30 hours funded care 2016

[agency12]

Sounds like it's been brought forward
to September - bbc says it will cause
Childcare meltdown .. Certainly the schools
won't be able to cope

[moggy]

Sounds like it's been brought forward
to September - bbc says it will cause
Childcare meltdown .. Certainly the schools
won't be able to cope

Free childcare trials brought forward, PM to announce - BBC News

The key words are 'trials' 'in some areas'.
I am glad they are trialling it in some areas, imagine if they didn't trial it and went national...!
I hope they are transparent in their findings and listen to feedback from the trial.

[bunyip]

I don't think you understand what "a central pillar of Conservative policy" means.

Of course it will work. It has to work. They've already decided it will work.

[bunyip]

Btw, re: that BBC News link.

I'm not sure which is more scary.............................

................the picture of Our Glorious Leader finger-painting or the previous one (before the page was updated) of a little girl at a nursery easel with an extremely macho adult tattoo on her right arm.

[agency12]

They mean trialling before September 2016

It's happening - can you imagine what would happen if the Tories 'took away' childcare 'entitlement' from voters - they have to make it work it's now too big to fail

[FussyElmo]

Sounds like it's been brought forward
to September - bbc says it will cause
Childcare meltdown .. Certainly the schools
won't be able to cope

Why won't the schools be able to cope?

Just means that parents will not have to pay top ups for full days.

Or 1 child doing 30 hours is the same as 2 children doing 15 hours.

Schools manage to fit all the children in come reception when it's full time

[Mouse]

I don't think you understand what "a central pillar of Conservative policy" means.

Of course it will work. It has to work. They've already decided it will work.

Like agencies? Didn't they decide agencies would be a massive success and revolutionise the childminding industry?

I'm still waiting...

It didn't work then when they decided to push on with their plans, despite opposition and research showing agencies wouldn't work. Maybe this idea of 30 hours "free" childcare will fail unless they take their heads out of the sand.

[hectors house]

I know I argued against it before, but I really need the ratio for childminders increased to 1:4 for this September as I have got a new baby booked in for Tues & Wed and existing parents have since needed to increase their days, but I can't take on new baby as new business not COC - but she has been booked in since last Dec.

[agency12]

I suppose if the schools are lined up for feeding (and charging for food) all these 4 year olds it may work - it's just a longer day for them, more 'free' hours will mean more children taking their 'entitlement' especially if the government are pushing for mums back to work, which deep down this is all about

Can't see the agencies revolutionising anything, but cm's will get inspections every six months, which has to tighten up the industry

[moggy]

I know I argued against it before, but I really need the ratio for childminders increased to 1:4 for this September as I have got a new baby booked in for Tues & Wed and existing parents have since needed to increase their days, but I can't take on new baby as new business not COC - but she has been booked in since last Dec.

This maybe worth taking up with Ofsted/DofEd as it was mentioned by Gill Jones, deputy director for early education at Ofsted, when she spoke at the Pacey Conference in May 2015 in London. I particularly noted it as it was a scenario I hadn't thought of before- she was answering a COC question and was describing some situations where COC was OK- she said if a family had said they were leaving and you took on a new child then the existing family changed their minds that it was COC. Now, whether she meant if the new family had signed contracts or actually started care, not I do not know, and a lot would depend on well documented evidence of dates... but the message was that COC was OK but it was the QUALITY OF CARE that was going to be judged in these cases, and she could think of no cases of a CMer being penalised for COC EXCEPT where care was judged to be suffering because of the ratios.

Please, do not take my word for it- but maybe worth getting in touch with Gill Jones/Ofsted/Dept of Ed and push for a response?

[hectors house]

This maybe worth taking up with Ofsted/DofEd as it was mentioned by Gill Jones, deputy director for early education at Ofsted, when she spoke at the Pacey Conference in May 2015 in London. I particularly noted it as it was a scenario I hadn't thought of before- she was answering a COC question and was describing some situations where COC was OK- she said if a family had said they were leaving and you took on a new child then the existing family changed their minds that it was COC. Now, whether she meant if the new family had signed contracts or actually started care, not I do not know, and a lot would depend on well documented evidence of dates... but the message was that COC was OK but it was the QUALITY OF CARE that was going to be judged in these cases, and she could think of no cases of a CMer being penalised for COC EXCEPT where care was judged to be suffering because of the ratios.

Please, do not take my word for it- but maybe worth getting in touch with Gill Jones/Ofsted/Dept of Ed and push for a response?

Thank you - I will try to get in touch with Gill Jones and let you all know the answer - if and when I get one!

[agency12]

This is a can of worms in a minefield of hot potatoes, ofsted and the government baulked at changing ratios, but (it was their 'go to' option last year but parents were having none of it) they went with 'you choose your ages but evidence your ratios are correct' instead

Who takes the fall of an over-ratio child has a fall - the cm ? Not if ofsted approved the extra child, I'm not sure what criteria ofsted would use to ok it in the first place - outstanding'ness ?

Could an outstanding cm maintain that level with 1/4 ? If they lose outstanding does a child have to leave ?

[Simona]

This is a can of worms in a minefield of hot potatoes, ofsted and the government baulked at changing ratios, but (it was their 'go to' option last year but parents were having none of it) they went with 'you choose your ages but evidence your ratios are correct' instead

Who takes the fall of an over-ratio child has a fall - the cm ? Not if ofsted approved the extra child, I'm not sure what criteria ofsted would use to ok it in the first place - outstanding'ness ?

Could an outstanding cm maintain that level with 1/4 ? If they lose outstanding does a child have to leave ?

Ofsted do not approve extra children...it is up to the Cm to increase their numbers as long as the care of all children is not affected. and we do not exceed 6 under 8...it has been done by many cms and well blogged in the past.
Variations are 'out' now and that is reflected in our registration certificate.

Moggy ...the answer you got from Gill Jones is exactly the one I received from the DfE and posted it.
It is the care of children that is important...in addition DfE said we can have 6 under 5 regardless of continuity of care or new business....however...I agreed to disagree with the forum as they said NO.
If something goes wrong on inspection day even an outstanding Cms will have problems and that is the reason for a downgrade.
Could a cm cope with 4 children...I believe so as long as she is well organised and has different age children.

This is a question for London OBC and I will take along the email from the DfE to put to the Ofsted panel on the day.
The EYFS is written by the DfE and they obviously differ from Ofsted....EYFS is due an update soon, lets hope they have taken cms concerns onboard.

Reading all the various reports today about the 30 hrs it seems some providers are worried the ratio issue will resurface and this time there is no Clegg to put a brake on it....excellent article in EYE out today on this.
I would bet a little money the ratio increase will be re introduced as part of the often spoken 'expansion'...I wonder if parents will complain this time at a ratio change when 30 hrs are at stake...it is a lot of money for them...interesting times ahead.

We have not heard anything from schools as yet on how they would manage 30 hrs for nursery and reception classes..
As for agencies I am uneasy at how quiet it has gone but I don't think it is because they are not successful...hope to be wrong.

[Mouse]

Personally, I hope ratios are looked at again.

Those of us who did want an increase were beaten down by the majority, but maybe this time we will get our way

[Simona]

Personally, I hope ratios are looked at again.

Those of us who did want an increase were beaten down by the majority, but maybe this time we will get our way

I have no problem with CMs having more than 3 children...barring those who may take advantage....if you know what I mean!
I did worry that Truss wanted us to have so many babies...that is a real worry.
In a way we can still have a higher ratio but it has been dogged by DfE and Ofsted working on a different tangent....not sure who is in charge there!
They have had so many enquiries you think they would have sorted this issue by now...we live in hope they will address it soon instead of giving those frustrating answers when we enquire.