View Full Version : Delicate Situation
This is a new username to protect my anonymity. Hopefully someone will be able to confirm that I have done the right thing and not omitted anything. This situation is a new one for me :-(
Today we had an incident after I got back from the school run.
I was preparing snack and the children were playing. The LO's were in the kitchen/diner with me and the 2 school age (5yr girl and 6yr boy) were in the lounge, not in direct sight but I could hear them clearly. I have a fairly open plan house.
As I was sorting out snack and drinks etc I heard the downstairs bathroom door open and close several times and realised the 2 schoolies had gone quiet , which I thought was a bit odd. I went through and they were in my hall (toilet is in the hall) and when I asked them what they were doing they said nothing, but had that 'guilty' look that said to me it wasn't nothing IYSWIM. I asked them to come through to the diner and have snack. They said they didn't want any and sat down on the lounge floor to play. Moments later it went quiet again, the toilet door was opened and closed, and after a few moments (seconds) I went through to see what they were doing, again they said nothing, so I asked them to come and sit at the table, which they did.
The boy is only with me for a very short time on an afternoon and when he had gone I asked the girl what they had been doing and she said kissing. I responded by tutting and raised eyebrows as lets face it they are 5 and 6 yrs old. I duly reported to the parents about the kissing in a light-hearted manner but later the girls mum phoned me to say that she had questioned her and that she was concerned because the girl had said that the boy had asked her to touch his willy and he had touched her 'bits'. (cue heart sinking etc etc).
So far I've reported verbally to the boys mother, what the girls mother has said and I've written an incident report, which I'll get the parents to sign tomorrow. Is there anything else I need to do?
I find it hard to believe that the children were touching each other as they were out of sight (but not hearing) for a very short time (like a minute at most), yet I can still picture their 'guilty' faces and it would seem a bizarre thing for the 5yr old girl to make up.
Any advice gratefully received.
glitzygal
11-05-2011, 10:03 PM
no advice sorry, never been in a situation like that, but didnt want to read and run;
I think you have done all that is needed, what a difficult situation to be in, i think i would have done all that, i am thinking some one might suggest a risk assessment could be done, but not sure what you could put in it, like time slots in toilet,. i supose its not what you expect in childminding, they pre-pare you for all the other things but not things like this,
well hope all is ok and hope its just a one off, thinking of you x
Trouble
11-05-2011, 10:07 PM
no advice sorry, never been in a situation like that, but didnt want to read and run;
I think you have done all that is needed, what a difficult situation to be in, i think i would have done all that, i am thinking some one might suggest a risk assessment could be done, but not sure what you could put in it, like time slots in toilet,. i supose its not what you expect in childminding, they pre-pare you for all the other things but not things like this,
well hope all is ok and hope its just a one off, thinking of you x
i agree:thumbsup:
mushpea
12-05-2011, 05:53 AM
Oh gosh what an awful situation, i think so far you have done the right, but when the two children are at yours on the same day then I would ask them to shadow you,, you could tell them the truth about why or you could say that because they kept opening and shutting the toilet door they coulld trap somones fingers and also because they wouldnt tell you what happend you cant trust them to be on their own, so either both or one of them will follow you around so they cant possilbly be on theirw own together.
Thanks for the replies.
I will certainly ensure that the children are not out of my line of sight from today. The 6yr old can be a bit of a handful and sneaky, doing things he's not supposed to do, like throwing balls in the house, breaking toys (possibly deliberately), but this sort of behaviour was a new one for me.
They will have to sit at the table whilst I sort out snack (I do prepare as much as I can before the school run to make it quicker and easier, eg fruit chopped and on a plate in the fridge).
Thankfully it is only for 20 to 30 minutes of the day. Why do these things always happen at your busiest times when you are trying to juggle 3 things at once? :rolleyes:
VINASOL
12-05-2011, 08:39 AM
i'm curious to know what the parent of the boy has said? (also, is it normal for a boy of 6 to ask a younger female to touch private parts? is there something more going on at home?)
an awful situation for you to be in.
Tina O
12-05-2011, 08:49 AM
sorry I haven't got anything usefull to say that hasn't been said already except are they in the same school and can you have a general 'chat' to the teachers to see if anything has happened at school ???? Good luck with it xx
rickysmiths
12-05-2011, 08:49 AM
i'm curious to know what the parent of the boy has said? (also, is it normal for a boy of 6 to ask a younger female to touch private parts? is there something more going on at home?)
an awful situation for you to be in.
That bit made me wonder as well. I think I would want to have a meeting asap with the boys parents, like tonight, without the boy present, to try and get to the bottom of it and to get a feel for what their reaction is.
Children are curious about their bodies and I would want to find out what they have been doing at school and how. They start sex education very early now and this could have a bearing on the displayed behaviour.
Definately write it all up.
gegele
12-05-2011, 08:54 AM
i think i would have a conversation with children saying what is appropriate and what isn't.
maybe do a game like can you touch eacch others hair, keep it funny by saying things like "in each other nose??2 uurrgghh yeeurk
and insist that we have private area under our clothes that shouldn't be touched by others.
they're big enough to be told.
oh and i would tell them that there's only 1 toilet so only 1person can go, the other will have to wait in lounge.
good luck
Blaze
12-05-2011, 09:05 AM
To a point I think this is normal (You show me yours & I'll show you mine)...touching is an extension - I know it happens at schoosl a lot & in bigger groups! There is however the safeguading issue - not only towards the girl, but to the boy too (has he been subjected to something inappropriate etc or is it just curiosity)? I think a game as suggested is a good idea, making it clear the bathroom is one at a time & keeping a close eye...note it on your concerns just in case there is more to it, but at the moment sounds quite innocent to me.
The Juggler
12-05-2011, 12:21 PM
I would be talking to the children directly hon, or asking parents too. I would be making it clear to them that they shoudl not go to the toilet together (they don't at school) and that it is not appropriate as private are private!.
I had to have this conversation early on with my two as they are boy and girl and only 2 years apart. :thumbsup:
I have spoken to both mothers today. The girls mother said she'd had a calm discussion with her about what is and isn't acceptable and that she must tell me and mum if anything happens again and that she was right to say something.
The boys mum said that she had asked him what had happened but couldn't get him to say anything, so she too told him calmly what is and isn't acceptable. Both parents work in 'care' careers and are knowledgeable about child protection issues.
As Blaze says I think it is probably curiosity on the part of the children and I will continue monitoring. Neither child (or family) has ever given me any indication that there may be issues at home or elsewhere so I am hopeful that this is a one off.
My only slight niggle is that the girl has found something she can tell tales over. After the boy had gone she said he'd been asking her to kiss him again, but I know this is not true as he walked home at the side of me and was sat at the dining table for the whole time he was here and the conversation at snacktime was about TV programmes and music.
jane5
12-05-2011, 05:58 PM
I am new to cming so may be wrong but I would have thought you may have to go down the safe guarding route and report it?
This may be blowing things out of proportion but I know of a similar incident
2 boys aged 5 in the toilets at school and one told the other to pull his pants down and made sexual movements from behind. Neither of these boys had been abused but another boy in the class had done this to one of them and it turned out he WAS being abused.
The boys had to have taped interviews and it was very upsetting but the child being abused was given the protection needed.
The boy shouldn't know about things like this and may have heard things from older children but you can not make presumptions that this is all innocent as there may be a child being abused somewhere in this.
A very difficult situation for you x
Baildon bears
12-05-2011, 07:44 PM
Gosh when I was at primary school a distant memory, I remember there was one boy in particular who used to offer the girls sweets to have a look at his willy, I guess some boys are just more curious than others, though it does make me shudder to think my youngest is 6 this year and he knows nothing about all of that yet, when my eldest 7 asked me where baby's come from he looked at me in absolute horror when I told him.:eek:
glitzygal
12-05-2011, 10:50 PM
glad they had a chat with them,,,,, at least you know they have been told and you just have to keep an eye on it,,
after reading the post i thought about my setting and i have made a door hanger, they take it off the hook by they toilet and hang it on the door, so if its on the door,,,,, some one else knows some one is in the toilet, it made it fun today but.............. i had lots of visits to the toilet,,,,lol:laughing: and that was just me,,,,,:laughing:
good luck,
Pipsqueak
13-05-2011, 07:15 AM
I am new to cming so may be wrong but I would have thought you may have to go down the safe guarding route and report it?
x
As you say a very difficult situation but the reason its not an immediately reportable thing is that they are very young and its very normal curiosity. Its appears to be a one off.
Personally as the OP has done I would note it, speak to parents, take further precautions but at this stage there is nothing really to report. the situation would be monitored
The different with what you describe at school is that the overt sexual overtones were there - the movements and positioning - giving rise to the view that this goes beyond curiosity.
shona_rj
13-05-2011, 09:10 AM
Sometimes children do and say things that we understand in the wrong way and worry about, but they are often innocent actions or comments and if not made too much of are quickly forgotten. I have a book that helps parents teach their children about growing up and sex education etc. I read that you should tell your children that anything that is covered by their bathing suit is for their (and possibly your) eyes only. I thought this was a good way of explaining it. Hope you get good support from the parents, they have trusted you and things like this do happen. x
jane5
13-05-2011, 04:03 PM
As you say a very difficult situation but the reason its not an immediately reportable thing is that they are very young and its very normal curiosity. Its appears to be a one off.
Personally as the OP has done I would note it, speak to parents, take further precautions but at this stage there is nothing really to report. the situation would be monitored
The different with what you describe at school is that the overt sexual overtones were there - the movements and positioning - giving rise to the view that this goes beyond curiosity.
I have only been registered for 6 months and all of this official stuff scares the life out of me. :eek: I totally see what you are saying. I have had 4 grown up children, now in their 20's so I know kids can be innocently curious.
On my course last year they went on so much about safe guarding and covering yourself, and for us not to be investigating what has happened but to pass it on to the authorities, this is why I questioned it.
If it wasn't a child minding situation I wouldn't necessarily report it but I thought we had to if it happened in our setting. Does it not even have to be reported to ofsted?
Its just a terrible situation to be in and I would be worried that the girls parents wont let it rest.