Tricky one

[BlondeMoment]

Hi there childminders!

I had a lo visit with her mum yesterday and her Mum says that in no way is she to ever be involved with anything to do with halloween.
I'm very new to childminding so am wondering how to go about this. Surely we are supposed to embrace all the the special days in the year to give the children a multi cultural experience. I can't leave it out completely. But it would be awful to have to send her into another room. She's very little so wouldn't understand.

I explained to the mother that it would be difficult to avoid it al together but I could certainly give her something else to do if we make things. But what about games we may want to play?

I know Halloween is a long way off but this has really baffled me.

Any ideas would be helpful

Many thanks

lisa x

[The Juggler]

Well you could just decide not to do Halloween again or, tell her you will do Halloween but offer her lo something else to do. however, explain to her if her lo wants to join in with the others, you can't really stop her.

Personally, I would tell her it's part of the EYFS to celebrate different events/festivals and it's inclusion rather than exclusion that's important.

Or, you can tell her when you're doing Haloween activities and she can choose not to bring the child:p

[Mollymop]

I wouldn't stop doing my special activities and themes because of one child, what about all the other children, they would miss out - I would notify mum in advance what we would be doing at halloween and then if she isn't happy to bring her child or her child to be involved she can make other arrangement for that day

At Halloween we have a party, we decorate the house, carve pumpkins, Halloween games - we spend all day celebrating. The children all look frward to it. So it would be hard to not include a child in hallween activities in my setting.

:)

[Twinkles]

We don't celebrate Halloween either. Just tell mum what you do and if she is concerned then she will have to book holiday at that time.

We do have to celebrate different events/festivals but as a Christian I would not be happy for my child to take part in these activities so I would make other provision at that time, not expect you to change your way of doing things.

[BlondeMoment]

Thank you everyone. You've backed up what I was thinking anyway.
Yes Juggler, I did say to her about the EYSF andabout including everyone in everything. She didn't look impressed:eek:
Thank you Twinkles for your point of view and saying you'd realise it was up to you to remove your child from it. I'll feel quite confident now when I explain that I can't "not do it" because of all the other children but if she's not happy with her being around it at all it's best she's removed for the day.
Although to be honest in our house we celebrate all week. Much like yourself MollyMop, it's a big deal for us too. So the decorations would still be up for wa good few days. Especially if the weekend was coming as we always have a party. Agh!
Thanks again everyone

[The Juggler]

Thank you everyone. You've backed up what I was thinking anyway.
Yes Juggler, I did say to her about the EYSF andabout including everyone in everything. She didn't look impressed:eek:
Thank you Twinkles for your point of view and saying you'd realise it was up to you to remove your child from it. I'll feel quite confident now when I explain that I can't "not do it" because of all the other children but if she's not happy with her being around it at all it's best she's removed for the day.
Although to be honest in our house we celebrate all week. Much like yourself MollyMop, it's a big deal for us too. So the decorations would still be up for wa good few days. Especially if the weekend was coming as we always have a party. Agh!
Thanks again everyone

:thumbsup: be strong hon!

[auntym]

If she dosnt want her involved in anything to do with halloween what will she do wen she walks thru ur front door and you have decorations up?
I would offer her the opportunity of taking that time as a holiday? if she refuses then id nicely explain to her it would be practically impossible for her not to be around it. And that to exclude it would not be fair on the mindees that enjoy it

[Bushpig]

We don't celebrate Halloween either. Just tell mum what you do and if she is concerned then she will have to book holiday at that time.

We do have to celebrate different events/festivals but as a Christian I would not be happy for my child to take part in these activities so I would make other provision at that time, not expect you to change your way of doing things.

Ditto :thumbsup:

[birch24]

Ditto :thumbsup:

Me too.
What things do you do that are instead of halloween?

[TheBTeam]

Can you explain that under EYFS she would be exploring the different festivals and cultures, not actively celebrating them, and get her to understand that you would be able to objectively explain about things and not be looking to get her to believe, or celebrate any of the different cultures special days that we look at.

[upadaisy]

i can't help wonder .... what happens when that child goes to school.... you can't stop doing things with other children that you have always done ... is she willing to take that holiday off .... surely she can't come in and tell you not to celebrate .....

[Mouse]

Halloween is a tricky thing. To most of us it's just a fun thing to do in October, but to some people it has very sinister meaning & because of their religious beliefs they chose not to celebrate it.

A few people here have stated EYFS means everyone has experience of everything & all celebrations should be acknowledged, but I'm sure you wouldn't use the same arguement to make a Jehovah Witness child celebrate Christmas or a Jewish child eat pork. Someone further back said "Personally, I would tell her it's part of the EYFS to celebrate different events/festivals and it's inclusion rather than exclusion that's important." Imagine saying that to a JW parent about Christmas :eek:

If it's a parent's wish that their child doesn't celebrate Halloween, then that needs to be respected. If you're not able to work with the parents on reaching a compromise, then perhaps your setting isn't the right place for this child.

It does all need to be about respecting parent's wishes, balanced against the needs of the other children in your care. If mum does decide to come to you I would tell her what you plan to do over halloween ie. decorate the house, have a party, do craft activities etc & give her the option of keeping the child away for that day or week.

[jelly15]

I am a Christian and I don't like/celebrate halloween, it is a personal choice and I am happy to explore how others celebrate their religious festivals etc except this. All Halloween means is All Saints Day Eve but it has been turned into something completely different and I choose not to acknowledge it.

[Blaze]

We don't celebrate Halloween we celebrate All Hallow's Eve (& it is a family tradition of mine to combine it with All Souls Day - November the 2nd) - so we treat the 31st as a special time when we remember friends & family that have passed in a happy positive way & to take the time to appreciate all that we have & our loved ones who are still here with us - basically we enjoy each other's company - we also light candles in rememberence)...perhaps this is the way for you to meet everyone's needs? This way the LO isn't around Halloween.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/christianity/holydays/halloween_1.shtml

(Scroll to the bottom for info on All Souls Day)
HTH:)

[nokidshere]

We don't celebrate Halloween at all. There is no rule that says you have to cover every festival or occasion.

I'm with Mouse. You simply cant say well thats what we do so tough luck! If you want to take the child on then you need to respect the parents wishes and reach a compromise, which is what we should do for all things really.

Maybe you could restrict you halloween celebrations to just one day and give the option of her having that day off - or do it on a day when she is not with you.

[The Juggler]

We don't celebrate Halloween at all. There is no rule that says you have to cover every festival or occasion.

I'm with Mouse. You simply cant say well thats what we do so tough luck! If you want to take the child on then you need to respect the parents wishes and reach a compromise, which is what we should do for all things really.

Maybe you could restrict you halloween celebrations to just one day and give the option of her having that day off - or do it on a day when she is not with you.

I totally agree, but I think that no minder should have to change what they already do at the dictate of the parent.:)

[Mollymop]

I totally agree, but I think that no minder should have to change what they already do at the dictate of the parent.:)

yes, I agree:)

[wendywu]

[
QUOTE=nokidshere;668320]We don't celebrate Halloween at all. There is no rule that says you have to cover every festival or occasion.

I'm with Mouse. You simply cant say well thats what we do so tough luck! If you want to take the child on then you need to respect the parents wishes and reach a compromise, which is what we should do for all things really.

Maybe you could restrict you halloween celebrations to just one day and give the option of her having that day off - or do it on a day when she is not with you.[/QUOTE]

So that means you cannot go to any groups as most do Halloween activities. What about the parents that DO want their children to have a little bit of fun.

I have a policy along the lines of, we embrace all differences and explore with wonder the world about us etc etc If you are not happy for your child to join in then as long as it does not impact on the other children in the setting i will comply. But you are free to take holiday on these days.

[BlondeMoment]

Thanks so much everyone! Great to get so many points of view and the solution seems to be simple enough.
I guess it's like at school. Well, when I was at school anyway. When it's a C of E school, the kids of other religions didn't join in the religious side of any assembly. They were aloud to stay in the classroom and read or something. They were also taken out of school for certain events.
So I'm guessing the same thing should apply. It'd be devestated for the kids who love Halloween not to do it, and like I say, we always decorated the house and have a big party so yes, she may want to opt to remove her for that day.

Yes I'll have to see about how many decorations go up on the day so we can take them down again if there are any more week days before the weekend. that way it will just be the one day that she needs to take as holiday.

Funnily I've not heard anything from the parent. My stumpred reaction has probably put her off :(

But I'll know what to say if there's a next time.

[ziggy]

I worked at a school/nursery where head teacher didnt allow halloween celebrations, so we had 'pumpkin week' instead. Children couldnt dress up but we still had fun and adapted games etc

[Mouse]

I totally agree, but I think that no minder should have to change what they already do at the dictate of the parent.:)

So would you make a vegetarian child eat meat just because you always have sausages on a Wednesday? Would you say to the parent "sorry, I'm not letting you dictate what I do, so your child will have to eat meat"?
Surely you would compromise, or not take on that child if you were not able to comply with the parents wishes?

I certainly don't think the other children should have to miss out on celebrations & activities, but with thoughtful planning there's no reason why they should.

[SimplyLucy]

Personally I'm not over keen on Halloween so I tend to group it together with November the 5th crafts.

Yes I'll put orange paint out and if children wish to paint a pumpkin they can, most however always choose to do the bonfire and firework pictures!

By grouping the 2 festivals together no one gets left out or excluded because of beliefs and children have free choice on activities.

If the said child decided to do one of the halloween crafts who says it has to go home, it could be a special one for display at your house!

[The Juggler]

So would you make a vegetarian child eat meat just because you always have sausages on a Wednesday? Would you say to the parent "sorry, I'm not letting you dictate what I do, so your child will have to eat meat"?
Surely you would compromise, or not take on that child if you were not able to comply with the parents wishes?

I certainly don't think the other children should have to miss out on celebrations & activities, but with thoughtful planning there's no reason why they should.

no, of course not but at the same time I would not refuse to serve the other children sausages any more because I had a vegetarian child - I would offer a vegetarian option. However, I would be upset if the parent of the vegetarian child said they didn't want their child to be anywhere around meat being served , as I feel they would then be dictating what the other children should eat. However, I would obviously accommodate their wishes for their child. But, it's harder to stop a child seeing Halloween decorations.:)

[The Juggler]

"Personally, I would tell her it's part of the EYFS to celebrate different events/festivals and it's inclusion rather than exclusion that's important." Imagine saying that to a JW parent about Christmas :eek:

If it's a parent's wish that their child doesn't celebrate Halloween, then that needs to be respected. If you're not able to work with the parents on reaching a compromise, then perhaps your setting isn't the right place for this child.

It does all need to be about respecting parent's wishes, balanced against the needs of the other children in your care. If mum does decide to come to you I would tell her what you plan to do over halloween ie. decorate the house, have a party, do craft activities etc & give her the option of keeping the child away for that day or week.

Mouse I totally see where you are coming from but I'm not saying you FORCE any child to celebrate anything a parent/child doesn't want to I'm saying other children shouldn't miss out on what they already do because a new child comes to the setting. By all means respect wishes/accommodate but unless it's something such as a nut allergy where you have to eliminate all traces of something else, then I think you should be allowed to continue to provide a wide range of experiences for all.

[wendywu]

[
QUOTE=Mouse;668393]So would you make a vegetarian child eat meat just because you always have sausages on a Wednesday? Would you say to the parent "sorry, I'm not letting you dictate what I do, so your child will have to eat meat"?

I would never force any child to eat or take part in any activities they did not want to.:(

But i am an inclusive setting and parents have to realise that this world is full of many different people with different values, religion, cultures. That is what makes it such an exciting place.

I know of three minders who are JW and although they do not believe in Christmas they still go to groups and their mindees make all the Christmas goodies. They do not celebrate birthdays but still sit in circle time and sing Happy Birthday to children in the group.:D