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mumx3
10-09-2009, 07:55 PM
This is a long one but I would be most grateful if.....

Please would some of you clever clogs tak a quick look at the wording on my variation and help me interpret it.

I have my own 10 year old 4 year old and 16 month old. My 4 year old starts school full time at the end of October.

The registered person:

may care for no more than 4 children under 8 years; of these, not more than 2 may be in the early years age group, and of these, not more than 1 may be under 1 year at any one time (Early Years Register, compulsory part of the Childcare Register)

must not provide overnight care (Early Years Register, compulsory part of the Childcare Register, voluntary part of the Childcare Register)
when caring for 4 or 5 year old children who are in full time education, may increase the number in the early years age group by the number of children in full time education, providing the maximum number is not exceeded (Early Years Registration)

may exceed this ratio to allow X children in the early years age group for the children named on the variation request of 25/08/2009 (Early Years Register, compulsory part of the Childcare Register)

may only care for such children Tuesday and Wednesday from 08.00 until 09.00 and 11.30 until 17.30. This exception applies until one of those named children is no longer in the early years age group or is no longer cared for by the childminder (Early Years Register, compulsory part of the Childcare Register)

I currently care for....

8 month old baby tues weds, fri

5 year old (not in full time school until end of Oct) mon, thurs

mindees are listed in red

monday 10y, 4y, 16m, 5y
tues 10y 4 y 16m 8m,
weds 10y 4 y 16m 8m,
thurs 10y, 4y, 16m, 5y
fri 10y 4 y 16m 8m,

I applied to have the variation to have the 5 year old on tuesdays and weds days before and after the time she is at school for her half day of settling in.

However before I had the variation done my certificate read may care for 1 child in the early years age group.

Now it reads 2 in the early years age group and goes on to say that I can exceed this on the tues and weds.

Does that mean I can have four in the early years age group PLUS the named 5 year old! eeek!

Or is it a mistake.

I am wondering if it is to do with my own 4 year old about to start full time also.

Please help I am confused.

The other complicating factor is....the 5 year old who I got the variation done for doesnt now even need it as mum sorted something else out when the variation didnt come back quick enough.

However I had an enquiry today for a 2 year old who need tues, thurs, fri and to start asap.

Now even without the variation (which refers to the named child, i.e. 5 year old) according the the certificate "may care for no more than 4 children under 8 years; of these, not more than 2 may be in the early years age group" I could do it. But I am not sure if this is correct or an error.

Either way by the end of Oct it wont matter as my 4 year old is in school full time.

What do you all think?

TheBTeam
10-09-2009, 08:06 PM
Sorry didn't want to read and run, but you have given me a headache!!:laughing: :panic:

mumx3
10-09-2009, 08:12 PM
thanks anyway!...yes my head hurts too.. I wonder if anyone has the stamina to work through my post:(

sarah707
10-09-2009, 08:25 PM
The usual ratio is 6 under 8...

As you have 2 of your own, yours is reduced to 4...

Ignore the variation if you aren't using it, it is no longer relevant and should be taken off as they are only for the child.

Focus on the 4 under 8.

Of the 4 under 8, only 2 can be pre-schoolers (not in 10 sessions a week school)...

But it is flexible so you can have different combinations eg -

1 preschooler and 3 in school...

OR you can have 2 pre-schoolers (maximum) and 2 in school...

OR you can have 4 in school and no preschoolers...

You can only ever have 1 under 1... that is not flexible... and that one comes out of your preschoolers numbers eg -

1 baby, 1 preschooler and 2 in school...

OR 1 baby and 3 in school...

When your son starts 10 sessions a week school you will be upped to 5 under 8, with 2 preschoolers and 3 in school OR 3 preschoolers and 2 in school OR 5 in school.

Does that help or have I just confused the issue? :panic: :D

Chatterbox Childcare
10-09-2009, 08:26 PM
This is a long one but I would be most grateful if.....

Please would some of you clever clogs tak a quick look at the wording on my variation and help me interpret it.

I have my own 10 year old 4 year old and 16 month old. My 4 year old starts school full time at the end of October.

The registered person:

may care for no more than 4 children under 8 years; of these, not more than 2 may be in the early years age group, and of these, not more than 1 may be under 1 year at any one time (Early Years Register, compulsory part of the Childcare Register)

must not provide overnight care (Early Years Register, compulsory part of the Childcare Register, voluntary part of the Childcare Register)
when caring for 4 or 5 year old children who are in full time education, may increase the number in the early years age group by the number of children in full time education, providing the maximum number is not exceeded (Early Years Registration)

may exceed this ratio to allow X children in the early years age group for the children named on the variation request of 25/08/2009 (Early Years Register, compulsory part of the Childcare Register)

may only care for such children Tuesday and Wednesday from 08.00 until 09.00 and 11.30 until 17.30. This exception applies until one of those named children is no longer in the early years age group or is no longer cared for by the childminder (Early Years Register, compulsory part of the Childcare Register)

I currently care for....

8 month old baby tues weds, fri

5 year old (not in full time school until end of Oct) mon, thurs

mindees are listed in red

monday 10y, 4y, 16m, 5y
tues 10y 4 y 16m 8m,
weds 10y 4 y 16m 8m,
thurs 10y, 4y, 16m, 5y
fri 10y 4 y 16m 8m,

I applied to have the variation to have the 5 year old on tuesdays and weds days before and after the time she is at school for her half day of settling in.

However before I had the variation done my certificate read may care for 1 child in the early years age group.

Now it reads 2 in the early years age group and goes on to say that I can exceed this on the tues and weds.

Does that mean I can have four in the early years age group PLUS the named 5 year old! eeek!

Or is it a mistake.

I am wondering if it is to do with my own 4 year old about to start full time also.

Please help I am confused.

The other complicating factor is....the 5 year old who I got the variation done for doesnt now even need it as mum sorted something else out when the variation didnt come back quick enough.

However I had an enquiry today for a 2 year old who need tues, thurs, fri and to start asap.

Now even without the variation (which refers to the named child, i.e. 5 year old) according the the certificate "may care for no more than 4 children under 8 years; of these, not more than 2 may be in the early years age group" I could do it. But I am not sure if this is correct or an error.

Either way by the end of Oct it wont matter as my 4 year old is in school full time.

What do you all think?


Your own child and your 5 year old child are both in the Early Years Age hgroup until 31st August 2010 and that is why the paragraph is there.

mumx3
10-09-2009, 08:50 PM
The usual ratio is 6 under 8...

As you have 2 of your own, yours is reduced to 4...

Ignore the variation if you aren't using it, it is no longer relevant and should be taken off as they are only for the child.

Focus on the 4 under 8.

Of the 4 under 8, only 2 can be pre-schoolers (not in 10 sessions a week school)...

But it is flexible so you can have different combinations eg -

1 preschooler and 3 in school...

OR you can have 2 pre-schoolers (maximum) and 2 in school...

OR you can have 4 in school and no preschoolers...

You can only ever have 1 under 1... that is not flexible... and that one comes out of your preschoolers numbers eg -

1 baby, 1 preschooler and 2 in school...

OR 1 baby and 3 in school...

When your son starts 10 sessions a week school you will be upped to 5 under 8, with 2 preschoolers and 3 in school OR 3 preschoolers and 2 in school OR 5 in school.

Does that help or have I just confused the issue? :panic: :D

Hi there ,

massive appreciation for the reply...I know how long winded it was.

I just need to clarify this...

My cert orignally said 1 in the early years age group and now it says 2. EVEN though my 4 year old hasnt YET started full time school.

Which means now they have changed it, BUT I still have 2 children of my own in the early years age group (4year old and 16 month old) AND it says I can care for 2 others in the EY age group.

Surely I cannot have for 4 in the EY age group PLUS the 5yo (EY age group) that the variation was for?

I am wondering if they confused the initial "1 in the early years age group" which it said initially on my cert, perhaps is should still read 1 NOT 2 like it does now.:panic:

Still not sure if I should take on the 2 year old! lol!

sarah707
11-09-2009, 07:16 AM
Best send them an email -

enquiries@ofsted.gov.uk :D

MissTinkerbell
11-09-2009, 09:53 AM
As regards to having 4 in the EY age group. The variation ONLY applies to the child named in the variation ie the 5 year old.

I have 2 variations for the same things and they only apply to the 2 named children and for the dates stated - I cannot use them for a different child.

Your own 2 children and your 5 year old and the 8m old are the 4 in the EY age group. Your 4 year old and the 5 year old will remain in EY age group until 31st August. However after October you should be able to take on 1 more under 5 to take your total to 3 but not 4, as the variation ONLY relates to the 5 year old whilst he is in part-time school.

If you were to take on the new enquiry before October you would have to apply for another variation as they cannot be swapped between children, IYSWIM.

mumx3
11-09-2009, 07:16 PM
thanks all...for trying to unravel it for me. I will email ofsted.