree with that statistic, there has been a drop, but not as much as half.
Gave different explanations for that drop
ICM campaign showed not pleased with agencies
also showed that individual inspections were wanted by parents AND cm's

Sue Gregory said that compared to nursery and pre schools cm quality is lower, reasons given was lack of support and training
NCMA agreed that there are challenges, but this is across ALL settings not just cm's (Government cuts!)
That there were lots of other interventions to be considered rather than agencies

Peter Grigg Family and Parenting Institute (Daycare trust?)
Not convinced agencies will drive down costs
Someone has to pay - charge parents a fee? Charge cm's? Neither of which will reduce costs
Wants to see more details on agencies as it currently isn't there and that's a concern

Committee confirm detail is not there and this a concern for them too (YAAAAAY! Someone's noticed!!)

Osted want agencies and are supporting this bill

it was pointed out that what's missing is the ability to see how agencies will benefit, that the LA deliver much of what's proposed by agencies, the structure's are already in place - the funding isn't

Some evidence that interaction is more available at cm settings
Not convinced the agencies model will increase cm’s due to as yet unknown costs

Ofsted say preschools and nurseries are better for under two’s!!
But there is no inspection regime that can confirm that (stooped woman)

Q. Agencies are voluntary, what do high quality providers have to fear
NCMA: There are concerns about unintended circumstances
Training – must join agencies to receive training
Two tier system
Fears over business sustainability

Q. What are your recommendations?

Liz - No agencies at this point
There are other quality improvement in the pipeline

Peter agrees with liz – do not remove current system whilst pilots go ahead

Sue – cm agencies – given that they’re not compulsory absolutely support the trial
Huge potential to support cms


At this point I couldn't follow what was being said as I was getting annoyed sorry

[SYLVIA]

I didn't hear it but I'm getting annoyed just reading this thread!

[Tunja]

I didn't hear it but I'm getting annoyed just reading this thread!

Lords can make amendments to this bill at 2nd reading, committee stage and 3rd reading and ping pong this back and forwards afterwards with the house of commons until they agree.

So who do we know in the house of lords we can lean on. Oops I mean provide appropriate information to.

Tunja

[Kiddleywinks]

Just a thought, but has there been any kind of comparison done regarding % allocation of under 5's to the various sectors

Nursery's and pre schools are allowed more children per setting than childminders so if that was converted into 'who has the largest quota of children under 5' then surely THAT would determine if CM's are to blame for the lack of school readiness, or if the liability lies more with children attending larger settings - which I personally believe is probably more the case. I have a pre schooler that's learnt more in the 2 months he's been here than he has at pre school (so mum says)

[AgentTink]

Just a thought, but has there been any kind of comparison done regarding % allocation of under 5's to the various sectors

Nursery's and pre schools are allowed more children per setting than childminders so if that was converted into 'who has the largest quota of children under 5' then surely THAT would determine if CM's are to blame for the lack of school readiness, or if the liability lies more with children attending larger settings - which I personally believe is probably more the case. I have a pre schooler that's learnt more in the 2 months he's been here than he has at pre school (so mum says)

The figures are something like 1.2 million children attend a nursery and 250,000 children attend a childminders. (these are rough guess i will find exact figures for you in a minute)

The point that you have made is the point that i have sent to MP's in my letter....
"Why is the government not letting this fact be known? All that is ever in the press from the Government is how on Ofsted’s grades we are roughly about 10% lower than nurseries.

This may be true on simple facts such as 61% of Childminders obtained a good or outstanding whereas 71% of nurseries obtained the same. But if this broken down another way 39% of satisfactory Childminders deal with approximately 60,000 children, whereas a head count at satisfactory nurseries is almost triple the amount at 170,000 children."

[AgentTink]

Exact figures as follows from the Ofsted Report 2011/2012

Childminders 56,085 - No of places for children - 283,321
Nursery/Pre-School etc 25,695 - No of places for children - 1,028,145

Report can be found here
Ofsted | The Annual Report of Her Majesty's Chief Inspector of Education, Children's Services and Skills 2011/12

[gingerjames1]

Just watched some of this back. And cannot believe what the woman from ofsted is saying, that children are not meeting the standard before entering school, and putting the blame on childminders? Hello every child i have is at the top end of the scale after arriving at the bottom. I am in a disadvantaged part of london and i can tell you now the reason why all these children are falling is due to POOR PARENTING. And this is where the government should be wasting there money on, not stupid agencies. And if id have been liz from the NCMA i would of nutted her!!!! Talk about get you in a mood before the school run!!!

Sent from my iPhone using Childminding Forum

[zippy]

Just watched some of this back. And cannot believe what the woman from ofsted is saying, that children are not meeting the standard before entering school, and putting the blame on childminders? Hello every child i have is at the top end of the scale after arriving at the bottom. I am in a disadvantaged part of london and i can tell you now the reason why all these children are falling is due to POOR PARENTING. And this is where the government should be wasting there money on, not stupid agencies. And if id have been liz from the NCMA i would of nutted her!!!! Talk about get you in a mood before the school run!!!

Sent from my iPhone using Childminding Forum

I'd like to know if she's assuming every child who hasn't been to nursery is a childminder child, or is it that they've had no childcare at all, sounds weird to me.

[tori4]

Hi is it poss to watch this back now? And if poss via tablet or iPhone as computer gone to computer hospital to be fixed again!!

Would really like to see what was said.