wow some people are unbelievable
Thanks Thanks:  0
Likes Likes:  17
Dislikes Dislikes:  0
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 45
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    645
    Registered Childminder since
    Mar 13
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default wow some people are unbelievable

    Speaking to a mum at rhyme time this morning. I've known her for a couple of years. Our eldest children went to nursery together.
    Anyway..... she started asking me about tax credits and childcare. She wanted to know how likely it would be for tax credits to phone her old cm. I said 'I don't really know but they do make spot checks. Why?'
    She's not told them she's stopped using the childminder so is still getting the benefit. I told her that when they do find out, which they definitely will, she will have to repay all she's had since leaving the cm.
    She said yeh but I've been using it as a loan to buy a new car. I've been putting that money away each month and soon I'll have enough. When they do find out and want it back it'll just be like repaying a loan on the car but without any interest!!!!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,151
    Registered Childminder since
    Mar 04
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    And we wonder why the country is in such a pickle - I agree - I would say UNBELIEVABLE but sadly it is soooo believable.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    in the never never land fighting off fae
    Posts
    6,878
    Registered Childminder since
    july05
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    9

    Default

    So shes not bothered she is committing benefit fraud which is a criminal offence
    When someone tells you nothing is impossible, tell them to go slam a revolving door

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Somewhere West of Watford!!!
    Posts
    9,085
    Registered Childminder since
    Aug 94
    Latest Inspection Grade
    Good
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    If I knew the old cm I would be ringing them and telling them the mum was still using her Reg Number. The kick back it could have for the cm is that if HMRC did a check it could look as if the cm wasn't declaring enough income.

    Quite apart from the fact that the parent is committing fraud and boasting about it. These people frankly disgust me and need to be reported.and as you know about it you should report it as well. I'm sorry i wouldn't think twice.

  5. Likes Ripeberry liked this post
  6. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    645
    Registered Childminder since
    Mar 13
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    The reason they definitely will find out is because I will be ringing them. I don't know who her old cm is but I know enough about her to be able to provide her details. Hopefully they will look into it.
    She seemed quite proud of the fact she had found a way to get an interest free loan!

  7. Likes sarah707, rickysmiths, bunyip liked this post
  8. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    32
    Registered Childminder since
    2006
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mrsh3103 View Post
    Speaking to a mum at rhyme time this morning. I've known her for a couple of years. Our eldest children went to nursery together.
    Anyway..... she started asking me about tax credits and childcare. She wanted to know how likely it would be for tax credits to phone her old cm. I said 'I don't really know but they do make spot checks. Why?'
    She's not told them she's stopped using the childminder so is still getting the benefit. I told her that when they do find out, which they definitely will, she will have to repay all she's had since leaving the cm.
    She said yeh but I've been using it as a loan to buy a new car. I've been putting that money away each month and soon I'll have enough. When they do find out and want it back it'll just be like repaying a loan on the car but without any interest!!!!
    This has happened to me three times! Compliance rang me and asked if I was looking after these particular children

    . The first time the mum had been claiming £800 a month childcare and she only paid me £200 per month! The second time the child had left 12 months before with mum still claiming and the third one was a person I hadn't even met they just used my URN! I must say the tax credits people were really nice to me but it was still worrying especially as I do nothing 'cash in hand' everything goes thought the books!

    I'm no snitch but I would be very tempted to ring CM involves then she could possibly ring tax credits herself

  9. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    By the sea
    Posts
    8,830
    Latest Inspection Grade
    Outstanding
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    It happened to me a few years ago. I had been minding a little girl who left when her mum decided she didn't need childcare any more. She was quite open about the fact that she would carry on claiming childcare costs through tax credits. She said she might as well leave the claim in place in case she ever needed childcare in the future. She was also quite open about the fact that she claimed much more than she actually paid me. She got the full 80% paid, but happily told me she claimed enough to pay me & have plenty left over each month.

    The worst bit was she was a childminder herself, so knew they didn't ever check up (they didn't back then). I did report her but nothing ever happened. I'm glad they're more on the ball these days.

  10. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Beds
    Posts
    2,298
    Registered Childminder since
    May '09
    Latest Inspection Grade
    Good
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    I have had this too, but what I have realised from reading many of these stories is that ringing tax credits to report is a waste of time. You need to call benefits fraud hotline https://www.gov.uk/report-benefit-fraud

  11. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    at my computer, of course
    Posts
    4,986
    Registered Childminder since
    Nov 11
    Latest Inspection Grade
    Outstanding
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    And while all this is going on, The Daily Mail readers love to believe that benefits fraud is the exclusive domain of single mums, "chavs", and nasty ol' "Johnny Foreigner".

    Funny how you never hear Cameron attacking his precious "decent hard-working families" for being a little less than decent when they've got their nicely-manicured fingers in the Tax Credits till.

  12. Likes ziggy, lisbet, Goatgirl, smartbear liked this post
  13. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    388
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Whenever I have had tax credits paying parents I call and tell them when they have left my care and document it. At least then hopefully I've done all I can I do not want anything coming back on me.

    Ja-Lula-Bell*****minding

  14. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    176
    Registered Childminder since
    Sep06
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    speaking of tax credits...if a parent wants term time only childcare & gets 70% tax credits towards the cost then would you reduce your fee in the school holidays? (i usually take it down to half fee or just over if not on tax credits) or would you leave it as it is? Although if i charged less i guess it means the parent just pays a bit less out of her own pocket and not actually gain? The parent in question just needs 3 hrs a day childcare four days a week. Thanks

  15. #12
    Simona Guest

    Default

    I find this thread amazing and I am not able to comment on any of it but some of the comments are worrying....not by what is said but by what can be done in the system...sorry not very clear I know.

    I have been in childcare for 20 years and never had any involvement with parents who are on benefits, tax credits or whatever...I have never asked them and no one has ever said anything to me about them...I consider that their business and the dept that pays them

    A long time ago ...years and years...if any parents applied for help with childcare I used to receive a form to fill in which confirmed the hours the child was attending...I only ever signed 2 forms I recall....then this stopped

    I understand parents can use our URN to claim...how? can the system be so simple to allow such practice? surely the govt and Ian Duncan Smith himself cannot launch a war on those on benefits and then allow a system open to improper use?

  16. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    442
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Simona View Post
    I find this thread amazing and I am not able to comment on any of it but some of the comments are worrying....not by what is said but by what can be done in the system...sorry not very clear I know. I have been in childcare for 20 years and never had any involvement with parents who are on benefits, tax credits or whatever...I have never asked them and no one has ever said anything to me about them...I consider that their business and the dept that pays them A long time ago ...years and years...if any parents applied for help with childcare I used to receive a form to fill in which confirmed the hours the child was attending...I only ever signed 2 forms I recall....then this stopped I understand parents can use our URN to claim...how? can the system be so simple to allow such practice? surely the govt and Ian Duncan Smith himself cannot launch a war on those on benefits and then allow a system open to improper use?
    It is not unheard of near me for parents to ring, claiming to be interested in sending their child to you, and ask for your ofsted number under the pretense of reading your previous ofsted reports, and then actually using your number to claim tax credits.
    We were all told by our coordinator to never give our number to anyone until they sign a contract!!
    I was gob smacked! Especially considering I live in an area that has lots of high paid individuals!!

  17. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    442
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    With regards to tax credits ,one of my parents uses them, and when she applied for them around two years ago, she was showing me the form and it's so simple, it asks for the CM address, which anyone could find from the FIS website, and their ofsted number and that's it. It didn't even require me to sign it or anything, so relatively easy to scam money!! X

  18. Likes Kiddleywinks liked this post
  19. #15
    Simona Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AdeleMarie88 View Post
    It is not unheard of near me for parents to ring, claiming to be interested in sending their child to you, and ask for your ofsted number under the pretense of reading your previous ofsted reports, and then actually using your number to claim tax credits.
    We were all told by our coordinator to never give our number to anyone until they sign a contract!!
    I was gob smacked! Especially considering I live in an area that has lots of high paid individuals!!
    Anyone can access our Ofsted number...it is not a secret ...all parents have to do is look it up on the website or even FIS lists
    When parents call they say they found me on the FIS list and that gives them my URN straight away which leads them to my report if they want to read it...so the lA is giving advice that cannot be sustained in the first place

    If parents are able to just give our number and claim benefits from quoting it then there must be a flaw in the system...so I would assume the Dept for Work and Pension has to make sure it does not allow the system to be abused?

  20. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    442
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    Without a doubt it needs to be readdressed!! I was floored when I was told that this happened x

    Easily remedied though I think, if an application is designed where by the CM has to provide a signature and maybe a copy of registration, that would surely cut down on fraudsters x
    Last edited by AdeleMarie88; 19-01-2014 at 10:13 AM.

  21. #17
    Simona Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AdeleMarie88 View Post
    Without a doubt it needs to be readdressed!! I was floored when I was told that this happened x

    Easily remedied though I think, if an application is designed where by the CM has to provide a signature and maybe a copy of registration, that would surely cut down on fraudsters x
    I can't wait for the new Tax Free Childcare system to kick in 2015...I wonder how the govt will ensure that works?

  22. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    3,857
    Registered Childminder since
    Oct 97
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    What worries me most is when you ring up and tell them they are just not Interested, this is not a new problem I had a parent sign up and I filled in form to claim tax credits, being naive I waited for her claim to come through, 12 weeks later and they left I never got mu money, tax credits were well we can't do anything, they paid her the full six months claim even knowing the chikdren were no longer attending. this was 17 years ago.

  23. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    1,151
    Registered Childminder since
    Mar 04
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default

    This is so frustrating - in many conversations with other minders about these issues many times it has come up that the funding claimed under the childcare allowance should be paid direct to the childcare provider, but then (as it stands), as it is the parents inputting information, we as providers would be at risk of having to pay funds back if the parents has falsely made claims and then we are stuck no payment for care and a challenge to get payment from parents.

    The only way round this is for the funds to be paid direct to the minder but any false claims to be the responsibility of the claimant and they have to pay back falsely claimed fees including childcare (why not?). But at least this way the falsely claiming claimant doesn't get the childcare allowance to spend on other things apart from childcare. Somebody, somewhere will think this is a detrimental to their human rights or something but in effect it will make sure it safeguards childcare for the child - believe me they will access the childcare if it's being paid for. I know it's not 100% funded but cheap childcare is better than nothing. And it makes false claims look less of a temptation. Lets face it - it's simple to make false claims for the childcare allowance under this scheme, we all know it. But it gets the votes for the politicians and cynically I think this is an underlying issue?? Naughty me thinking there is a political issue here! Imagine if the welfare system just paid the funds to their alleged recipient - like vouchers to landlords for rent, childcare providers for childcare, do vouchers food vouchers for food (not fags or booze) travel vouchers for travel. And why not in effect the nhs do vouchers (prescriptions) for medication and those not on free prescriptions pay the top up to get the meds. That seems to work!! But it would have to be a brave political to group to introduce that - not a vote winner - it will never happen.

    Basically if FREE money is handed to someone on a plate it is very hard to refuse - i'm not condoning i'm just being realistic.

  24. Likes lynnslittleuns liked this post
  25. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Neverland
    Posts
    2,137
    Registered Childminder since
    Dec 11
    Latest Inspection Grade
    Good ;-)
    Post Thanks / Like
    Blog Entries
    8

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowwhite View Post
    speaking of tax credits...if a parent wants term time only childcare & gets 70% tax credits towards the cost then would you reduce your fee in the school holidays? (i usually take it down to half fee or just over if not on tax credits) or would you leave it as it is? Although if I charged less i guess it means the parent just pays a bit less out of her own pocket and not actually gain? The parent in question just needs 3 hrs a day childcare four days a week. Thanks
    The contract is between you and the parent, not between you, the parent and TC's.
    So long as you get the fees you and the parent have agreed to, and the frequency of those payments, how the parent gets reimbursed by TC's shouldn't affect the childcare provider
    I work out the fees for the year, give the parent that annual figure then divide it by the method of payments agreed, so either weekly, monthly, fortnightly whatever.

    Behind the scenes, the parent should pass the annual figure on to TC's.
    TC's take that figure, divide it by 52 weeks and pay the parent whatever percentage they're entitled to (Not everyone that gets TC's gets the full 70%)

    eg:
    Annual fees £1000.00 = Parent pays you £19.23 over 52 weeks
    TC's pay 70% so £700.00 over 52 weeks = £13.46 which goes to the parent

    If parents are TTO, and only pay during TT (39 weeks)
    Annual fees are £1000 = Parent pays you £25.64 over 39 weeks
    TC's will still pay the £700, but over a 52 week period
    So parent will still receive TC's during the period they don't pay you, but over the course of the year the amount the parent is entitled to remains the same.

    Hope that makes sense lol

 

 
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Quick Links and Advertisements

Important Information Links
Some Useful Quick Links
Advertisements

 

You can also find us on:
wow some people are unbelievable wow some people are unbelievable wow some people are unbelievable

We use cookies to make this site as useful as possible. They are small text files placed in your browser to track usage of our site but they don’t tell us who you are.
By continuing to use this site you are consenting to cookies being placed on your computer. Find out more here: Cookies in Use

Childminding Help and the Childminding Forum are part of Childcare.co.uk