PDA

View Full Version : This ones been bugging me for a while......



Louise0208
21-12-2010, 12:16 PM
Do you or your mindees pay for outings?

i personally pay for them all but ask parents to provide spending moneys, unsure if is the done thing or not but after an 'incident' with my old CM thats the way i do it!

incident was:...... :cool:

last year when i was working in a bar (20hrs pw) i was paying my CM (with help from tax credits as i am single parent) to look after my 4 children then aged 11, 9, 4 & 12 months.

CM decided she wanted to take kids out for the day.....But.... she decided to take them alton towers & i was to pay for it (including the extra hours as i usually picked up at 4pm but they wouldnt be back till 6pm) :eek: & if i didnt pay for it then i had to find other arrangements & still pay CM as it would be me that wouldnt send them not her not working.

as i was only on minimum wage & having to pay CM it would have still been cheaper taking the day off (unpaid) as alton towers for 3 (baby was free) would have been roughly £70 + her fees on top.

The bar i worked in was run by my best friend & she was desperate for me to work as she had other plans & offered to pay for the kids to go to AT as long as i paid the extra fees (still an expensive compromise but i didnt want to let her down) & my boss requested the receipts from AT so she could see if the accountant could try & put it against the tax.....CM said no as she wanted to claim for ALL the childrens entrance fees :censored: .....needless to say i was pretty peeved.

i would have been severly out of pocket if i had sent them, then again if i hadnt :(

Yes this has bothered me for over a year :( when i feel like ive been ripped off it gets my goat for a while!

suzyblue
21-12-2010, 12:25 PM
I dont think that was at all acceptable for you childminder to expect you to pay. As the trip wasnt fully in your contracted hours she should not have even considered it and if she really wanted to go then she should have ASKED you and definitely not charged for the extra hours.
Thats an awful position to put you in - and then to not give receipts so that she could put them though her books when she had not paid!:angry:

This situation would have made me mad too!!!!

PS I would try to cover the cost of mindees outings and if it wasnt possible, I would ask for a contribution but would be prepared for parents to ask that their children didnt go. I have never done this though as I have never HAD to attend an expensive theme park!

Pipsqueak
21-12-2010, 12:28 PM
I think your old CM was wrong - in this instance. A trip of that magnitude would start with lots of talks with parents and the cost of the trip.

for small local trips to softplay, minor outings, farm etc I pay - anything over £8 I ask for a parental contribution. If parents don't want to send their child and the majority do then yes I would ask them to find alternative care that day and charge half fees. Saying that I have never had this happen.
I do ask that parents provide spends.

I try to factor in and absorb costs, keeping them low as possible but parents are always consulted - even if I am paying.
Last year I managed to get some subsidised theatre tickets and gave parents 2 days notice of what I intended to do....

singingcactus
21-12-2010, 12:43 PM
If I take the kids on an outing then I pay for it. I have never asked parents to pay. If parents who were due to attend that day didn't want their kids to go and could make other arrangements then that is the way I would go, however if they could not make other arrangements then I would change the day of the trip or the destination. I also wouldn't charge for care if they chose not to send their child on the trip as it would be ME who is changing the venue of care and parents have the right to say they don't want their child to be cared for in a different place.
What your other cm did was fraudulent anyway. To claim for something she did not pay for is dishonest and I would not want someone so blatantly dishonest teaching my kids her bad ways - good on you for changing your kids situation!

SamWilliams1980
21-12-2010, 12:43 PM
I think that is shocking, she basically held oyu to ransom because she wanted a fun day out. I would have refused permission for them to go and tell her it had nothing to do with the cost.

The way I see it and policy i use. If i wish to take the mindee(s) on a trip its my choice, not the parents and if they did specifically ask then and only then would i request payment. At the end of the day parents already pay me to provide childcare which i do to my best ability. There are plenty of free/cheap things both in and out doors and trips.

Bloomin heck i feel angry for you and i dont know you lol. Some childminders take the p$@@ and give others a bad name. What a crappy way to run a business too!!!!!!

rant over :)

Polly2
21-12-2010, 12:48 PM
I think your cm was not at all considerate of your circumstances :(

I cover toddler groups and soft play, visits to farm.

I was attending a music group that did not do discount for cm's and charged £4.50 per child :eek: it was fab though and all parents wanted me to go and all covered cost. But that was after I explained the benefits to their child and gave them all the info and I gave them the choice.

Not sure what I would have done if one parent couldn't afford it ?? Probably not gone.

fiona
21-12-2010, 12:52 PM
i have never charged a parent for a day out, i send a letter home explaining my wishes for a day trip and any views a parent has, then i send home the risk assesment and permission slips, i NEVER tell the children and i ask parents not to! then if i am running over hours thats MY fault and i do not ask parents to pay the extra, we went to the zoo recently and had a great day, (even took a mindee who was not due that day) as i was within my numbers and her mother was not charged for the day, although she did pay me.

I dont like childminders that are underhand and do this its hard enough finding good parents.

wendywu
21-12-2010, 12:53 PM
One question if you and not the CM paid for your childrens entrance to AT then how could she put the entrance ticket through HER accounts . Tut tut very naughty. :panic:

berkschick
21-12-2010, 12:57 PM
I cover toddler fees but ask for parents to pay for outings in the holidays.

BUT........

At the end of June, I gave every parennt a print out of my plans for the whole of the summer holidays with how much everything would cost. We went out every single day but it mainly worked out to around £6 per week per child as I balanced free trips (picnics, museum, feed the ducks, drop in, 1p bowling, 95p cinema showings etc) with paid trips. All my parents were more than happy with this. I would NEVER dream of taking children to somewhere so expensive without talking at length to the parents first. And if we are late back then thats my problem! We went to the beach for the day over the summer and I had all mindees for 3 hours extra but didnt charge for this.

loocyloo
21-12-2010, 01:13 PM
i did have it in my contract for fulltime children ( over the age of 5 ) that parents would cover costs of days out - BUT, i quickly realised ( before a holiday period ) that one particular mum would think it was her 'right' to say she didn't think xyz was appropriate ( and that would stop us going, with other under 5 mindees, plus my own children ) so i never charged her! ( didn't have any other over 5 mindees! )

i don't do very expensive trips out - personally, i couldn't face any theme park with mindees! ( did do legoland, as mindees were free on my annual pass, and we , pretty much, spent day in duplo world :D ) but i couldn't do rides where we couldn't all go together.

and if its my choice not to be home at usual pick up, then i check its ok with parents, and i don't charge! yesterday mindee should have been picked up at midday, but as we planned to meet friends, i said i would drop home 4ish. when i dropped mindee home, mum paid me for the extra hours :( even though i had said several times she mustn't! so, as i have mindee again tomorrow, we are using that money to go out for the morning and treat ourselves!

georgie456
21-12-2010, 01:56 PM
She didn't really give a choice did she?! And after all that to then refuse to give you a receipt as she wanted it to go through her books!!!!!!....well, I would have been furious to be honest.
I think she was in the wrong here. If I take the kids on a big trip like that, the cost is fully discussed agreed well in advance and if the trip causes me to go over a child's contracted hours, I don't charge the extra hours.

jumpinjen
21-12-2010, 02:05 PM
I think this is really unprofessional..... I do ask parent's for fees for a trip but probably one out of the 10 we do in the summer hols. For the rest I choose free or low cost places and cover it myself and ask parents to send a few pounds for bucket and spade, ice creams etc. If they pay the fees I buy the ice cream! And I always ask all if ok so no-one feels they are being forced to pay when they can't afford it. I also don't charge additional hours over contracted fees.

You are right to feel narked over this as she was extremely inconsiderate of your costs with three children and fees to pay, I wouldn't pay £70 for my own family day out, let alone expect a family I care for to pay for it.

i scrounge round for free tickets and two for ones and spread the cost between all aswell sometimes, for example, i need to pay for one adult, and two children as the other four are free, i then split the cost between 7 and we all pay a small amount to make it work.....there are always deals for alton towers around as well.

Hugs, jen x

Mouse
21-12-2010, 02:19 PM
If I'm planning a big trip out I let parents know in plenty of time. I ask them to pay for their child, or make alternative arrangements for the day.

If the child comes with me I charge their normal fee for the day & the cost of the trip, but nothing extra if the day runs longer than their contracted hours.
The way I see it is that if they don't want their child to go on the trip, then I am not available for a normal day's work, so can't expect them to pay. And if the trip last longer than their normal hours, I can't charge extra as it's me making it a longer day, not them.

Parents have always been happy with that & I think it's fair. If it's a trip that isn't costing much I'll pay & pay for lunch, but I ask parents to provide some spending money for an ice cream orsmall souvenir. Again, parents have always been happy with this.

I think the OP's cm was being incredibly unfair. I bet you'll find her charges paid for her own ticket!

snufflepuff
21-12-2010, 03:41 PM
Goodness me that is terrible! Especially refusing to give you a receipt so she could put it through her books even though she wasn't the one who was paying!
I asked parents to contribute towards two outings in the summer, and covered the cost of the others myself. No parent paid more than £10 over the whole of this year. I also made sure I checked with them first before organsing anything, and didn't charge for extra hours used because of the outing.
I'd never be brave enough to tackle such a huge outing with several mindees, let alone tell parents they must pay for it!

claire'scherubs
21-12-2010, 03:55 PM
I ask parents to pay and no one has complained yet, it is in my policies.

However, if I ran over time then I would NOT charge for those extra fees and I would drop them at home

Louise0208
21-12-2010, 04:00 PM
I ask parents to pay and no one has complained yet, it is in my policies.



even if it would cost a parent £70+ ?

claire'scherubs
21-12-2010, 04:07 PM
[QUOTE=Louise0208;835382]even if it would cost a parent £70+ ?[/QUOTE

I wouldn't take them on a visit for that much money, have been to Banham before, but TBH Alton Towers is too far away for me xx

Marshmallow
21-12-2010, 04:35 PM
:panic: OMG, I am dumbstruck !
I regulary take 3 Mindees all over, I live in Peterborough, and we have been to Science Museum, London.Bewilderwood, Norwich.Twin Lakes,Milton Keynes to name but a few, I have picked them up at 6. in the morning and returned them at 10 at night.
I arrange inadvance and cover all the costs myself, and any extra hours involved are down to me, if I wanna take them then thats up to me. :thumbsup:
We do local as well, Pantomines, Bowling and Cinema on a regular basis, and I would never :blush: never :blush: charge any extra for time or incurred costs :eek:
If I'm taking them, then I budget for it :laughing:

caz3007
21-12-2010, 04:53 PM
I pay for all trips, buses etc, but then we dont go to expensive places. One of my mums suggested Butlins for the holidays, but she said she would pay for her two, so I would have to pay for son and myself. luckily the newspaper often has get a child free or for a £1, so would use that.

SYLVIA
21-12-2010, 06:30 PM
I personally don't charge entry fees. I don't charge extra hours if it's my idea to go on the outing. And that CM should not have put the fees through her books if you paid for them! Sounds like she's got it made!

ChocolateChip
21-12-2010, 07:01 PM
Think your old cm is totally out of line on several points!

I never ask for any extra money towards trips, like others I balance cheap or freebies with the pricier ones and include it all in my price. I don't always discuss trips with my parents, sometimes we will just go somewhere on a whim but they all know we have a regular list of places to go and that in the hols I like to be out and about, if a parent had a problem with a particular place then I would respect that but it's not been an issue so far. Having said that, there aren't really any theme parks within easy distance for me so it tends to be zoo, farms, nature parks, softplay, etc. for us.
Also if I was going to be late back then I make sure the parents are happy with that and don't charge any extra.
I never charge extra for toddlers either, but I know some cm's in my area are starting to charge say £5 a week to cover costs.

sillysausage
21-12-2010, 07:14 PM
Like many others I don't charge parents for outings. Lets face it parents pay us a contracted fee to care for their children. On that contract it usually states somewhere whether parents have to pay additional fees for outings/preschool etc (parents pay any additional preschool fees in me setting). I feel it is up to me how I entertain the children whilst they are in my care and as such it is my responsibility to meet the costs involved. The same goes for the fees when a child is with me for longer than their contracted hours because I have decided to take the children further afield, I wouldn't dream of charging extra as it is not the parents fault that I am not here to return their child at the appropriate time. Often parents offer to pay for the extra time and I will gratiously accept it but I don't 'expect' it of them.

I have taken older children (over 8's) to theme parks on numerous occasions and always done it using 1/2 price tickets, tesco club points etc so that the overall cost is much less. I'm not sure I would feel comfortable taking a mixed age range including a baby to a theme park such as Alton Towers, as you would have to allow children to go on rides unaccompanied and different children have different 'fears' etc and need different levels of support on these things. I don't see how the childminder and the children could get value for money out of the experience.

Also to add, if I am late back from a trip then I will agree before hand whether parents would prefer me to drop their child off at home of if they want to collect from mine. Mind you my mindees all live within a mile of my home.

glitzygal
21-12-2010, 08:41 PM
I pre ask parents, if i am going on trips,,,


small amounts i pay, but i ask for contrabution, which isnt much but parents never complaine, one parent gave me envelope to open when there, in it was extra,,, i was gobsmacked,, i also jot down in book what each child has had, with the money provided, and give change, which they always said keep it,,, even if its been 5.00 or 1.00 but to me thats a tip,,,lol

if we go anywhere they take lunch boxes, and i often buy icecreams, or snacks,:jump for joy: even chips,,,,lol

i dont charge if its my choice to be later than contracted time,,,,,,, i say thats my tip to the parents,,,,,

this way i have respect and they give respect.,....

she was on to a good thing,,,,,

my mindees are to youg for Alton towers and to far,,,, the nearest zoo, we go in summer,,, and make a day of it,,,,,,,,,all enjoy it,,,,,,,:laughing:

MaryMary
21-12-2010, 10:28 PM
You are right to feel narked over this as she was extremely inconsiderate of your costs with three children and fees to pay, I wouldn't pay £70 for my own family day out, let alone expect a family I care for to pay for it.

i scrounge round for free tickets and two for ones and spread the cost between all aswell sometimes, for example, i need to pay for one adult, and two children as the other four are free, i then split the cost between 7 and we all pay a small amount to make it work.....there are always deals for alton towers around as well.

Hugs, jen x

I suspect the CM possibly had all these vouchers, which is why she didn't want to give up the receipts! I don't want to stir things up, but she could have got her entire family in for free! :angry:
I wonder what HMRC would have to say about it?! :rolleyes:
Even without that, it is tax avoidance to claim expenses that she has insisted someone else pays!
Alton Towers, or similar, is a big trip I would save for my own family. And to expect a parent to pay for 1 child would be a big ask - but THREE!!!
I have never asked parents for money for outings (cinema, zoos, bowling, etc) I balance these with cheap/free outings. If I go on these trips, I normally give plenty of notice, so that parents can send child/ren in with correct stuff (sun cream, pocket money, etc). Some offer to pay, but I usually refuse. I couldn't afford to do it all the time - it wouldn't be a treat then anyway :)
I don't charge for extra hours, as it suits me to get back at a certain time (eg if a child is picked up at noon, it cuts down everyone's day)

kindredspirits
22-12-2010, 09:46 AM
I'm sorry but I would have put my foot down to your CM. Either she WAS available for her usual work, in which case I would have dropped all the children to her in the morning without the extra for Alton Towers - or she WASN'T available for normal work in which case you needn't have paid her. no way I would let my kids go to AT with a childminder :panic: sorry to those who have done it but as someone else pointed out she was either letting the children go on rides unaccompanied or leaving the baby with someone else.
Personally I would have had no problem calling ofsted for advice in the hope that they checked out her RA for the trip seeing as she was being so pig-headed and underhanded.

And on another note, if I wanted my kids to go to AT I would have wanted to take them myself and see their faces, not shell out over £70 for them to spend the day with their cm.

JCrakers
22-12-2010, 12:07 PM
Got to agree that was a pretty poor thing to do. I go to toddler group twice a week at £1 each day so that's £2 per week I pay out.

If there is an xmas party its usualyly £4 so parents pay this but I wouldnt dream of organised such an expensive trip out. Thats a huge expense for 4 kids and I wouldnt have paid it.
The childminder should not have said pay it or theres no childcare as we are going anyway..Thats really bad.
You signed a contract for the days you wanted so you should get those days.

Personally I wouldnt organise a trip so expensive. I believe trips to Alton Towers can wait for the weekend when paretns can decide if they want to go.
Maybe she should have got some free tickets for the kids...and keeping the receipts to claim is shocking as she didnt pay.
becky x

The Juggler
22-12-2010, 04:25 PM
if I wanted to do it, I would ASK the parents if that was ok. anything for which I'd expect/need a contribution for I would ask first. Then if they say no, I'd decide whether to pay myself or cancel. I think it's unfair to say they have to find other arrangements.

And if the outing meant extra hours of care I don't think it's fair to expect parents to stump up for those hours - not unless they suggested the outing:panic:

nokidshere
22-12-2010, 05:35 PM
How unfair of her! Good for you for getting rid :thumbsup:

I don't charge any extra, but then I would absolutely not take the children to a theme park anyway! We used to (no daytime children anymore) go to free or cheap places regularly.

I would not let a childminder take my child to somewhere like AT anyway.

charleyfarley
22-12-2010, 05:51 PM
Have to agree with everyone, your childminder was totally in the wrong !!!

And to want to put the receipts through her books when she hadn't even paid for the trip :mad:

I use the Tescos vouchers for our trips so doesn't cost parents anything other than the spending money they give to their child. I never charge for hours outside contracted hours if we are back later than pick up time either.

Carol xx

Chimps Childminding
22-12-2010, 08:12 PM
I was wondering how many others went on the trip? I know most of us can have upto 6 (plus over 8's) but surely on a trip to some where like Alton Towers you wouldn't want to take many on your own? If she has an 8 seater she could still take another 3, so I wondered whether she took her own family and you subsidised it for her? Unfair if thats the case, she should have waited and taken them when she wasn't working :angry:

And to say that if they didn't go you would still have to pay her is down right mean - if she went on a trip she wasn't available to work so I don't see how she can expect to charge :angry: