is a contract necessary for short term back up cover?

**watgem** · 17-04-2013, 06:20 AM

Is it necessary to have a contract if you are providing back up cover for approximately 2 weeks? I will obviously complete childvrecord forms but wondered if I need to do contracts, and if I do do I do one for each child? Ssorry its been a while that I've had to do a new contractxxx

**Becci26** · 17-04-2013, 06:27 AM

As i understand it - No you don't need a contract (although i have got short term contracts which I use for these situations/ ad hoc care), it is good practice to have in place but net essential.
You do need to make sure u have all info such as emergency contact details/ allergies etc though.
All paperwork needs to be done individually

**tulip0803** · 17-04-2013, 07:54 AM

Watgem I know that you are in England so Becci's advice is spot on but for readers in Wales - If you are in Wales you MUST have a contract before care takes place to meet regs and standards whether it is short term, ad-hoc or permanent.

**Mouse** · 17-04-2013, 08:04 AM

If you're in England a written contract is not compulsory, although recommended.

Even for short term care you need all the child's contact details etc, plus permissions.

I make up my own form that incorporates everything I need, taking ideas from full contracts, child record forms and permission forms. I leave out any bits that aren't relevant ( eg. Notice period, holiday time off etc).

If I am looking after siblings I will do one form per family.

My forms include contact details, permissions, details of days and fees. I also have a bit parents sign to agree to - pay in advance, drop & collect on time, keep child away if I'll etc. I then have another section with all my contact details and Ofsted phone number. It covers about 4 A4 sheets, but does cover everything.

Simona · 17-04-2013, 08:05 AM

We seem to have conflicting views on this issue...
I have always had a contract for anyone I am covering for especially if the children come from a cm who is also my back up cover

If payment is taking place during the time of cover then do you not feel you should cover yourself? if anything goes wrong a contract will cover you
This is something those providing a contract should clarify for cms

Do let us know what the answer is if you approach whoever you have purchased the contract from

**supermumy** · 17-04-2013, 08:35 AM

I'm agreeing with Simona
I've always done a contract no matter what! It's just good practice isn't it?

**Becci26** · 17-04-2013, 08:38 AM

Yes it is good practice but it's not essential, which is what the op was asking.

**Carolc** · 17-04-2013, 08:44 AM

I would draw up ky own short term one if i needed it. I have scma ones which pretty much cover everything on it x

Simona · 17-04-2013, 09:02 AM

I feel there is a difference between what is 'good practice' and what is a necessary 'legal' requirement...my opinion of course, but a contract covers you in the event of anything happening...sickness, having to take the child to hospital, administering prescribed medicines??
If the back up cover is agreed between 2 cms the cm who is asking for the back up cover surely would want to ensure everything is in place?

This is something that will happen with agencies where it is stated children will be looked after when a cm is on holiday or sick, by another cm within that agency....I would want to be sure that independent cms are covering themselves
The ncma m'ship dept would be the appropriate people to explain this or MM if the contract is purchased via them?

**Mouse** · 17-04-2013, 10:03 AM

Originally Posted by Simona

I feel there is a difference between what is 'good practice' and what is a necessary 'legal' requirement...my opinion of course, but a contract covers you in the event of anything happening...sickness, having to take the child to hospital, administering prescribed medicines??
If the back up cover is agreed between 2 cms the cm who is asking for the back up cover surely would want to ensure everything is in place?

This is something that will happen with agencies where it is stated children will be looked after when a cm is on holiday or sick, by another cm within that agency....I would want to be sure that independent cms are covering themselves
The ncma m'ship dept would be the appropriate people to explain this or MM if the contract is purchased via them?

There IS a difference between good practice and what is a legal requirement - one is something we can chose to do, but isn't a requirement, the other is something we have to do and is a requirement. A contract is not vital to cover you in the event of taking a child to hospital, administering medicines etc, policies and permissions do that.

And even if the back up care is arranged by the regular cm, the contract will still be between the parents and the temporary cm. it's not really anything to do with the usual minder. I've never heard of a cm being help responsible for the care of the child when they are with an alternative cm. I often put my parents in touch with other CMs to cover my time off. I leave it up to the parents and the other cm to sort to the details. It's nothing to do with me when I'm not involved.

**Chatterbox Childcare** · 17-04-2013, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by Simona

I feel there is a difference between what is 'good practice' and what is a necessary 'legal' requirement...my opinion of course, but a contract covers you in the event of anything happening...sickness, having to take the child to hospital, administering prescribed medicines??
If the back up cover is agreed between 2 cms the cm who is asking for the back up cover surely would want to ensure everything is in place?

This is something that will happen with agencies where it is stated children will be looked after when a cm is on holiday or sick, by another cm within that agency....I would want to be sure that independent cms are covering themselves
The ncma m'ship dept would be the appropriate people to explain this or MM if the contract is purchased via them?

I see where you are coming from but my consent form covers all the above. My contract just shows dates, times and terms so I don't do one for emergency/short term cover. However, I do have my consent form, record information form, parental responsibility form and safeguarding notice signed and I still send a copy of my complaints procedure by email.

Simona · 17-04-2013, 10:14 AM

Mouse I did not say the cm is 'responsible'...only that she would be happy to know all is in place?
It is something we may all differ in opinion and of course that needs to be respected...there seems to be so many areas where we can interpret the requirements
I will make my own enquiry just to be sure

**Becci26** · 17-04-2013, 10:23 AM

Originally Posted by Mouse

There IS a difference between good practice and what is a legal requirement - one is something we can chose to do, but isn't a requirement, the other is something we have to do and is a requirement. A contract is not vital to cover you in the event of taking a child to hospital, administering medicines etc, policies and permissions do that.

And even if the back up care is arranged by the regular cm, the contract will still be between the parents and the temporary cm. it's not really anything to do with the usual minder. I've never heard of a cm being help responsible for the care of the child when they are with an alternative cm. I often put my parents in touch with other CMs to cover my time off. I leave it up to the parents and the other cm to sort to the details. It's nothing to do with me when I'm not involved.

Agreed!

I see your point Simona, maybe it's worth posting a separate thread though as this is moving away from what the op was asking.

**watgem** · 18-04-2013, 06:29 AM

wow!!!! thanks for all the responses, I did say that I would obviously complete child record forms (I use the MM ones) on reflection f the responses I will complete a contract, its just a shame MM don't do a short term one like Pacey do, I don't feel confident to make my own.

**dawn100** · 18-04-2013, 10:52 AM

I use MM contracts and on those contracts it contains permission for outings and use of vehicles on outings and I know a few childminders who have been pulled up on not having permission for outings as its a requirement for the EYFS. They also have photo permission so you would have to make sure you had all relevant permission if you didn't use the MM contacts.

**sing-low** · 19-05-2013, 06:24 PM

Is there a problem using a PACEY contract even if you're with MM? For the purposes of covering yourself legally? MM might not like it, of course. And I don't even know if you can get PACEY contracts without being a member, come to think of it.

**watgem** · 19-05-2013, 07:28 PM

I have a separate very comprehensive permissions form which includes outings, and I use the MM child record forms and normally use the MM cntracts, it was just in this case I would be covering for just 2 weeks and as contracts are expensive wondered if I would need one, however I have given the lady one as well as all the other paperwork xxx

**catlyn** · 20-05-2013, 08:05 AM

Originally Posted by dawn100

I use MM contracts and on those contracts it contains permission for outings and use of vehicles on outings and I know a few childminders who have been pulled up on not having permission for outings as its a requirement for the EYFS. They also have photo permission so you would have to make sure you had all relevant permission if you didn't use the MM contacts.

is this a legal requirement????? done a search but cant find where it states it is?? can someone point me in the right direction please x x

**Chatterbox Childcare** · 20-05-2013, 08:12 AM

Originally Posted by Simona

I feel there is a difference between what is 'good practice' and what is a necessary 'legal' requirement...my opinion of course, but a contract covers you in the event of anything happening...sickness, having to take the child to hospital, administering prescribed medicines??
If the back up cover is agreed between 2 cms the cm who is asking for the back up cover surely would want to ensure everything is in place?

This is something that will happen with agencies where it is stated children will be looked after when a cm is on holiday or sick, by another cm within that agency....I would want to be sure that independent cms are covering themselves
The ncma m'ship dept would be the appropriate people to explain this or MM if the contract is purchased via them?

From what you have posted I think that you have a contract covering everything but I don't, I have a Consent Form with all my permissions which is always completed along with Parental Responsibility, notification of reporting abuse and record information sheet.

My contract is just about payment, so if I was being paid up front what would be the point of it?

**marnieb** · 20-05-2013, 10:56 AM

Ofsted would say yes you should have a contract.

I know as I had 1 days holiday last year and 1 mindee went to my back up cm - who is well known to the parents and child - Ofsted did a spot check on that day and hauled my friend over hot coals for not having a written contract!!!!!