Total cost - MM or NCMA

[claireodon]

Hi, currently pre-reg and I'm weighing up whether to get insurance through MM or NCMA at the moment. :confused: I'm trying to add up the total costs of everything I'll need to buy in addition to the insurance policy. Can anyone list the paperwork I'll need to buy - contracts, attendance register - anything else?!

[Daftbat]

Contract
Attendance Reg
Accounts Book
Child Record Form
Receipt Book
Accident book

I changed to MM after years with NCMA.

There are pros and cons with both but having minded for quite a long time i felt confident doing my own contracts etc. I do my accounts on Excel and back up on to a disc which will then go in with my receipts in a folder in the loft.

I also made my own attendance sheets and payment record sheets. It takes a while to do but once its done thats it.

However, you may find it easier to use NCMA records initially whilst you are finding your feet.

You can buy receipt books and accident books from elsewhere.

[jellytot]

I have just re done NCMA membership but thought it is getting expensive. How much is MM, also could I use NCMA paperwork with MM. This is all for next yr now but your views appreiciated,


so sorry Claire for butting in on your thread


Claire xx

[rickysmiths]

Hello there. Well its always been a no brainer for me I must confess. NCMA everytime.

NCMA Public Liability insurance is £23pa
NCMA Employers Insurace is £5pa

MM for Pub lib and Employees (they incl even if you don't need it) is £40pa

Yes you have to pay a membership fee for NCMA which is £48pa

Paperwork from NCMA is a bit cheaper for member than MM is.

NCMA is a non-profit making Charity that works for Childminders in many ways representing our views to local authorties and Government.

I was at an NCMA Regional Forum meeting on Saturday and met Susanna Dawson, the Chair of NCMA, what a lovely down to earth working Childminder she is. She is using EYFS 3 days a week so she understands and can represent all the concerns and issues.
I have attended Forums where we have been able to quiz the Tax man, Mrs Ofsted etc etc.

NCMA have a helpline for us, not just the legal things but anything that you may want to querry on the cm front. Our parents can also call them for help and advise.

MM are a profit making company and offer none of the support above.

You could get:

Attendance Register £8.15
Contracts £7.85 for six
Accounts Book £8.35per ann
Accident, Incident and Medication Folder £10.99 I've used 4 in 15 yrs
Child Record Forms £5.70 for 6

You do have to use the NCMA Contracts if you ever need to be represented by the legal people and in these cases they usually ask for copies of your signed Register.

[Daftbat]

I think using the NCMA in the beginning is great for new childminders as their paperwork is very good.

As time has gone on i have felt that i do not get value for money from my membership with NCMA. I have never had to use their legal department and feel happy going through the small claims court myself if the need arises.

Its up to the individual whatever suits them best.

[HELEN10]

As Rickysmith says you do need to use ncma contracts to be represented by their legal department. However, with mm you do not also they have a very good legal department as when i had a parent who left owing me 4 weeks notice fees. They acted immediately and the full amount was in my bank within the week!

You do not have to us their contracts to be represented by mm, you can just draft up your own.

HELEN 10

[Chatterbox Childcare]

I have had great service from both companies but I have returned to NCMA because they have our best interests at heart and they represent us well.

Their insurance also allows more children to be covered under your policy and that helps me in the school holidays. NCMA also allow children over 8 outside without supervision which at age 8 is a bit young for me but at age 11+ is a godsend.

[zippy]

hiya

i'd go mm every time, their stuff is fine, all i buy from them now is contracts and reciepts photocopy rest.

[venus89]

Do you get access to NCMA training without membership to NCMA? Or could you potentially have MM insurance and NCMA membership to access the training, network etc?

(I'm NCMA btw)

[The Juggler]

thing is if everyone went mm, NCMA would have no money and they wouldn't be there to do the research, lobbying and promotion etc they do for us.

They promote us as a form of childcare, to parents and the government, they lobby government and ofsted on our behalf (without them we'd now be paying a fortune (£125) for our Ofsted registration), provide LA's with training courses and it is through them and their advice that LA's make decisions about providing local networks which support us, if we join them.

They are fighting to improve the quality of care all childminders provide by lobbying for better support and training for us. Morton Michel are not going to do that,.

[rickysmiths]

thing is if everyone went mm, NCMA would have no money and they wouldn't be there to do the research, lobbying and promotion etc they do for us.

They promote us as a form of childcare, to parents and the government, they lobby government and ofsted on our behalf (without them we'd now be paying a fortune (£125) for our Ofsted registration), provide LA's with training courses and it is through them and their advice that LA's make decisions about providing local networks which support us, if we join them.

They are fighting to improve the quality of care all childminders provide by lobbying for better support and training for us. Morton Michel are not going to do that,.

Well said:clapping: :clapping: :clapping:

[Rach30]

I feel bad now for going with MM after i've just read wht NCMA do for us :blush: NCMA next yr for me !!!!:clapping:

[The Juggler]

I feel bad now for going with MM after i've just read wht NCMA do for us :blush: NCMA next yr for me !!!!:clapping:

never meant to make you feel bad but same with any charity really. It is cheaper at mm but NCMA is our little contribution for the things that come our way or the improvements for children that come about when poor practice is changed because of recommendations NCMA make.

I understand, we all have to go for the cheaper option some times when finances are tight!

[naomiesian]

Hi, currently pre-reg and I'm weighing up whether to get insurance through MM or NCMA at the moment. :confused: I'm trying to add up the total costs of everything I'll need to buy in addition to the insurance policy. Can anyone list the paperwork I'll need to buy - contracts, attendance register - anything else?!

Hi, im pre-reg at the moment but looked into insurance and im going to use MM, at the moment they offer an `Easy minder package` It costs £126.00 and includes 1yr insurance,fire blanket, carry case, binders, contracts,monthly planner, child records, weekly attendance records, payment receipts, financial records, medication/treatment records, accident/ incident records, observation/cause for concern records, childminding contracts and polices and procedures, you dont have to pay a membership fee each year and the insurance is £40.00 a year, as I`ve already paid out so much myself as there are no grants/funding available to help, I have decided this is the better option for me at this time. good luck. x

[buildingblocks]

Hard one this and I can see both sides of the coin so to speak.

I am NCMA and will always be but for selfish reasons. If I remember rightly insurance wise they are roughly the same. What bumps the price up is the NCMA membership and that is what I pay for really (even if occasionally I get frustrated with them).

I spent 20 years working as a nanny and wanting to be classed as a professional childcarer. I was a qualified NNEB who chose to go down the nannying line rather than work in a nursery. Nursery nurses have a professional association called PANN (not sure if it is still the same). As a qualified Nursery Nurse I was unable to join as I worked as a nanny which I felt really strongly about but won't go into that. I could be an associate member but have none of the frills so to speak.

When I became a childminder it meant at long last i could belong to an association that worked on our behalf and though some may disagree that the NCMA do this I still do believe they do work hard on our behalf.

I do think the NCMA should let us use our own paperwork etc. and afraid I use only their contracts which I know means that if I end up going to court I probably won't get help as I don't use their other paperwork.

But I still believe that at the heart of things they are working for CM's although I know many will disagree and because of this I will be a member of the NCMA.

Sorry this probably still doesn't help you any but thought I would give you my reasons for belonging

[singlewiththree]

I use MM however the box they come in I don't find much use because you can't lock it. Apparently the NCMA one has a hole in the fastener so that you can put a padlock through it. Which means that I have to take all my MM contracts etc out and put them in a different filing cabinet.

I do prefer the layout of the MM contracts, but when these have gone I plan to do my own.

[nic76]

Hello there. Well its always been a no brainer for me I must confess. NCMA everytime.

NCMA Public Liability insurance is £23pa
NCMA Employers Insurace is £5pa

MM for Pub lib and Employees (they incl even if you don't need it) is £40pa

Yes you have to pay a membership fee for NCMA which is £48pa

Paperwork from NCMA is a bit cheaper for member than MM is.

NCMA is a non-profit making Charity that works for Childminders in many ways representing our views to local authorties and Government.

I was at an NCMA Regional Forum meeting on Saturday and met Susanna Dawson, the Chair of NCMA, what a lovely down to earth working Childminder she is. She is using EYFS 3 days a week so she understands and can represent all the concerns and issues.
I have attended Forums where we have been able to quiz the Tax man, Mrs Ofsted etc etc.

NCMA have a helpline for us, not just the legal things but anything that you may want to querry on the cm front. Our parents can also call them for help and advise.

MM are a profit making company and offer none of the support above.

You could get:

Attendance Register £8.15
Contracts £7.85 for six
Accounts Book £8.35per ann
Accident, Incident and Medication Folder £10.99 I've used 4 in 15 yrs
Child Record Forms £5.70 for 6

You do have to use the NCMA Contracts if you ever need to be represented by the legal people and in these cases they usually ask for copies of your signed Register.

just got this from ncma website its gone up


Childminder membership
I would like NCMA childminder membership at £63.00 for 12 months
plus public liability insurance at £23.00 inclusive of IPT for 12 months.*
Total incl. PLI £86.00

i refuse to pay that gonna go with mm for £41

[Sally G]

Contract
Attendance Reg
Accounts Book
Child Record Form
Receipt Book
Accident book

I changed to MM after years with NCMA.

There are pros and cons with both but having minded for quite a long time i felt confident doing my own contracts etc. I do my accounts on Excel and back up on to a disc which will then go in with my receipts in a folder in the loft.

I also made my own attendance sheets and payment record sheets. It takes a while to do but once its done thats it.

However, you may find it easier to use NCMA records initially whilst you are finding your feet.

You can buy receipt books and accident books from elsewhere.

thats great advise thanks x:clapping:

[Chatterbox Childcare]

I know that MM is cheaper but it is always NCMA for me as they do something for the membership fee.

As a support workeer I would say try NCMA for the first year and that will give you a good grounding for the accounts as the layout is simple and easy to follow and then if you want the cheaper option go with it next year.

I know why people use MM but what will they do when the fees are proposed to increase next time? Will they act on behalf of the childminder? I think not.

Without NCMA we will not have anyone fighting for childminders.

[Madminder]

just got this from ncma website its gone up
Childminder membership
I would like NCMA childminder membership at £63.00 for 12 months
plus public liability insurance at £23.00 inclusive of IPT for 12 months.*
Total incl. PLI £86.00
i refuse to pay that gonna go with mm for £41

But you have to also look at the cost of items in the shop Nic as there are considerable discounts for members and that needs to be taken into account when you do a comparison.

I know that sometimes it does come down to cost on the day but if you can afford it then NCMA is by far the best choice. Most people would think nothing of paying union dues out of their salary as they know what they get in return and, in effect NCMA are our union. They work entirely for our benefit and support and not for profit and they have been instrumental in getting us recognised as professional childcarers by both local and national government as well as parents.

Without the money they get from membership fees they would not be able to do this, especially as funding from others sources is getting harder to obtain in the current financial situation.

I am an NCMA member and volunteer and always will be. I have issues with not being able to use their legal service if you don't use their contracts but, to be honest, I found it very easy to use the small claims court when I had a problem with a parent. The difficult bit is actually getting the money after the court rules in your favour and NCMA do not help with that bit anyway!

You can, if you choose, be an NCMA member but get your insurance and documentation elsewhere, but why would you? Once you have paid for your membership the other stuff is roughly the same price! We get loads of support from NCMA so why not give some back?