unannounced ofsted viits

[FussyElmo]

Ok...so what you are saying is that the guidelines that cms should receive an inspection when informed by phone by the inspector has been changed?
what if the cm does not have children on the day Ofsted makes an appearance? will she be downgraded when she could have turned up when children are on roll...is that what they come to see? how our children are progressing?

Ofsted do have a habit of changing things as they like or at least this is their new regime...considering the stress they have put on how much cms cost to inspect why waste a trip??

I also read about a cm who was given a week's notice because she would be on holiday so the inspector agreed to inspect on her return

What we are all saying is that the goal posts have been moved and we accept that?
that is what we are going to discuss...can we keep to guidelines..if not can we have it in black and white please!

I will raise it as a concern but I will not accept changes in rules without appropriate notification...fair is fair!
Unless, of course, June O'Sullivan is correct when she asks what is the agenda behind Ofsted recent change?

Was it ever actually a rule?

or something that the inspectors did to make sure that we will in due to the nature of our job

[Simona]

Yes and I heard it from a senior Ofsted manager...not just me but all those present in the room

In order not to waste a journey the inspector would ring but, she warned, we would not be given much notice or exact date because Ofsted are aware we go out for various reasons and one is school pick ups...this is for normal inspections.

We are missing the point here...either we want clarification or we can go on arguing and guessing what is right or wrong!
I don't know as I am not an expert but I am determined to get some answers either for myself or cms in general.

I am off to the meeting ...I can go with a list of concerns in addition to those sent by Sarah and try to get some answers but cannot take guesses with me.
If Ofsted have changed the rules then we want it in black and white...that is my view and I respect those who disagree.

Come to think of it we could always email Ofsted...anyone offering?

[Mouse]

Freelance Ofsted inspectors are expected to carry out a minimum of 48 inspections a year - one a week if they take 4 weeks holiday.

I wonder if these unannounced inspections are carried out by inspectors who are struggling to meet their target number of inspections?

Or are Prospects (or the other one whose name I can't remember) failing to phone childminders in advance, meaning the inspector turns up, not realising the cm hasn't been contacted?

Or is there just a complete breakdown in the whole process? We know Ofsted struggles to keep on top of their workload?

Or is it a plan to panic childminders into joining agencies where they'd have no inspections?


One local cm did have notice - 20 minutes! The inspector phoned, said "are you in? I'm on my way".

[Simona]

Freelance Ofsted inspectors are expected to carry out a minimum of 48 inspections a year - one a week if they take 4 weeks holiday.

I wonder if these unannounced inspections are carried out by inspectors who are struggling to meet their target number of inspections?

Or are Prospects (or the other one whose name I can't remember) failing to phone childminders in advance, meaning the inspector turns up, not realising the cm hasn't been contacted?

Or is there just a complete breakdown in the whole process? We know Ofsted struggles to keep on top of their workload?

Or is it a plan to panic childminders into joining agencies where they'd have no inspections?


One local cm did have notice - 20 minutes! The inspector phoned, said "are you in? I'm on my way".

Agency cms will be 'randomly' inspected so they too should get the same treatment

Come on girls...how many inspectors happen to pass by your house especially if you live in a rural area?
Every inspector I have had in the past 12 years has arrived here with her Sat Nav and travelled long distance...no one was ever just passing by!
Sorry I do not believe that..cynical I know!

Sarah...you say inspectors have a booklet...is there a publication we can look at?

I have emailed Ofsted...if I get an answer I will relay it to you

[caz3007]

It would be interesting to know what areas these unannounced inspections are in, is there a pattern to the geographic location

[WibbleWobble]

I wondered what happens if Ofsted turn up and you are at home but on holiday- ie no children around?

Wibble x

[blue bear]

I read somewhere (not official document just someone's opinion) that every childminder that has reported an accident or incident, or a complaint has been received and investigated since jan 2011,regardless of outcome, they will be given an unannounced inspection during this round of inspections.

Now Idont know if this is true or not.

[munch149]

I read somewhere (not official document just someone's opinion) that every childminder that has reported an accident or incident, or a complaint has been received and investigated since jan 2011,regardless of outcome, they will be given an unannounced inspection during this round of inspections.

Now Idont know if this is true or not.

Well that includes me then. Although I'm overdue mine anyway. Was due march. I would crap myself if ofsted turned up unexpected. Although I would probably still do ok the fact that I felt so unprepared would certainly put the pressure on. Even when I had my complaint made ofsted gave me a little notice to come out and see me.

[Simona]

I wondered what happens if Ofsted turn up and you are at home but on holiday- ie no children around?

Wibble x

Exactly what I asked Ofsted...we are speculating a lot and end up getting more and more worried and stressed

My advice, for what is worth is, be ready for an inspection, have your paperwork in place and let her in!
what else can we do??

[lizduncan72]

In Scotland we can get unannounced inspections at any time, if we're lucky they phone the day before to make sure we'll be working but a lot of the time they just turn up! My last one the inspector arrived unannounced 5 minutes after I left for toddler group and got my husband who was running late for work!! The inspector phoned me later in the day to find out which days were best to come but wouldn't tell me when he was going to come back.

[Simona]

In Scotland we can get unannounced inspections at any time, if we're lucky they phone the day before to make sure we'll be working but a lot of the time they just turn up! My last one the inspector arrived unannounced 5 minutes after I left for toddler group and got my husband who was running late for work!! The inspector phoned me later in the day to find out which days were best to come but wouldn't tell me when he was going to come back.

That is a fine example of money wasting by the inspector...they are free lance but who pays them?
Good he contacted you again and also not telling you which day....that is ok but not to be left weeks on end waiting.

I would challenge this practice as restricting cms in offering the opportunities for children to be taken out and which we agree with the parents
We are NOT nurseries and, therefore, not expected to be within 4 walls 10 hrs a day!!

[sarah707]

We don't know why they are doing it - and conspiracy theories abound - but a lot of cms are getting unannounced inspections at the moment.

If Ofsted turn up and you are not working they would normally accept that and come back BUT it doesn't always work that way. We do have a comment on the FB group from a cm who was downgraded to satisfactory because she didn't have children present and the inspector refused to come back to watch her with the children.

If they turn up and you are going out they will expect you to cancel your outing. Again, we have a story on the FB group of an inspector who did exactly this and the cm had to deal with 3 unsettled and crying children through her inspection.

If you have a doctor's appointment I would say show proof and argue it - but it will depend on the inspector.

Of course if it's an inspection following a complaint then that's slightly more difficult because they have a legal right of entry so I wouldn't think your argument would be welcome - but again, there aren't any rules that I am aware of so you'd have to see what the inspector says at the time.

From Ofsted's point of view they will ask - what have you got to hide? Why aren't I allowed in? They will expect to see high quality care and education on any day, at any time and will inspect for that regardless of the notice period given before the inspection.

It's a very trying time at the moment for a lot of cms. I think it's great that you are taking this to Ofsted Simona! The Forum and FB letter was sent to PLA today as well I will upload the finished version later!

[Simona]

I have just received a reply from Ofsted regarding notice for scheduled inspections and unannounced ones

Here it is
''Dear Simona

For scheduled inspections, childminders will receive a call beforehand as they always have done. Where we are bringing forward an inspection as a result of a concern, these are usually carried out unannounced.'' (end)

and this is my reply

'' This a most welcome message.. unfortunately many cms are being inspected without any warning whatsoever when it relates to a scheduled cycle inspection...they report the inspector just turns up on the day and it is causing huge worries as they are concerned about being out on outings or school runs

You may hear about this more...not sure what they can do but it has reassured me.

Regards

Simona'' (end)

If we still get concerns cms have to report them and we can report them.

[Mouse]

I have just received a reply from Ofsted regarding notice for scheduled inspections and unannounced ones

Here it is
''Dear Simona

For scheduled inspections, childminders will receive a call beforehand as they always have done. Where we are bringing forward an inspection as a result of a concern, these are usually carried out unannounced.'' (end)

and this is my reply

'' This a most welcome message.. unfortunately many cms are being inspected without any warning whatsoever when it relates to a scheduled cycle inspection...they report the inspector just turns up on the day and it is causing huge worries as they are concerned about being out on outings or school runs

You may hear about this more...not sure what they can do but it has reassured me.

Regards

Simona'' (end)

If we still get concerns cms have to report them and we can report them.

It does make you wonder whether Ofsted even know inspectors are turning up unannounced.

I have to be honest, since there have been talks of unannounced inspections I have really got on top of my paperwork & I'm staying on top of it. It has always been OK, but not as good as it would be if I knew the inspector was coming I'm confident I'd be OK if an inspector called. Maybe not outstanding, but definitely OK!

That still doesn't stop me checking the peephole to see who's at the door before I answer it

[sarah707]

That still doesn't stop me checking the peephole to see who's at the door before I answer it

I usually have a couple of children behind me shouting 'Sarah DOOR!!!!' ... no way could I pretend I hadn't heard it

[Mouse]

I usually have a couple of children behind me shouting 'Sarah DOOR!!!!' ... no way could I pretend I hadn't heard it

Ha ha! I shut the playroom gate whenever I go to the door, so no one would be able to hear them

[Simona]

It does make you wonder whether Ofsted even know inspectors are turning up unannounced.

I have to be honest, since there have been talks of unannounced inspections I have really got on top of my paperwork & I'm staying on top of it. It has always been OK, but not as good as it would be if I knew the inspector was coming I'm confident I'd be OK if an inspector called. Maybe not outstanding, but definitely OK!

That still doesn't stop me checking the peephole to see who's at the door before I answer it

Very good point...does Ofsted know what the inspectors are up to? driving around country lanes and then popping in because they are in the area??
If turning up unannounced for a cycle inspection is not current practice Oftsed now know it is happening because that is what I put in the email.

Sarah..and if the face in the peephole is a stranger... you don't open it!!

[BlondeMoment]

What????!!!!!!
I had no idea they could turn up unannounced!
I don't actually open the door when I'm working unless I know who is there. Far too many incidents where I've been cornered by sales people, religious enthusiasts or god forbid...the in laws just popping in as they were passing.

[FussyElmo]

And yet I have just read of 2 cms on a fb group who have had unannounced visits.

[hectors house]

I have just replied to a post about Bluelion having a bad neck today and also on that thread stapleton said she had an accident yesterday and has black eyes and stitches in her head - but both of them are still working today - I don't expect either of them will be working at quite their usual 100% efficiency or enthusiasum but in the parents eyes they are absolute stars for carrying on and not letting them down - however would they get any brownie points today if Ofsted turned up for unannounced visit or would they get downgraded?

We all carry on regardless - not letting the parent down is our mantra - I have only had one sick day off in 8 years - but there have been countless days when if I had worked in a "proper" job I would have phoned in sick.