If you have a cleaner...

[nokidshere]

According to a conversation I have just had today with Ofsted...

If your cleaner comes during minding hours (even if you usually go out while the cleaner is in your house - because some weeks you might not) then they are classed as a REGULAR VISITOR.

Regular visitors must have a CRB check...

- You need to download and print an EY2 form from the Ofsted website and send it to Ofsted;

- Ofsted then send out a CRB form;

- You can fill in the back with the cleaner's passport details etc and send it off.

Ofsted pay for the CRB.

Your cleaner can continue working for you while the application is in progress however you should call Ofsted and tell them that you are applying for a CRB for the cleaner so they can make a note in your file.

This will head off any complaints they might receive about the cleaner being in your house.

In the meantime...

- You need to risk assess how you keep the children safe from a visitor who does not have a CRB check in place;

- You need to make sure the cleaner does not come into unsupervised contact with the children;

- You need to consider the impact of a regular visitor on your safeguarding / child protection policy and procedure.

Note - I totally forgot to ask whether the cleaner should sign the visitors book (it's been a long day ) but I think, for good practice anyone who comes during working hours should sign in and out as a matter of course - if you currently have a visitors book (I don't want to start that argument again here ).

Hth

If we are not leaving the children alone with the cleaner then why would she need a crb check?

[sarah707]

If we are not leaving the children alone with the cleaner then why would she need a crb check?

Because I rang Ofsted and asked them and they said, as a regular visitor to my house, she needs one.

I am not the first person to be given this information

[miffy]

Note to self - do not bother to get a cleaner just put up with the mess!

Miffy xx

[onceinabluemoon]

Note to self - do not bother to get a cleaner just put up with the mess!

Miffy xx

LMAO this is what I do!

Actually I thought I'd spend the money I would have paid a cleaner and bought myself a dishwasher and a Dyson (and chucked out/recycled tons of stuff) to make my cleaning easier! Job well done as the place does look better if not spotless

[Pauline]

- You need to download and print an EY2 form from the Ofsted website and send it to Ofsted;

To save you searching the Ofsted site, there is a copy to download in the Free Resources: http://childmindinghelp.co.uk/freere...s/ey2form.html

[jumpinjen]

I was thinking about getting one to do all the jobs I hate like cleaning skirting boards, washing windows, washing down the walls, mopping floors, hoovering round the edges of carpets on your hands and knees etc etc.... think I will leave it til I have the energy.... thanks Sarah!

jen x

[Helcatt]

Now this is where I get really cross.

I phoned up Ofsted on the back of this post asking if that also means that a friend who comes round on a regular playdate (but stays with her kids so it doesn't effect my numbers) would also need to be CRB checked as she would also count as a regular visitor

And guess?

I got a different answer! I was told that I get them to sign in, I safeguard the children appropriately by not leaving them alone with the children and we are out for a large amount of time anyway, so no, my cleaner does not need to have a CRB in place!

He said it would be for cases like my daughter having her boyfriend over to stay every thursday and friday (hopefully not for another 20 years at least )

So on the basis of the conversation I had (I noted down in my register the time I called - though I didn't get his name, thought of that after) I WILL NOT be getting my cleaner CRB checked and if something comes back to bite me, I will refer back to "said conversation"

I get so cross that you can not get a straight answer from them - always different people, different answer. HE said you needed to use COMMON SENSE

HX

[FussyElmo]

Now this is where I get really cross.

I phoned up Ofsted on the back of this post asking if that also means that a friend who comes round on a regular playdate (but stays with her kids so it doesn't effect my numbers) would also need to be CRB checked as she would also count as a regular visitor

And guess?

I got a different answer! I was told that I get them to sign in, I safeguard the children appropriately by not leaving them alone with the children and we are out for a large amount of time anyway, so no, my cleaner does not need to have a CRB in place!

He said it would be for cases like my daughter having her boyfriend over to stay every thursday and friday (hopefully not for another 20 years at least )

So on the basis of the conversation I had (I noted down in my register the time I called - though I didn't get his name, thought of that after) I WILL NOT be getting my cleaner CRB checked and if something comes back to bite me, I will refer back to "said conversation"

I get so cross that you can not get a straight answer from them - always different people, different answer. HE said you needed to use COMMON SENSE

HX

I supppose the difference is that a friend is being invited in and a cleaner is being paid and will be there at the stated time.

I guess at preschools etc the cleaners are crb'ed.

Playing devils advocatt if a cleaner was to come into your house for a year on a regular basis there is a possibilty that you would become so used to it that you may leave the child unattended with them.

At least ofsted are willing to pay for the crb checks

[green puppy]

I got told on my first aid course last week that we should have coshh sheets for products we use in our homes. He said once we are accepting money for a service we are providing, our home becomes a business and we must comply with the H & S act, coshh etc.....

[sarah707]

I got told on my first aid course last week that we should have coshh sheets for products we use in our homes. He said once we are accepting money for a service we are providing, our home becomes a business and we must comply with the H & S act, coshh etc.....

We have had a long discussion about this before and yes some first aid trainers and Environmental Health inspectors do want to see us having a COSHH file.

However as it's not in the Eyfs as a requirement many childminders argue against it.

If you have an assistant you are responsible for anything they touch and any damage they do to themselves with products while on your premises so a COSHH is important then too...

Similarly if you employ a cleaner you have a duty of care to ensure a safe working environment - the hoover doesn't blow up in their face, they have gloves to wear, if the cleaning fluid is caustic they understand the risks, cleaners are not mixed together etc.

Hth

[nokidshere]

I got told on my first aid course last week that we should have coshh sheets for products we use in our homes. He said once we are accepting money for a service we are providing, our home becomes a business and we must comply with the H & S act, coshh etc.....

Once again.....

You only have to provide coshh sheets if you employ staff. There is no legal requirement under H&S at work act for you to supply any coshh sheets for use in your own home by yourself. Or by anyone else if they are self employed.

"he" is talking rubbish and should stick to first aid!

And before anyone jumps on me - I am not saying those of you who want to do them shouldn;t, if you do then thats fine! Its the being told that you HAVE to that insences me!

[green puppy]

We have had a long discussion about this before and yes some first aid trainers and Environmental Health inspectors do want to see us having a COSHH file.

However as it's not in the Eyfs as a requirement many childminders argue against it.

If you have an assistant you are responsible for anything they touch and any damage they do to themselves with products while on your premises so a COSHH is important then too...

Similarly if you employ a cleaner you have a duty of care to ensure a safe working environment - the hoover doesn't blow up in their face, they have gloves to wear, if the cleaning fluid is caustic they understand the risks, cleaners are not mixed together etc.

Hth

Had somehow missed that thread!

[green puppy]

Once again.....

You only have to provide coshh sheets if you employ staff. There is no legal requirement under H&S at work act for you to supply any coshh sheets for use in your own home by yourself. Or by anyone else if they are self employed.

"he" is talking rubbish and should stick to first aid!

"He" is also a health and safety officer who inspects childcare and education settings. Only relating what I was told, as mentioned above I had somehow missed the other thread.

[Flisspaps]

I get so cross that you can not get a straight answer from them - always different people, different answer. HE said you needed to use COMMON SENSE

HX

OFSTED:

Offer Fresh Story To Each Different caller!

[Helcatt]

I supppose the difference is that a friend is being invited in and a cleaner is being paid and will be there at the stated time.

Point being, neither needed to be checked! According to this guy!

[Helcatt]

OFSTED:

Offer Fresh Story To Each Different caller!

Sounds about right

[Heaven Scent]

I take it then that if the cleaner & assistant are self-employed we do not have to do it ?????

[sarah707]

I take it then that if the cleaner & assistant are self-employed we do not have to do it ?????

Sorry HS I'm not sure what you mean!

[buildingblocks]

Not that it takes much

[catlyn]

Update to this thread...I rang Ofsted today and was told that my cleaner ( 2 hours a week) doesnt need a check as she is an occasional visitor to the home....as long as she is never left alone with the children they said its fine....got the mans name I spoke to and have recorded it in my diary so if Ofsted query it I can show them I asked!!