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kitty
05-05-2008, 08:18 PM
Just had a call from a mum, who's children I mind for occasionally. Dad beat her up last week, was arrested and has left the family home this evening drunk, to stay at his brothers. She wants me to watch the girls after school tomorrow as she's just started a new job. I am in shock as they are such a lovely couple and the kids adore their dad and he adores them. Have been looking after the girls a couple of times a month for a while now and am really close to them. I am getting concerned that if I continue to look after them, I might get wrapped up in the domestics and that he may come and get the children from me, even if he's not supposed to - maybe drunk. Can any one give me any advice on this situation please? Thanks
Kitty

sarah707
05-05-2008, 08:54 PM
I've been involved in a few break ups...

The first thing I do is tell the mum that while I totally sympathise with her, I cannot listen to her upsets... I need to concentrate on the children and if she comes when they are due to be collected and pours her heart out, then the children are either listening which is not good or being neglected...

Then I ask if she is worried about the dad collecting (or sometimes it's the mum that's the problem... ) If she is, then we agree on the contract (the bit where it says who should come to collect) that I will ring the mum / the police / a relative.. if the father comes but that I will not let the children go, however much they plead. I know it's their dad but if he's violent (and I once had a very drunk and violent mum on the doorstep - it wasn't pleasant) then tough... they do not go without agreement from the parent who they live with.

I hope this helps you to cope. sure other people have experience of this as well and will give you their tips.

Put yourself and your family first and if it gets too much for you, then give notice. xxhugsxx

miffy
05-05-2008, 09:14 PM
This is a difficult one for you - your first priority has to be the children - their world has turned upside down and they may be confused angry upset or any other emotion you can think of.

If they are living with their mum you must sort out who is collecting them and have it detailed in the contract so that you are clear what to do if dad tries to collect.

Above all try and stay neutral - you never know what might happen - they may get back together and then it might be difficult if you have been privy to all that's been happening between them.

Hope you can work through this but your own family has to come first

miffy xx

Tatia
06-05-2008, 07:56 AM
And you've only got mum's side of the story, too. I wouldn't take sides at all or get caught in the middle. If you suspect Dad is drunk when he picks up the kids, you are perfectly entitled to call the police. It's not your job to take on a drunk person!

sandy
06-05-2008, 08:58 AM
hi,
I also had a similar situation a while ago.

The mum provided me with a solicitors letter to show to police if ever the dad showed up to collect the child.

As she had custody and was the one who paid me, then it was her I took notice of.

As it happened he never showed up, just phoned once to talk to child.

Now, a year or so on, things are much better but he is still not authorised to collect child.

Luckily his relationship with his daughter is great and she adores him,

Like everyone has said, it's the safety of the children that comes first

Good luck

Sandy

Pudding Girl
06-05-2008, 09:08 AM
BY all means never let a drunken parent take the children, in this instance call the police.

BUT - we were told on pre reg as someone asked this exact Q - if both parents have parental responsibility, you cannot prevent them from taking them unless there are court orders etc in place. I am in Scotland and it might not be the same everywhere, so check with your DO urgently.

I agree with Sarah to not be drawn in, it can put you in an impossible position.

Blaze
06-05-2008, 09:15 AM
BY all means never let a drunken parent take the children, in this instance call the police.

BUT - we were told on pre reg as someone asked this exact Q - if both parents have parental responsibility, you cannot prevent them from taking them unless there are court orders etc in place. I am in Scotland and it might not be the same everywhere, so check with your DO urgently.

I agree with Sarah to not be drawn in, it can put you in an impossible position.

It's the same...I've been in this position...make sure you explain this to Mum! :)

susi513
06-05-2008, 09:42 AM
Good point Tatia, important not to take sides, however shocking the tale may sound there's always 2 sides to every story.

Lou is right, I'm in England and we had a letter a year or 2 ago explaining that without a court order we cannot legally refuse to handover the child to someone with parental responsibility. You should have a copy of the court order for your records.

In a situation where you've never met the absent parent you can ask for ID and proof of parental responsibility before handing over the child. Which gives you time to contact parent who signed contract.

If you know the parent then you can't really insist on ID. But if you fear for the childs safety (if parent is drunk or violent) then you can contact Social Services/Child protection and police for instructions, the same as you would if the parent was living with the child. You do not have to let the parent into your property, of course.

If you have no cause to suspect the child's safety would be at risk you have to handover the child regardless of what the other parent says. You could explain its your policy to notify the parent living with the child to keep them informed, and give them a call. You could then try to delay the parent who's collecting, while gathering up belongings and filling in paperwork - getting them to sign attendance etc. But thats all you can do.

jaja
06-05-2008, 12:01 PM
The poor kids, from the kids point try and make sure you still provide them with the loving homely enviroment and make sure they dont hear and see parents getting upset. Plus make it clear that you are here to help them, they may need to talk to someone other than their parents.

Bless them

Good luck

xxxx

deeb66
06-05-2008, 01:01 PM
BY all means never let a drunken parent take the children, in this instance call the police.

BUT - we were told on pre reg as someone asked this exact Q - if both parents have parental responsibility, you cannot prevent them from taking them unless there are court orders etc in place. I am in Scotland and it might not be the same everywhere, so check with your DO urgently.

I agree with Sarah to not be drawn in, it can put you in an impossible position.

This is definately correct.

I had a similar case about 18 months ago where mum & dad were getting a divorce and mum told me not to release child to the dad (have to say that dad wasn't violent in anyway!!)

I was very uncomfortable with this so I rang and spoke to NCMA's legal team and sort advice.

If both parents have custody you cannot refuse to release a child into their care........this is considered a domestic dispute.

I was advised to tell mum this and that the best I could do is to contact her if dad arrived to collect!

Even if a parent turns up drunk you are still not legally allowed to refuse to hand the child over......in these circumstances you have to try to talk them out of it and if that fails then you are to hand the child over and then call the police immediately and advise them of all details so that they can arrest for drink driving and take custody of child!

mrsb
06-05-2008, 01:08 PM
I've also had this problem but luckily the dad never turned up without permission. He was also a drinker and I felt awful letting the child go with him, I spoke to the mum and she was too scared to call the police so she spoke to them instead and got a direct number to my local police station which is literally 5 mins away and I ended up ringing them when the little girl was collected and the dad stank of booze again, Luckily or unluckily whichever way you look at it, he was just under the limit but he got a damn good ticking off etc and he never did it again.

kitty
06-05-2008, 07:12 PM
Thank you all for your advice. I did have the girls today and they were a bit quiet but otherwise OK. Dad didn't show thank goodness. Mum is staying in a safe house now and I'm not sure when I'll have the girls again. I am really shocked to hear that I can hand the girls over when he's drunk, not happy with that at all, if it happens I think I'll ring the police and hope they arrive before he leaves. I think mum's trying to sort out a court order, so will also get a copy of that.
Thanks again for all your support
Kitty
xxx

miffy
06-05-2008, 07:47 PM
Pleased it was Ok for you today Kitty

Hope mum gets the situation sorted so at least you know where you stand

miffy xx

angeldelight
07-05-2008, 09:11 AM
Glad you seem to have sorted things out

Hope it all works out for them

Angel xx