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Simona
11-07-2013, 07:44 PM
This is what is going to be expected on EY Teachers and EY Educators

Do you agree with the aspirations of the new qualifications??
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/childcare-qualifications-overhaul

SammySplodger
11-07-2013, 08:08 PM
This is what is going to be expected on EY Teachers and EY Educators

Do you agree with the aspirations of the new qualifications??
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/childcare-qualifications-overhaul

Nope - load of gumph!

Many of the (lovely) 'academic' folks I know are utterly lacking in common sense and are unable to change a nappy without covering themselves in poo. I have experienced this first hand (not pleasant). I know several fantastic Childminders without ANY formal qualifications from school or higher education. Sincerely hope we don't lose the latter and end up with the former.

Really getting fed up with all this now :-(.

SammySplodger
11-07-2013, 08:21 PM
So, assuming this applies to us (CMs are mentioned as being entrusted with a child's brain by Ms Truss), what happens if you are an existing CM and you don't have all the GCSEs or their 'equivalents'?

I have 9 O levels 1 GCSE, 3 A levels and a degree... but I don't happen to have a Science O level pass - failed Physics and got a D. Do the other exams passed make up for this?! There is absolutely NO WAY on earth I'm doing a Science GCSE at 42 years of age, which has absolutely no relevance whatsoever to my job.

Sorry to rant - but I'm feeling a bit cross!
:-@

CLL
11-07-2013, 09:43 PM
When I read that all my mind keeps repeating is. Where is the fun? I don't think they will have a good balance of play versus formal learning, I think it will swing widely to teaching And new teachers/educators will not be shown how to play, only teach. Thus they will lack the fundamental skills to play and undervalue its importance. I can imagine 20 little people all lined up chanting nursery rhymes and counting to 10 in unison!

SammySplodger
11-07-2013, 09:59 PM
When I read that all my mind keeps repeating is. Where is the fun? I don't think they will have a good balance of play versus formal learning, I think it will swing widely to teaching And new teachers/educators will not be shown how to play, only teach. Thus they will lack the fundamental skills to play and undervalue its importance. I can imagine 20 little people all lined up chanting nursery rhymes and counting to 10 in unison!

Yes that's what Truss loves so much about France...

Bumble Beez
12-07-2013, 05:00 AM
This is what is going to be expected on EY Teachers and EY Educators

Do you agree with the aspirations of the new qualifications??
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/childcare-qualifications-overhaul

Oh for heavens sake...here we go again! Just leave it all alone...
Suppose we should be used to this by now!

Sarah x

starschildmind
12-07-2013, 05:36 AM
Ooo i have to say im 50:50 with this....

I studied child dev at school. Went to college to get my childcare and early years qualification and have worked in childcare since then.

Now i have mum at baby group that has worked in retail all her life and now saying. Oo i know i will be a childminder. This is a parent who gets really cross with her own child and gets quite agrivated by other children. She has very little understanding of how a babys brain works. The cognitive development.
I also know childminders that are near inadequate. These are childminders who have no previous childcare qualification who decided to become a cm for ease.

I also know childminders who are VERY good and have no other qualifications and these would have to miss out.

This is why im 50:50. I do think that people who have been cm a long time should be left out of this if their ofsted is a good or outstanding.

It does bug mw when people.become cms 'because its easy' as we know how hard it is. This will help sort the ones who are keen to help a baby progress in all areas.. not just the ones who do it for the money.

Sorry if my oppioion offends anyone :( xx

Chatterbox Childcare
12-07-2013, 07:37 AM
This was the exact subject at PACEY forums in May and at the South West one it over a resounding no to GCSE's but am entrance test as many older people coming into childminding may not have these and wouldn't want to go back to college to get them, yet they could pass an entrance exam

NOTE : this is a requirement for NEW childminders and not existing ones, so you don't have any hoops to jump through or rumaging through the loft for your proof of GCSE's unless you want to take further qualifications as listed.

emma04
12-07-2013, 07:57 AM
Ooo i have to say im 50:50 with this....

I studied child dev at school. Went to college to get my childcare and early years qualification and have worked in childcare since then.

Now i have mum at baby group that has worked in retail all her life and now saying. Oo i know i will be a childminder. This is a parent who gets really cross with her own child and gets quite agrivated by other children. She has very little understanding of how a babys brain works. The cognitive development.
I also know childminders that are near inadequate. These are childminders who have no previous childcare qualification who decided to become a cm for ease.

I also know childminders who are VERY good and have no other qualifications and these would have to miss out.

This is why im 50:50. I do think that people who have been cm a long time should be left out of this if their ofsted is a good or outstanding.

It does bug mw when people.become cms 'because its easy' as we know how hard it is. This will help sort the ones who are keen to help a baby progress in all areas.. not just the ones who do it for the money.

Sorry if my oppioion offends anyone :( xx

I totally agree with you on this, but in a slightly different way.

I became a childminder 6 years ago and didn't have any qualifications, just experience in caring for young children. However, within 3 months of becoming registered I had begun my NVQ3 in children's care, learning and development. I also undertook other training including, SEN, SALT, and CAF.

I have now completed my Foundation degree in Early Years Education alongside GCSE'S in science, maths and English (awaiting results!)

I did the degree and GCSE's in order to pursue a career in teaching, but all of my training and qualifications that I gained prior to these, was to make me a better and more knowledgeable childminder.

I agree with some posts, the fact that some people lack in common sense and experience and that is why I think it's better that the qualifications and training are gained whilst minding in some circumstances.

The point I am getting at, is that I get a little bit annoyed with the fact that even after gaining qualifications and enhancing my professional development, I can still only charge the same as every other minder in my area regardless of my knowledge. This would not happen in any other line of work, including a nursery!

I feel that all childminders should gain at least a level 3 qualification within the first year of registering. I don't agree with us having to have GCSE'S in science, maths and English, as I feel that they are irrelevant. A qualification such as the level 3 in the subject we work in is perfectly adequate in my opinion.

Apologies if this offends too.

Simona
12-07-2013, 08:16 AM
I too agree with 'aspiring' to a Level 3 and I find it incomprehensible that cms have been left out of this requirement as prof Nutbrown rightly said 'why leave cms out?'
There is nothing wrong with having an education and 'knowledge' and that leads us to work better in our practice and deal with various situations

lets put it this way...if we saw someone collapsed in the street we would all go to help but if that person required heart surgery we would have to step back and let the expert come in...same with childcare and especially the 2 yo that may come across our way...some have very complex needs and knowledge will help

When I did my F Degree the students were mostly 50/50 English or other cultures...very few of the English students had GCSE while all the ethnic minorities students did (some had a great number) but still had to go through and take the English equivalent if they could not find their certificates...they did not worry about it

Why is there such a huge obstacle when it comes to having GCSEs...I do understand that common sense works in childcare but the future lies in qualifications and aspirations and cms must be included

I know many will disagree and many will agree but aren't we educating our mindees and aspire for their future??

TooEarlyForGin?
12-07-2013, 08:54 AM
Difficult isn't it.

What is going to happen to all those who aren't academically minded?

You seem to need a degree to work anywhere now, what about nursing which has suffered as qualifications have risen? As no own wants to do the "dirty work".

I left school with no formal qualifications, have managed a level 3, but don't want to/can't do any more.

I have managed 1 good and 2 outstandings in my 11 years and think my experience is more valuable than anything.

If I hadn't been given the chance to start minding in the first place without many qualifications, being the only person in our very rural area to offer childcare, many local families would have really struggled.

How "professional" do we need to be. I know we struggle with some parents, but most of mine have been brilliant, and respectful of what I do. But we are home based childcare, which shouldn't really need a degree.

Maybe it is time for a two tired system. If we make it more complex, there will be more illegal minders, which are currently not challenged at all, and if they carry on with all this madness, maybe I will join them.

ziggy
12-07-2013, 09:12 AM
I have mixed thoughts on this.

Being a very old NNEB nursery nurse (which probably means nothing now) I feel childcare is seen as a job for anyone these days!!!!!

I trained full time for 2yrs to gain my qualification, having gone through a series of interviews and needed to have passed cse english n maths (older ones on here will know what i'm talking about:laughing:) The course was hard work, being in placement one week and college the next, gaining experience with children 0-8yrs. Then a difficult exam at the end of the 2yrs. When i trained I already had 2 children of my own and was shocked at how little i knew about child development/behaviour management etc.

Then came the NVQ:angry: Friends of mine with young children were able to complete this course in a matter of 6months and then I was told that qualification was equal to mine. Now i dont wish to cause offence to anyone with an NVQ but i just couldnt see how that worked. It was presumed women with children of their own already knew how to care for young children and didnt need to do a longer course. Now as mentioned just because you have a child doesnt mean you can be a good childminder.

On the other hand I once worked in a nursery with a young girl who had a list of qualifications as long as your arm, including NNEB and she had no idea how to communicate with the children, other staff or parents and eventually she left or she may well have been dismissed.

Recently a friend of mine asked if her 16yr old daughter could do her work experience with me. This girl attends the local special school due to having learning difficulties/disabilities and a very low IQ. It has been decided she will be looking for work in childcare as 'well she wont have any qualifications and wouldnt be fit for anything else'. Now please dont misunderstand me she is a lovely girl and wonderful with children but isnt able to be left home alone for 5minutes so how can her family presume she can be responsible for young children?

I dont think childminders or nursery nurses etc need a degree but I do think the whole system needs looking at.

Sorry if this has offended anyone, just voicing my opinion.

emma04
12-07-2013, 09:50 AM
Difficult isn't it.

What is going to happen to all those who aren't academically minded?

You seem to need a degree to work anywhere now, what about nursing which has suffered as qualifications have risen? As no own wants to do the "dirty work".

I left school with no formal qualifications, have managed a level 3, but don't want to/can't do any more.

I have managed 1 good and 2 outstandings in my 11 years and think my experience is more valuable than anything.

If I hadn't been given the chance to start minding in the first place without many qualifications, being the only person in our very rural area to offer childcare, many local families would have really struggled.

How "professional" do we need to be. I know we struggle with some parents, but most of mine have been brilliant, and respectful of what I do. But we are home based childcare, which shouldn't really need a degree.

Maybe it is time for a two tired system. If we make it more complex, there will be more illegal minders, which are currently not challenged at all, and if they carry on with all this madness, maybe I will join them.

A huge problem with nursing and many other jobs is that no one wants to 'WORK THEIR WAY UP!' anymore. Many seem to want to get the highest qualification they can get and then walk straight into a job with little or no experience!

Years ago (i'm not that old!) I was under the impression that nurses etc. worked their way up through the ranks and earned the right to a higher salary. This made sure that they treated their job as a vocation and not JUST a way of earning money.

This is why I think it is SO important for on the job training (something that some government imbecile got rid of at some point I assume? And is now trying to re-invoke?)

Compulsory training extricates those who are in a job solely for the money and leaves room for those of us that want to learn more, want to progress and want to be better informed.

hectors house
12-07-2013, 12:17 PM
A huge problem with nursing and many other jobs is that no one wants to 'WORK THEIR WAY UP!' anymore. Many seem to want to get the highest qualification they can get and then walk straight into a job with little or no experience!

Years ago (i'm not that old!) I was under the impression that nurses etc. worked their way up through the ranks and earned the right to a higher salary. This made sure that they treated their job as a vocation and not JUST a way of earning money.

This is why I think it is SO important for on the job training (something that some government imbecile got rid of at some point I assume? And is now trying to re-invoke?)

Compulsory training extricates those who are in a job solely for the money and leaves room for those of us that want to learn more, want to progress and want to be better informed.

The government insisted that nurses had to be better qualified and now like you say they want to go in at the top and are too important to "care". Many nurses I know (aged 50+) started as Auxilliary nurses, worked up to State Enrolled Nurse and then Registered General Nurse.

I do have English & Maths qualification, A Level's and a level 3 in Cert in Childminding Practice does this mean I can now call myself an "Early Years Educator" and charge more money - does it :censored: !!

rickysmiths
12-07-2013, 01:57 PM
So, assuming this applies to us (CMs are mentioned as being entrusted with a child's brain by Ms Truss), what happens if you are an existing CM and you don't have all the GCSEs or their 'equivalents'?

I have 9 O levels 1 GCSE, 3 A levels and a degree... but I don't happen to have a Science O level pass - failed Physics and got a D. Do the other exams passed make up for this?! There is absolutely NO WAY on earth I'm doing a Science GCSE at 42 years of age, which has absolutely no relevance whatsoever to my job.

Sorry to rant - but I'm feeling a bit cross!
:-@

Oh you spoil sport!! I did the L3 Diploma last year (an A Level equivalent) including and Edxcel Maths and English Level 2 exams because my 'O'Levels were considered out of date and I was 57 :laughing::laughing: It would be a doddle for a mere 42 year old youngster!!

SammySplodger
12-07-2013, 08:08 PM
This was the exact subject at PACEY forums in May and at the South West one it over a resounding no to GCSE's but am entrance test as many older people coming into childminding may not have these and wouldn't want to go back to college to get them, yet they could pass an entrance exam

NOTE : this is a requirement for NEW childminders and not existing ones, so you don't have any hoops to jump through or rumaging through the loft for your proof of GCSE's unless you want to take further qualifications as listed.

Thank [insert word of choice] for that!
x

SammySplodger
12-07-2013, 08:10 PM
Oh you spoil sport!! I did the L3 Diploma last year (an A Level equivalent) including and Edxcel Maths and English Level 2 exams because my 'O'Levels were considered out of date and I was 57 :laughing::laughing: It would be a doddle for a mere 42 year old youngster!!

Hee Hee!
x