Collecting with no car seat

[LadyC]

I'm relatively new to childminding so not really sure if this is a situation which would ever come up, and I also know how I would react as a normal citizen and parent - but as a CM I can see there are different factors involved.... just wondering how any of you would deal with a relative collecting a mindee in a car, but with no car seat?

[sarah707]

It's a safeguarding issue - the child's safety must come first.

I would ring parents and let them know that I could not let the child leave as they were not going to be safe in the car.

Put the ball in their court and let them deal with the situation.

Hth

[gegele]

i lended a booster seat more than once to a father who turned up in sport car with no seat.

he ask if i wouldn't mind and i said if you don't borrow the seat you're not having the child ( with a big smile ) as it's too dangerous and i wouldn't forgive myself if something happened!!

[littletreasures]

I had this dilemma with a baby being collected by Mum in a taxi occasionally.

She would walk to me in the morning with baby in a sling, but would get a taxi from work, collect child and get in the taxi to go home.

The law states that when using a taxi if a child restraint is not available then they may travel unrestrained. I did put my foot down when I saw her getting in to the front seat with him and made her get in the back.

I offered her my car seat on numerous occasions, but she would refuse as she would have to walk back with it the next day.

[LadyC]

You've all confirmed what I felt would be the right thing to do, although I was wondering if by not letting the child go, that you could be accused of kidnapping them?!!

[Tippy Toes]

It's a tricky one isn't it? Once they have collected their child at the end of the contracted hours, isn't it up to them what they do with their child? Of course I would be horrified if a parent didn't use a car seat, but once they have left your setting the child is their responsibility?

[singlewiththree]

I lend carseats out to parents if another relative picks up or they forget to put theirs in, as long as they bring it back the next day

[Mrs.L.C]

I think I would insist on them borrowing one. Maybe have one thats not too expensive just incase

[bunyip]

You've all confirmed what I felt would be the right thing to do, although I was wondering if by not letting the child go, that you could be accused of kidnapping them?!!

I think a lot would depend upon whether the adult collecting them has parental responsibility.

[Beetlejuice]

I had parents with a two year old once who would have a car seat in the car but not make her go in it because she would kick off. I saw them do it once - I only realised when I looked out of the window one day when they were driving off. I told mum next day that unless she put the child in the car seat they were breaking the law (they were originally from overseas) and that it didn't matter how short the journey was, if a police officer saw them they would be in trouble. I also said that I would not let them leave without seeing the child strapped in (though I'm not sure legally where I would stand with this) They always made sure after that that she got in the car seat no arguing.

Funnily enough I NEVER had a problem getting said child into the car seat as I am a grown up and would not be dictated to by a two year old!

[samb]

Why did I think that in an emergency it was ok to not use a car seat?

For example, Mum is at work with car that has car seats in as she has dropped them in the morning, but then has to work late for a deadline so rings Dad to collect children. Dad then arrives at the childminders having no car seat and puts them in car and takes them home. I would see this as being ok. Or also if you have 3 car seats fitted in a normal sized 5 seat car and can't fit the 4th needed in the middle seat then the largest child should sit in the middle seat without a restraint as it would be more unsafe to have the seats not fitting properly than have one with just a usual belt on.

I had a time when I took my children in a car without car seats. My dd fell head frist over her scooter handlbar and cut her forehead open. It was after school but we were just outside so I ran her back in to get help (there was blood everywhere). The head teacher drove me and my 2 kids (not minded) to the surgery to get her stitched up.

If a minded child was regularly picked up and not in an appropriate restraint of course I would say something and note it as safeguarding etc but surely there are times when there are exceptions to the rule?

Please tell me I am not making this up?!

[Paulab]

Why did I think that in an emergency it was ok to not use a car seat?

For example, Mum is at work with car that has car seats in as she has dropped them in the morning, but then has to work late for a deadline so rings Dad to collect children. Dad then arrives at the childminders having no car seat and puts them in car and takes them home. I would see this as being ok. Or also if you have 3 car seats fitted in a normal sized 5 seat car and can't fit the 4th needed in the middle seat then the largest child should sit in the middle seat without a restraint as it would be more unsafe to have the seats not fitting properly than have one with just a usual belt on.

I had a time when I took my children in a car without car seats. My dd fell head frist over her scooter handlbar and cut her forehead open. It was after school but we were just outside so I ran her back in to get help (there was blood everywhere). The head teacher drove me and my 2 kids (not minded) to the surgery to get her stitched up.

If a minded child was regularly picked up and not in an appropriate restraint of course I would say something and note it as safeguarding etc but surely there are times when there are exceptions to the rule?

Please tell me I am not making this up?!

No you are not making this up, yes you can in a emergency, I.e if you had to pick up from school because the person who is meant to pick them up has broken down etc, or in the the exact same scenario you were in , I read it when I checked heights for stopping using booters seat on official gov website xxx

[bunyip]

Why did I think that in an emergency it was ok to not use a car seat?

For example, Mum is at work with car that has car seats in as she has dropped them in the morning, but then has to work late for a deadline so rings Dad to collect children. Dad then arrives at the childminders having no car seat and puts them in car and takes them home. I would see this as being ok. Or also if you have 3 car seats fitted in a normal sized 5 seat car and can't fit the 4th needed in the middle seat then the largest child should sit in the middle seat without a restraint as it would be more unsafe to have the seats not fitting properly than have one with just a usual belt on.

I had a time when I took my children in a car without car seats. My dd fell head frist over her scooter handlbar and cut her forehead open. It was after school but we were just outside so I ran her back in to get help (there was blood everywhere). The head teacher drove me and my 2 kids (not minded) to the surgery to get her stitched up.

If a minded child was regularly picked up and not in an appropriate restraint of course I would say something and note it as safeguarding etc but surely there are times when there are exceptions to the rule?

Please tell me I am not making this up?!

I'm not a driver, so it doesn't affect me much, but I'd heard something similar.

Perhaps we need to think carefully about what we (or, more to the point, what the police) would regard as a genuine emergency.

Yes, I'd say that getting an injured child to hospital was definitely justifiable as an 'emergency'. I couldn't be sure that the police would see the other example (mum working late) in the same way. They might say that dad should've gone and collected the car seats from mum's work, or make some other safer arrangement. Perhaps an 'inconvenience' is not the same thing as an 'emergency'.

[Mouse]

Why did I think that in an emergency it was ok to not use a car seat?

For example, Mum is at work with car that has car seats in as she has dropped them in the morning, but then has to work late for a deadline so rings Dad to collect children. Dad then arrives at the childminders having no car seat and puts them in car and takes them home. I would see this as being ok. Or also if you have 3 car seats fitted in a normal sized 5 seat car and can't fit the 4th needed in the middle seat then the largest child should sit in the middle seat without a restraint as it would be more unsafe to have the seats not fitting properly than have one with just a usual belt on.

I had a time when I took my children in a car without car seats. My dd fell head frist over her scooter handlbar and cut her forehead open. It was after school but we were just outside so I ran her back in to get help (there was blood everywhere). The head teacher drove me and my 2 kids (not minded) to the surgery to get her stitched up.

If a minded child was regularly picked up and not in an appropriate restraint of course I would say something and note it as safeguarding etc but surely there are times when there are exceptions to the rule?

Please tell me I am not making this up?!

This is what the law says. It looks as if you can take a child not in a car seat in certain circumstances if they are over 3.

http://www.childcarseats.org.uk/law/index.htm

[bunyip]

It says "for a short distance for reason of unexpected necessity." What exactly is that supposed to mean? Looks rather open to interpretation.

An "unexpected necessity" might be taking an injured child to casualty. But to some people, an "unexpected necessity" might mean a trip to the shops cos they've run out of chocolate/fags/booze/methadone/whatever.

[samb]

Phew - glad I hadn't made it up!

I do see what everyone is saying re what you would consider an emergency which is when we have to make the call and preferably be over cautious - as in if child collected first time no car seat make a comment to parent and see what they say and make a note and if it is regular or in our opinion not an emergency then refer it as safeguarding issue?