Fed Up :(

[ClaireCM]

I am at my wits end this week.
I mind two boys both 3 and a half who each do two days at a preschool together (these are the days that enable me to hold onto my sanity at the moment!)
Saying that, the last month, their behaviour has got worse and worse and EVEN WORSE. On monday they literally trashed my house, like two whirlwinds who were impossible to control.
They were throwing toy cars and my glass patio doors, jumping up and down on the sofa, swinging off the trees in my garden, throwing small stones at our guinea pigs, back chatting, ignoring everything i said, they kicked our wooden dolls house around the dining room, were throwing anything they could lay their hands on indoors, kicked one of the babies i mind...... There is lots more.
NOTHING i do/ have done had taken effect with them. The monday this all happened they ended up sat on the living room floor with one book each for an hour and a half before i think i had finally made an impact.
The very next day.... back to the same shocking behaviour.
I have been in tears every day this week and the total lack of support or even batting an eye lid from one parent is driving me crazy.

Last night i found myself updating my CV and writing a cover letter and printing them off. I looked up all the schools, preschools and nurseries in the area and will be sending them out next week if nothing changes.

All i want to hear is some reassurance, or someone to tell me what to do or that it isnt just me that is having to put up with this.
If i could tell the parents of these two boys that im quitting childminding, and then carry on with the other 3 children i look after then i would!!!!!!

[Blackcat]

write them a letter hun , explaining everything in your post .
Tell them of the dangers they put other mindees in and that you will send a bill for any items broken by this behaviour and basicall warn them that if it continues that you will terminate the contracts immetiatley

big hugs anyway xxxxx

[Mookins]

hun you dont have to tell the parents you are quitting, just give 4 weeks notice ...but the fact that they kicked a baby i would be having serious words with parents and giving notice immediate effect!!

if you can honestly say you have tried everything then without the parents help you are banging your head against a brick wall hun

xx

[PixiePetal]

first off - big hug for you :)

I would say you need to met with parents and come up with a plan for their behaviour as you can't carry on like this. Give a time limit for improvement or say you may have to give notice - especially as other mindee is getting hurt (to say nothing of your sanity!)

sounds like they see so much of each other they have made a brotherly type bond and feel invincible when they have each other. I wonder how they behave when alone? or at home?

good luck x

[ClaireCM]

Thanks, brought tears to my eyes just reading your replies and feeling that little bit less alone!!
The thing is, on monday i had serious words with both boys' parents and they just do not take it seriously enough. Its almost like they think that i am meant to just put up with it, you know?
In fact after the whole ' sitting with a book' scenario, one parent came back the next morning and asked me not to ever do that again because he had been 'bouncing off the walls at home that night.' I simply said to her I was at the end of my tether and that they were taking not one bit of notice of my warnings, tellings off, time outs etc and i had no other option. She said nothing in reply!

[ClaireCM]

With regards to the brotherly bond - yes you are right, this is exactly what its like, however, for a while they were fine each on their own without the other but now its got to the point where although they arent quite as bad when they are separate, their behaviour is still terrible. One more than the other also.

[Blackcat]

one question :
are theses boys effecting your family, health or quality of care to another mindees?

[ClaireCM]

Well i am about ten times more stressed out than usual, i have been crying every day! They also take up my time away from the other children and activities i plan etc dont get done either because they dont deserve to do them or because its physically impossible to get anything done aside from watching them like a hawk or telling them off!

[Blackcat]

Well i am about ten times more stressed out than usual, i have been crying every day! They also take up my time away from the other children and activities i plan etc dont get done either because they dont deserve to do them or because its physically impossible to get anything done aside from watching them like a hawk or telling them off!

there is your answer , get rid of them!

[Mouse]

What a horrible situation for you to be in. How do the boys behave when they are at pre-school together? Do they have problems with them?

I would write letters to both sets of parents saying that despite all your efforts they boys' behaviour continues to be disruptive to the setting and is posing real danger to them, you, other minded children and your property. Say that you are more than happy to work with parents to try to resolve the issues, but that if parents aren't willing to work with you, or if there is no improvement within the next 2 weeks, you will have no option but to give immediate notice.

Keep the letter very factual and don't make any apology in it. By writing a letter and offering to work with parents, you are showing that you have tried. If you do part on bad terms and parents decided to complain at all, you have shown that you have done everything you can to sort out the problems. Hopefully it won't come to that, but cover yourself just in case.

[AliceK]

In my setting this behaviour would constitute termination with immediate effect.
It sounds like the parents just aren't on board with this and so nothing is going to change. Terminate with immediate notice on the grounds that their behaviour is dangerous and seriously impacting on your care for the other mindees.

xxxxx

[caz3007]

I had this with two boys who were much older. They came after school and would literally bounce off each other and it was really hard work. One parent supported, and the other didnt. These boys spent lots of time together outside of school

They were very close and comments were made about why they didnt come the same days in the holidays (both ad hoc care) and I made it quite clear to them it was cos I wouldnt cope with them both at the same time.

How dare the parent tell you not to sit them down seperately with a book, cos it makes it hard work for them when they get home :angry:

With that attitude I think I would give immediate notice especially as a baby is being hurt. Then go and enjoy the summer holidays hopefully with a harmonious setting most of the time

[ClaireCM]

Thank you everyone, it really does help me to hear your replies.
There are a couple of things that are still worrying me that i would love to hear your advice on.
One is that, i just think that even with the circumstances and their behaviour etc, i feel kind of silly.... Like its not really enough to be terminating their contracts. I WANT to do it, but i feel like they will just think im being ridiculous and uncooperative.
Also, one of the boys mothers is good friends with my mum, she sees this as a bit of a get out of jail pass i think as she thinks i will do anything for her etc. I feel that this is especially not going to go down well with her if i choose to act like you all have told me.
Its just the awkwardness of it, it makes me feel so uncomfortable and I worry what they are going to think of or say about me.

[ClaireCM]

What a horrible situation for you to be in. How do the boys behave when they are at pre-school together? Do they have problems with them?.

I dont know really, the preschool is so busy and although i have thought about asking them i never really get a chance to. Also i sense from them that they think they shouldnt really be discussing things with me as im neither boys' parent. We havent heard anything bad from the preschool so i would assume their behaviour there is fine, either that or its nowhere near as bad as it is with me or we would have been spoken to about it, surely.

[Mouse]

Thank you everyone, it really does help me to hear your replies.
There are a couple of things that are still worrying me that i would love to hear your advice on.
One is that, i just think that even with the circumstances and their behaviour etc, i feel kind of silly.... Like its not really enough to be terminating their contracts. I WANT to do it, but i feel like they will just think im being ridiculous and uncooperative.
Also, one of the boys mothers is good friends with my mum, she sees this as a bit of a get out of jail pass i think as she thinks i will do anything for her etc. I feel that this is especially not going to go down well with her if i choose to act like you all have told me.
Its just the awkwardness of it, it makes me feel so uncomfortable and I worry what they are going to think of or say about me.

This is where you have to get tough, put your business head on and put yourself and your family first. You're not out to be friends with these parents, you're in this to earn a living in your own home. If they think you're being uncooperative (which you're most definitely not!), so what. At the end of the day, your sanity and happiness is more important than what they think.
As to the mum who is friends with your mum, stop letting her use that as an excuse. She's happily taking advantage of you, so why should you show her any respect?

When parents and children behave like this it's no good sitting round and hoping things will sort themselves out. Only you can do that. It's get tough or put up with this for the rest of the time they're with you. What's worse - a bit of awkwardness at having to deal with the situation, or weeks, months or years of having these children and their parents treat you with so little respect?

[AliceK]

Thank you everyone, it really does help me to hear your replies.
There are a couple of things that are still worrying me that i would love to hear your advice on.
One is that, i just think that even with the circumstances and their behaviour etc, i feel kind of silly.... Like its not really enough to be terminating their contracts. I WANT to do it, but i feel like they will just think im being ridiculous and uncooperative.
Also, one of the boys mothers is good friends with my mum, she sees this as a bit of a get out of jail pass i think as she thinks i will do anything for her etc. I feel that this is especially not going to go down well with her if i choose to act like you all have told me.
Its just the awkwardness of it, it makes me feel so uncomfortable and I worry what they are going to think of or say about me.

Not enough???? They wouldn't get away with that kind of behaviour in my house for even just 1 day. You are not being silly. Do what you need to do and *** what anyone else thinks. Your house, your business, your sanity!!! When you get another child or 2 to replace these 2 you will realise that this behaviour is not the norm and you do not have to put up with it.
Good luck

xxxxx

[caz3007]

Claire - just remember you havent done anything wrong. And just cos one parent is friends with your mum, it doesnt give the family the right to have you in tears every day.

I would be in tears if I had two small children who wouldnt do as I said and were trying to destroy my toys, home and hurting other children and the parents wouldnt do anything to help. Its frustrating and not nice.

Only you can make a decision and dont let yourself be a doormat especially to the one who asked you not to make the child sit quietly which you obviously needed to do for your own sanity. This parent especially appears to have no respect for you and the work you are doing.

If you dont want to give notice, Mouse gave some really good advice about putting it in writing and giving it two weeks for the parents and you to come up with a plan on how to deal with the behaviour.

Big hugs to you

[ziggy]

Terminate now!

I did the same a month ago, didnt realise how stressed i was till child left. I lost £500 a month but peace of mind is worth it. Other children and myself are so much happier.

I know its hard but this job is lonely and stressful at best of times and having disruptive children as well as uncooperative parents just isnt worth it

Good luck xx

[wendywu]

[QUOTE=AliceK;958088]In my setting this behaviour would constitute termination with immediate effect.




Same here, kicking a baby and throwing stones at my animals and trying to smash glass doors would mean that that they would walk out my door that evening and not return.

Get rid of them and do it NOW and feel so much better for doing it :thumbsup:

[teacake2]

Claire, I am in the exact same position as you, the boys are just 3, what is it about that age, they are absolutely uncontrollable at times, they too throw anything and everything including trying to throw the cat, they pick on the other one I look after as well.
One of them will attack anyone who is around, pushes them over, pokes eyes, pulls hair, sticks his tongue out if I ask him not to do something.
It has affected my health to such an extent I am constantly at the doctors at the moment for one thing or another, I normally only go every 6 months for repeat prescriptions.
The mother of one of them has decided to put him in nursery as from August, she thinks it will be better for him, I can't wait for him to finish tomorrow, (I am on holiday the week after), unfortunately it is not the one who likes to push others, but hopefully he will stop when his partner in crime leaves.
If mum hadn't given notice I would have so for your own and your families well being give notice you won't believe the relief you will feel when you have done it.
Sorry for the long reply:blush: :blush:
Teacake2

[wendywu]

Im obviously a very scarey minder because my children would not dream of doing any of these things. :laughing:

[leeloo1]

It does sound like their behaviour is awful, but are they getting enough exercise? Sometimes when kids are bouncing off the walls they just need to run round a park for a few hours... then they'll be too worn out to misbehave. :)

Of course you should give notice (especially to the unsupportive parent) if you've really had enough, but you could also consider -
- asking the supportive parent to move their child's pre-school days so the boys don't overlap in your care (or not as much).

- telling all the parents that if the children's behaviour doesn't improve you'll need to give notice - it may spur them on to do something about it.

- Separating them if they are with you together. Tell them beforehand 'yes you can play with the garage together, but if you forget to be gentle with the toys and other people then you'll need to take turns doing some quiet work at the table.' Then put them in a highchair one after the other (so they can't run away) and give them something quiet to do for 15 minutes each, then give them another chance to play together again.

- reward charts - stickers - make a chart with spaces for the shortest breaks you can manage (i.e. breakfast, playtime, snacktime, walk to park - however you structure your day). Make a really big deal out of it and tell them if they have x stickers by lunchtime/end of day they can have a treat. Tell the parents and ask them to support you, so if you're doing the sticker chart you can be ready to tell them at the end of the day how well they did and they can be impressed. You might also realise there are 'good' segments to the day, which you can build on. It also gives you a chance to really praise their good behaviour and warn them 'If you carry on doing that then I'll have to give you a sad face... 5,4,3,2 oh well done for making a good choice.'

Sorry if you've already tried all this, but at the end of the day you made them sit for an hour and a half with a book, so you can control them when you need to so it should be a salvageable situation. :)

[little chickee]

How about giving notice to just one?

These behaviours certainly warrant notice imo - the fact that the parents cant see it would make me all the more determned that its the only way.

Maybe if you only had one and they werent feeding off each others bad behaviour it might improve.

I'm not sure i would want to go through a 4 week notice period either. i think i would tell parents that if the behaviour does not improve considerabley ( and STAY better) within a week then i am giving immediate notice.

[munch149]

Coping With one like this is hard enough so two is impossible. They also probably make each other worse. You need to give notice to one if not both and see how it goes. You may be able to sort out ones behaviour but together your going to get nowhere. May sound harsh but either give notice to one who's behaviour is worse or to the one that started With you last. If still awful give notices to other one. At least you have some time to find another Mindee while your trying sp won't lose such a big chunk of your income

[Ripeberry]

I dont know really, the preschool is so busy and although i have thought about asking them i never really get a chance to. Also i sense from them that they think they shouldnt really be discussing things with me as im neither boys' parent. We havent heard anything bad from the preschool so i would assume their behaviour there is fine, either that or its nowhere near as bad as it is with me or we would have been spoken to about it, surely.

Our local pre-school had their party yesterday and I accompanied my mindee J there for a couple of hours. There were 18 kids there, a mixture of 2yr olds up to 4yr olds and it was quite chaotic!

If the other pre-school is even busier then you can see where they are getting it from. I find that mindee J who is always quiet and gentle can be like a whirlwind when he gets back from pre-school and it is ONLY on pre-school days that he is like this.
Do you have the boys during the holidays? How to they behave then? Can you just give notice to one of the boys?