The (very) high cost of childcare
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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simona View Post
    Never tell parents what you charge when they first contact you....something most would not ask in an email.
    If they are genuine they would want to see what is on offer
    If they gasp then you can say a cheaper fee would not mean 'high quality'...don't all parents want high quality?

    High quality costs
    I actually have to disagree again. I am finding more and more over the last few years the first question parents ask by email or phone or by message on advertising sites is how much.

    I am with you I never used to discuss cost until the parent was in my home. For many reasons one being what I supply for my fee, that I don't add extra for food or outings , that I provide all changing needs apart from nappies etc. Many parents do look at the hourly fee/weekly fee instead of looking at the overall annual costs for everything and then dividing if they want the true fee. I do try to steer them away from cost but it is hard and I find that actually if the cost is the first thing they ask they are prob not going to come and see me first and go to the cheaper cms and then work their way back when they realise the standard some of the cheap one s offer.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by rickysmiths View Post
    I actually have to disagree again. I am finding more and more over the last few years the first question parents ask by email or phone or by message on advertising sites is how much.

    I am with you I never used to discuss cost until the parent was in my home. For many reasons one being what I supply for my fee, that I don't add extra for food or outings , that I provide all changing needs apart from nappies etc. Many parents do look at the hourly fee/weekly fee instead of looking at the overall annual costs for everything and then dividing if they want the true fee. I do try to steer them away from cost but it is hard and I find that actually if the cost is the first thing they ask they are prob not going to come and see me first and go to the cheaper cms and then work their way back when they realise the standard some of the cheap one s offer.
    No problem...no one is asking for agreement and as said 'it is my view'

    If a parent calls me and asks 'how much do you charge'? ....my reply is 'what needs do you have?...can you visit and we discuss?
    Also remember any parent can call our LA and ask generally what the 'going rate' is...often after the question on charges parents follow it up with 'such and such charge this'
    ...we must not under estimate the research parents do before they call us and the amount of chats they have amongst themselves.

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  4. #23
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    The price is always the first thing that parents ask me. I feel, to them it's the most important thing. I do feel that they are trying to judge whether or not they can afford it and keep their luxury car and their lifestyle.

    I live in an affluent town with a major train link to London, the price of a 2 bed flat next to the station is in the region of £280,000 - £300,000. The majority of my parents work full time and live in 4 bed houses which are around £360.000-£450.000, they have two cars on the drive, their kids do dancing, karate, theatre, sports clubs and older kids have iphones and Hollister/superdry clothing.

    Most don't complain about the £3.75ph fee (used to be £3.50 before Sept) which includes food, toddler groups. But I've had a few comments over the years. One lady who lives just around the corner always brings up how she finds it expensive and all her money goes to me. But then they had their garage turned into a playroom for the children and her kids wear branded clothing.

    Another, when she picked up her crying dd (tantrum) that I should be 'ok with the tantrums because of the money I bring in'

    Most parents are ok but money is top priority here even though these people are not on the poverty line
    Time Out.. The perfect time for thinking about what you're going to destroy next.

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  6. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCrakers View Post
    The price is always the first thing that parents ask me. I feel, to them it's the most important thing. I do feel that they are trying to judge whether or not they can afford it and keep their luxury car and their lifestyle.

    I live in an affluent town with a major train link to London, the price of a 2 bed flat next to the station is in the region of £280,000 - £300,000. The majority of my parents work full time and live in 4 bed houses which are around £360.000-£450.000, they have two cars on the drive, their kids do dancing, karate, theatre, sports clubs and older kids have iphones and Hollister/superdry clothing.

    Most don't complain about the £3.75ph fee (used to be £3.50 before Sept) which includes food, toddler groups. But I've had a few comments over the years. One lady who lives just around the corner always brings up how she finds it expensive and all her money goes to me. But then they had their garage turned into a playroom for the children and her kids wear branded clothing.

    Another, when she picked up her crying dd (tantrum) that I should be 'ok with the tantrums because of the money I bring in'

    Most parents are ok but money is top priority here even though these people are not on the poverty line
    That is where I think differently as money is in a way a priority for us all.
    I am not interested where parents live, how affluent they are or what they aspire to in terms of holidays and cars...that is not my main concern!
    what is the problem is making my business viable and refusing to discuss fees in an email or text
    A recent research found out the vast majority of parents do not visit a setting prior to registering their child...all is done by mobile and internet...I found no one in agreement with that

    I have another business and get calls from clients....the first question is 'can you visit and give me an idea of cost?'...so why can it not be the same for childcare and cms in particular?

    The remark by your parent about what 'you bring in' says it all really...respect is sadly missing there....eek indeed!

    In 1993 I started my preschool and charged £4 ph...normal as it was the average charge by other providers....can you survive on £3.75?

    Thanks for your input ...an eye opener in a way.

  7. #25
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    I think it's a completely fair question for parents to ask and I asked too as a parent looking for childcare.

    You wAnt to know the hourly charge and what's included, you want to know if you'll be penalised for being late, charged For their holidays and for yours. I think it's fair that they ask.

    I just tell parents upfront and publicise it on the Internet then if its complexity out of their reach I don't waste their time and they don't waste mine.

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  9. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simona View Post
    That is where I think differently as money is in a way a priority for us all.
    I am not interested where parents live, how affluent they are or what they aspire to in terms of holidays and cars...that is not my main concern!
    what is the problem is making my business viable and refusing to discuss fees in an email or text
    A recent research found out the vast majority of parents do not visit a setting prior to registering their child...all is done by mobile and internet...I found no one in agreement with that

    I have another business and get calls from clients....the first question is 'can you visit and give me an idea of cost?'...so why can it not be the same for childcare and cms in particular?

    The remark by your parent about what 'you bring in' says it all really...respect is sadly missing there....eek indeed!

    In 1993 I started my preschool and charged £4 ph...normal as it was the average charge by other providers....can you survive on £3.75?

    Thanks for your input ...an eye opener in a way.
    My post wasn't aimed at you Simona, it was just a comment at the cost of childcare
    Time Out.. The perfect time for thinking about what you're going to destroy next.

  10. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCrakers View Post
    My post wasn't aimed at you Simona, it was just a comment at the cost of childcare
    Yes I know...apologies if it came out that way...I should not have copied your comment ...it was a general reply even though I mentioned your fee comment.
    It is confusing when this is an open thread.

    Mumofone....if you are happy to discuss your fees by email or phone that is ok...if you put it on your website why do they ask you again? I would expect them to visit and look at what you offer ...no?
    One of the main recommendations to parents is to visit when a cm has children in her care
    I personally do not feel I want to discuss my late fees or any terms and conditions on the phone as I use this for different purposes

    I also said they can ask but the reply would be 'what do you need'?
    There is a lot that can be gained by face-to-face interviews and again we are different
    I can only go by 22 years of experience and what I feel is best for me.

  11. #28
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    I'm interested in what 'packages' people offer, I currently just charge by the hour so it's clear cut but when do you decide not to charge in this way?

  12. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by mumofone View Post
    I think it's a completely fair question for parents to ask and I asked too as a parent looking for childcare. You wAnt to know the hourly charge and what's included, you want to know if you'll be penalised for being late, charged For their holidays and for yours. I think it's fair that they ask. I just tell parents upfront and publicise it on the Internet then if its complexity out of their reach I don't waste their time and they don't waste mine.
    I do this too. I advertise my price and that way if the price puts them off then they're not right for me. If someone has to "get over" the price that their childcare will cost then won't there be a chance that they'll still feel a bit negative about it, month to month? I'd prefer to just avoid that whole awkwardness and mention my fees (and what's included from the get go) I even advise parents flick through my policies before they visit me, just to make sure that we're not wasting one another's time and if they're happy with what they read then we'll arrange a meeting.

    I did have my most recent sign up say "Oh, yeah that's good!" when I mentioned my fees and that made me worry that I'm charging too little! I was thinking of increasing a bit next September, but that's bound to be awkward. :S

  13. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCrakers View Post
    The price is always the first thing that parents ask me. I feel, to them it's the most important thing. I do feel that they are trying to judge whether or not they can afford it and keep their luxury car and their lifestyle. I live in an affluent town with a major train link to London, the price of a 2 bed flat next to the station is in the region of £280,000 - £300,000. The majority of my parents work full time and live in 4 bed houses which are around £360.000-£450.000, they have two cars on the drive, their kids do dancing, karate, theatre, sports clubs and older kids have iphones and Hollister/superdry clothing. Most don't complain about the £3.75ph fee (used to be £3.50 before Sept) which includes food, toddler groups. But I've had a few comments over the years. One lady who lives just around the corner always brings up how she finds it expensive and all her money goes to me. But then they had their garage turned into a playroom for the children and her kids wear branded clothing. Another, when she picked up her crying dd (tantrum) that I should be 'ok with the tantrums because of the money I bring in' Most parents are ok but money is top priority here even though these people are not on the poverty line
    I have similar house prices near me (only in euros not pounds if you see what I mean.. €280-300000 for a flat ,
    House prices at least €300-400 000. Of course as a young couple starting a family and having a mortgage childcare is another expense but I charge €5 per hour so would have thought you could charge more if all relative if you see what I mean?! Cheeky parent to comment on what you are bringing in.. If they saw our expenses 😱. I charge more for very part time like half days etc around €5.50-6 but interestingly I usually don't have trouble filling spaces because of the fact I take mindees out so much (most local don't ) but when j tried to up it to 5.50 - 6 for fuller time spaces I couldn't fill them. So that's obv the limit here. Although I hVe a friend just up the road (well five / ten mins Away) who doesn't take kids out at all as she is nervous , has two big hairy dogs (purs lives outside they do put people off I know) and charges €7 per hour!! She only works part time but most of mine are part time too and some of my mindees live in her area. Go figure!!

  14. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCrakers View Post
    The price is always the first thing that parents ask me. I feel, to them it's the most important thing. I do feel that they are trying to judge whether or not they can afford it and keep their luxury car and their lifestyle.

    I live in an affluent town with a major train link to London, the price of a 2 bed flat next to the station is in the region of £280,000 - £300,000. The majority of my parents work full time and live in 4 bed houses which are around £360.000-£450.000, they have two cars on the drive, their kids do dancing, karate, theatre, sports clubs and older kids have iphones and Hollister/superdry clothing.

    Most don't complain about the £3.75ph fee (used to be £3.50 before Sept) which includes food, toddler groups. But I've had a few comments over the years. One lady who lives just around the corner always brings up how she finds it expensive and all her money goes to me. But then they had their garage turned into a playroom for the children and her kids wear branded clothing.

    Another, when she picked up her crying dd (tantrum) that I should be 'ok with the tantrums because of the money I bring in'

    Most parents are ok but money is top priority here even though these people are not on the poverty line

    So similar we live a 45 min tube ride from Baker Street just inside the M25 in a reasonably well off area. New bedsits next to the station £300,000 and some flats being built opposite will start at £600,000 for a 2 bed!! They have all sold off plan and when the ones by the station came on the market there was a line around the block and a few people camped out overnight! We moved here 11 years ago because it was cheaper and much nicer than were we were 10 miles nearer to London our house has doubled in value in that time to a level that we couldn't afford to buy it now!

    I have a parent at the moment cutting back to the bone due to lack of money, dad only gets £120pm Vouchers because of his income they have bought a bigger house (Aug) number 2 due next week, they have had a massive extension built, new kitchen, bathroom, decorated throughout, since then they have bought a new car each. But now having said they would continue the 4 days they have cut the days, cut the hours to barely 45 hours thinking the funding will cover it??? They want continuity of care and for the new baby and they think I will now hold two places open when they have spent so much they need not have done? She is also on full pay for 6 months and is only having until Sept off and still getting her Vouchers. Priorities comes to mind.

    I have replaced them and will be giving them notice in the next couple of weeks because I can't afford not to.
    Last edited by rickysmiths; 13-01-2016 at 12:42 PM.

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  16. #32
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    I suppose it depends on why they are asking price. If it's just because they want the cheapest they can find then nothing you can do.
    However if it's a family who has worked out their budget and say for example they know they can afford £4 an hour is it worth them visiting cms who are more expensive. If a family has a budget and lots do it won't be worth anyone's time if they genuinely cannot afford it.
    When someone tells you nothing is impossible, tell them to go slam a revolving door

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  18. #33
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    I advertise my costs, it makes things easier for budgeting families. I don't want to go through the meeting etc only to find out they won't pay my fees and I won't reduce them. Saves everyone time and awkwardness

  19. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by FussyElmo View Post
    I suppose it depends on why they are asking price. If it's just because they want the cheapest they can find then nothing you can do.
    However if it's a family who has worked out their budget and say for example they know they can afford £4 an hour is it worth them visiting cms who are more expensive. If a family has a budget and lots do it won't be worth anyone's time if they genuinely cannot afford it.
    This is a family who have been with me for two years and it would seem childcare is not top of their list as they seem to be attaching little priority to securing a valuable place for two children. I have worked with many families over the years in a similar situation and they will come and discuss a plan.

    This mum did that in November and was keeping the 4 full days and since then they have bought 2 new cars (they only really needed one as Dad had a smart car) did all sorts of expensive stuff over Christmas including a big engagement ring, then she just handed me a spreadsheet in the New Year of her 'new' hours!!! Which instead of 36 hours over 4 days is barely 15 hours over three days with a 10am start instead of an 8am which completely does me going out anywhere, no discussion just this is what my hours will be!!. No one dictates to me like that and I can't afford to do less than half the hours how arrogant of her to think I could!

    I had four people asking for care last week so I have a couple who will very neatly fill the 4 days and want to use me as soon as possible so I will allow the family I have to save even more money by letting them off their Notice Period and returning their Deposit. Wouldn't want them to go short!

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  21. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by rickysmiths View Post
    This is a family who have been with me for two years and it would seem childcare is not top of their list as they seem to be attaching little priority to securing a valuable place for two children. I have worked with many families over the years in a similar situation and they will come and discuss a plan. This mum did that in November and was keeping the 4 full days and since then they have bought 2 new cars (they only really needed one as Dad had a smart car) did all sorts of expensive stuff over Christmas including a big engagement ring, then she just handed me a spreadsheet in the New Year of her 'new' hours!!! Which instead of 36 hours over 4 days is barely 15 hours over three days with a 10am start instead of an 8am which completely does me going out anywhere, no discussion just this is what my hours will be!!. No one dictates to me like that and I can't afford to do less than half the hours how arrogant of her to think I could! I had four people asking for care last week so I have a couple who will very neatly fill the 4 days and want to use me as soon as possible so I will allow the family I have to save even more money by letting them off their Notice Period and returning their Deposit. Wouldn't want them to go short!
    Unbelievable.. You wouldn't have minded so much if they had had a chat with you. I wouldn't be holding spaces either x

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