Do I need a variance or not?! Ofsted not sure!!

[peggy]

Okay, heres the drill

I care for one child aged 5 (his birthday being 31 October 2004) and is in reception. I have him after school term time only. Mon - Fri

I have recently been approached by another parent who requires exactly the same thing, (his birthdate being 30 June 2005)

Both children are now in full time education.

My cert states that:
may care for no more than 4 children under 8 years of age, not more than 1 maybe in the early years age group, and of these none may be under 1 year at any one time

Initially when I rang ofsted they said that as one child was aged 5 and in full time education they dont come into the early years age group

When I queried the subnote of my cert "The early years age group is children from birth to 31 August after their fifth birthday" all of a sudden the guy I spoke to said that I needed to apply for a variance.

Okay, not a prob looked at the variance form and checked the guidelines and this says

Each childminder may care for:
a maximum of six children under the age of eight;
■ of these six children, a maximum of three may be young children

■ however where four- and five-year-old children only attend the childminding setting before and/or after a normal school day, they may be classed as children over the age of five for the purposes of the adult:child ratio;

Arrrrrrghhhhh!!! Do I need to apply for a variance?! I am thinking that I do not considering that both children are aged 4 and 5 and in full time education and in this case I will not be exceeding my numbers?!

What do you think?! I have a sneaky suspiscion that only one of them requires me on a short time basis and therefore I think by the time my variance (if i should need it) come through they will no longer require me!

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. (I have an eight, four yr old (preschool) and 4 month old baby as my own children and am not childminding anyone else, if this helps)

Thank you in advance! x x x

[FizzysFriends]

I would say as they are both at school and you aren't going over your numbers then no you don't.

[beccas]

no you dont my ofsted inspector told me when i queried this for my daughter that ofsted office workers dont know what they are talking aboutthey are classed as over 5's

[little miss chatterbox]

i would say not, I had my certificate re-done as I wanted to apply for a variance because child is not 5 until august but are in full time sch as of tomorrow.

They basically put a caveat on my certificate which says "when caring for a child aged 4-5 in full time education the number of children in the early years age group can be increased by the number of children in full time education" or words to that effect!

xxxx

[peggy]

Thanks hun, that was what I was thinking, I guess it would be a different kettle of fish should I have to care for any of the two during the school hols maybe? Its term time only at present, but guess I should query this just in case I am asked to care for both of them all day????

[Pauline]

no you dont my ofsted inspector told me when i queried this for my daughter that ofsted office workers dont know what they are talking aboutthey are classed as over 5's

Well they have changed the rules so often I can understand the poor office staff not having a clue!

This thread should also help you Peggy:

http://childmindinghelp.co.uk/forum/...ad.php?t=41866

[TheBTeam]

I think you are fine, your cert allows you three children that are not in the early years age group, regardless of whether the actual age of the child is 4 or 5, as long as they are attending school for full days (ie 10 sessions).

If you care for a 4 year old who for whatever reason that does not attend school for the 10 sessions then they count in the early years age group.

IMO you could have a third child in this age range also, and once counted in this age group they still count during the holidays.

[peggy]

Thanks everyone! Gosh it is really a mindfield! Going on pre-EYFS its exactly the same as before, its just the bit where they have put in about the the early years being 31 August after their fifth birthday, thats thrown me!

Excellentee....! Thank you so so much for clearing this up for me! x x

[Chatterbox Childcare]

Once a child goes to school full time (10 sessions) then they are classed as 5 for ratio purposes but still come under the EYFS until 31st August after their 5th birthday BUT you must have the clause on there stating so. This should be a standard change when certificates are changed but if you didn't have it, just request it and it will be done immediately.

[sandy64]

Okay, heres the drill

I care for one child aged 5 (his birthday being 31 October 2004) and is in reception. I have him after school term time only. Mon - Fri

I have recently been approached by another parent who requires exactly the same thing, (his birthdate being 30 June 2005)

Both children are now in full time education.

My cert states that:
may care for no more than 4 children under 8 years of age, not more than 1 maybe in the early years age group, and of these none may be under 1 year at any one time

Initially when I rang ofsted they said that as one child was aged 5 and in full time education they dont come into the early years age group

When I queried the subnote of my cert "The early years age group is children from birth to 31 August after their fifth birthday" all of a sudden the guy I spoke to said that I needed to apply for a variance.

Okay, not a prob looked at the variance form and checked the guidelines and this says

Each childminder may care for:
a maximum of six children under the age of eight;
■ of these six children, a maximum of three may be young children

■ however where four- and five-year-old children only attend the childminding setting before and/or after a normal school day, they may be classed as children over the age of five for the purposes of the adult:child ratio;

Arrrrrrghhhhh!!! Do I need to apply for a variance?! I am thinking that I do not considering that both children are aged 4 and 5 and in full time education and in this case I will not be exceeding my numbers?!

What do you think?! I have a sneaky suspiscion that only one of them requires me on a short time basis and therefore I think by the time my variance (if i should need it) come through they will no longer require me!

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. (I have an eight, four yr old (preschool) and 4 month old baby as my own children and am not childminding anyone else, if this helps)

Thank you in advance! x x x

hi ive had a variation 4 4 under school age and 2 in reception yr 4yr olds and i didnt need variation 4 the schoolies i also had a inspection when they were all with me hope this helps your worries

[iwantmyownway]

You are registered for 4 minded children under 8. Your own 8 year old does not come into your numbers, so you can have 4 minded, your own 2 younger ones and your 8 yr old, so yes you can look after the 4 yr old (who is classed as a rising 5, in other words an over 5 (even though they are still 4)) and the 5 yr old. I take it your 4 yr old is in nursery? therefore you can also have 1 x under 5 and one more over 5. Hope this helps