Confused with my numbers

[Rasharoon]

At the moment, I mind:

2 x 9 year olds

1 x 8 year old

2 x 4 year olds (not 5 until July & August this year)
And my own children:

1 x 9 year old

1 x 5 year old

Now I've had an enquiry about an 18 month old for 2 mornings per week which isn't a problem but during school holidays, it may be that I will need to mind the Sister who I believe is 4 (will be 5 in the Summer). As one of the 4 year olds I look after is term time only, am I still within my numbers and when they all turn 5 (in the summer) - I'll no doubt be over my registration numbers. I'm not sure I'm making sense but my registration allows me to care five under 8's with no more than 3 being under 5 and only 1 being under 12 months.

I could be answering my own question but once they are all 5 years old in the summer - I'll have 4 five year olds (including my own and he isn't 6 until October) but one of them is term time which (I think), means I have the space for the 18 month old's sister. Am I there?

Can someone help as I've the parent coming round on Monday and I'm confusing myself. Thanks.

[Banana]

Oh heck,

Im confused too. I think if you just have the 5 year olds then it would be ok?? as long as you were still caring for no more than 5 under 8's. I could be wrong though, I'd call ofsted and clarify with them.

Good luck, im sure someone esle will be more help

xx

[Rubybubbles]

The best thing to do is write it all down in front of you, (maybe do a ratio thingy, it's been meantioned recently) and you'll be able to 'see' does that make sense??

I got confused in the past as I had 2 4yr old that counted as 5's as in full time school:huh: one 16 months and a baby it was all okay but understand where you are coming from !!

[Rasharoon]

Thank you.
Any ideas where the 'Ratio' thingy is. I've had a look around but nothing is jumping out.

[berkschick]

I THINK you will be ok!

You are allowed 5 under 8 and you currently have 1 x 8 and 2 x 4 so you have 2 under 8 spaces left which is what this Mum is after! ( none of that includes your own children!)

Love

Debbie

[ruby]

i think looking at your numbers you are okay as you will have 4 over 8
4 5yrs and one 18months

you are registered for 3 under 5 and 3 5-8 yrs but as you have not filled all your under 5 places you can use these spaces for 5-8 yrs

hope you can understand this


cathy

[berkschick]

Ignore that, thats not right is it??!!

Im confussed too! Doesnt take much though :rolleyes:

I think you will be ok because one 4 year old is replaced with the other during the holidays so thats worked out well!

Are any of the 4 year olds at school full time yet? Because if they are then they would be counted at 5 year olds anyway.

Love

Debbie

[Banana]

Some memebers have there own charts which you could ask to have a look at... forgotten where the thread is now... think the main childminding section in chat.

Otherwise just do a spreadsheet with your days and mindees written out then you can see if its making sense

xx

[Rasharoon]

Thanks all for the replying.

My two current 4 year olds and my 5 year old all go to school full time. I know I'm ok with the 18 month old (if goes ahead) as I've no children rom 9.00am till 3.00pm. It's just the holidays I'm thinking about.

As the 4 years old go to school full time - do they then move into the older category of 5 to 8?

Oh god - I'm confusing myself totally. I feel a call to Ofsted coming on but I'll write everything out first.

[berkschick]

Yes, if they are at school full time then they are classed as 5 - 8 year olds.

You are ok!

Love

Debbie

[miffy]

I got very confused reading this!!!

But i think you are OK

Have a look on the bromley website for a grid

www.bromleycma.org.uk

Then you can put it all down and double check

Miffy xx

[ruby]

hi Debbie

we are with the c.s.s.i.w so we might be different from ofsted

we were registered for 4 under 5 and 3- 5-8yrs but applied for a variance
for 5 under 5 and 2 5-8 yrs
i spoke to our inspector and asked that if we did not fill all our under 5 could we take a 5-8 she said yes as long as we did not have more than 7 under 8

just assumed it was the same for you
sorry for the mix up

cathy

[berkschick]

Hi Cathy,

I was saying to ignore my post above as I got it wrong! Then you and I posted at the same time and your post ended up in between my posts making it look like I was saying to ignore you! Oh the joys of the internet hahaha :panic:

Sorry, no offense meant. :)
Love

Debbie

[ruby]

that's okay
no offence taken:)
but i forget that we are with different authorities(think that is the word)
and that you might do things differently

cathy

[berkschick]

I think Ofsted are the same regarding the 5-8 thing. I know a minder who only minds before and after school and uses all her spaces for this so even though her certificate says she may mind no more than 6 children at any one time, of which no more than 3 can be under 5 and no more than 1 under 1, she minds 6 5 - 8 year olds.

It is all very confussing isnt it?!

Love

Debbie

[ruby]

yes it can get very confusing at times

cathy

[Rasharoon]

Well I've just called Ofsted and I'm even more confused than when I started out. Even the guy I spoke to wasn't sure how to work my numbers out so I now have to sit here and write a letter to the Inspection Support Team.
I was under the impression that because my two 4 year olds went to school full time, they would fall into the 5-8 age bracket. I was told no, they are still in the under 5's so if I take on a 18mth old and her sister (who is 4 and for holidays), I would be over my numbers.
Let's hope I can put a letter together that makes sense.
Thanks all for replying.

[miffy]

I don't think the person you talked to is correct

I have just checked my standards for you and it says

Standard 2, 2.4 Childminder:Child ratios

"Children aged 4 attending ten early education sessions a week may be classed as children over 5 years for the purpose of the adult-child ratio"

Hope that helps

Miffy xx

[mrsbumbles]

Your right Miffy. My mindees are counted as in the 5-8yr bracket when they attend school full time after the October half term break, untill then they are in 0-4yr bracket because they only attend school part-time.

[Rasharoon]

Thanks for looking that up Miffy. You've confirmed what I thought. I've put my letter together that I'm about to print outlining the ages of the children I currently look after and the days/times I have them and what the standards state.
By my calculations then and where my registration says I can care for no more than 5 children under 8 and not more than three may be under 5 years, as all my mindees currently go to school and I'm free from 9.00am to 3.00pm - I could technically have 3 under 5's running riot - is that right???? (aaaarrrrggghhhhhhh).
I'm off to get a cup of tea and stop thinking about this - my pee brain in aching.

[miffy]

I hope you've made me a cup of tea too :)

I've just been back through your posts and written it all down. If I have read things properly then there is no problem and you are within your numbers.

So correct me if I'm wrong - you are registered for 5 under 8 as you have a 5yo of your own (total 6 under 8)

You mind 2 x 4 year old boys (they are 5yo in 07/08 and 08/08) - both attend FT school

One of these children only comes term time

The enquiry is for 1 x 18month old two mornings a week

In school holidays her 4yo sister (5yo in summer 08) needs a place

The 2x 4yo boys are counted in your 6 -8yo numbers as they are at school full time leaving you space for 3x under 5's (now I can't remember if your 5yo is also in fte) so there is no problem

I wouldn't even bother writing to Ofsted

Miffy xx

[ruby]

hi i asked this question a couple of weeks ago about 4yrs going to school full time and counting in your 5-8yrs you were all very helpful.
but i emailed ofsted and had a reply back from a Jonathan Phipps

i quote
i can confirm that 4year olds that are in full time education ( 9am until 3pm, 5 days a week ) can be classed as risings 5's. This basically means that you can class them in your 5-8 brackets

hope this helps

cathy and rachel

[sarah707]

By my calculations then and where my registration says I can care for no more than 5 children under 8 and not more than three may be under 5 years, as all my mindees currently go to school and I'm free from 9.00am to 3.00pm - I could technically have 3 under 5's running riot - is that right????

That looks right to me! :D

[Rasharoon]

Thanks Miffy for sitting there going through all my numbers. Yes, you have it spot on so thanks for taking the time and effort to go through it.
Having only just got onto the computer, I posted my letter on Friday so I'll see what Ofsted come back and say and will let you all know.
I'm meeting the Mum tomorrow about the 18 months old so will you know how it goes.
Thank you all.

[SARAHW26]

If Ofsted can't get it right, is there any hope for us???????

I was told at my Reg visit that 4 year olds who are full-time at school are classed in your 5 - 8 year numbers. So I would say yes you could have these children.

Hope that helps

sarah

[miffy]

Will keep my fingers crossed for you tomorrow

Miffy xx