Mindees' Playdates During Minding Hours

[Willowdancer]

I have my two over-8s full time in the holidays (8am to 5.30pm/6.00pm) and have hit upon an interesting conundrum!

My oldest mindee's friend sent her a text earlier and has asked her over to play tomorrow afternoon, which would be during my minding hours. I said she had to ask her mum and dad if its ok but I don't have a problem with it if they say yes. (This is my standard answer to everything at the moment :laughing:)

Assuming that they might actually say yes, I just wondered what normally happens in these situations as obviously they're on holiday and they want to see their friends but they're supposed to be my responsibility during minding hours so I don't know what to do!

Thanks!!

Ali

[Pipsqueak]

I think you would need written permission for this just to cover yourself but I am not sure where you would stand because that child is out of your sight and hearing and you are not with them (best check with your insurer).

The only way you could do it is sign them out and not get paid for that period of time I suppose - so you are not responsible for them

[FussyElmo]

Think I woukd get the parents to come and pick them up and drop them off at friends house. Then they are no longer your responsability:)

[The Juggler]

I would think that I would want to be paid - if they are having a playdate agreed by mum and dad, I wouldn't want my wages docked!

[Pipsqueak]

I would think that I would want to be paid - if they are having a playdate agreed by mum and dad, I wouldn't want my wages docked!

but to be paid you have to be responsible for them and that means either being with them or having them within earshot

[Tatjana]

but to be paid you have to be responsible for them and that means either being with them or having them within earshot

But that's not what happens if you're paid and they're at nursery/pre school?!

Just a thought...

xx

[Willowdancer]

Think I woukd get the parents to come and pick them up and drop them off at friends house. Then they are no longer your responsability:)

I can't - parents both work out of the area :rolleyes: I'll just keep my fingers crossed that mindee has forgotten all about it by the time they're collected tonight.

The only other solution would be to have the friend here I suppose, but I'm in no mood for adding an extra child after the day I've had with our 3 and the 2 mindees today :(

[Pipsqueak]

But that's not what happens if you're paid and they're at nursery/pre school?!

Just a thought...

xx

good point!

[Willowdancer]

But that's not what happens if you're paid and they're at nursery/pre school?!

Just a thought...

xx

Well that was my thought too but if they go to nursery/pre-school then you've got the security of knowing that there are other qualified responsible adults looking after them, but who's to say that the friend's mum or dad is even going to be at home? My mum used to leave me at home to go out to work at 11yo (although that was a loooooooooooong time ago and I don't think I'd do that with my lot!)

[FussyElmo]

You get the friends mum to pick the mindee up as long as you have written permission from the parents this would cover you.

It is hard in the holidays but I will not have my mindees friends over to play - do it for one you will have to do it for all of them!!!!

Good luck with whatever you decide it is hard to please all the children:)

[cherry pink]

i would still charge if they went to friends as the place is prebooked iyswim. i would also have a letter ready in the morning ready for parents to sign stating that you are no longer responsible for said child once they are at friends as your insurance will not cover you and something for the friends parent to sign if she picks up lo or you drop her off....

[Andrea08]

hi ,, if parents say their over 8's can go play at a friends i would if i could walk them round and take the contact details from the friends parents,,

i would have written signed permission from my parents,,

i would give a time when i would collect or depending on the friends family arange for them to drop off

and yes i would still charge because if anything happened during the afternoon mindee was at friends it would be my responsibility to collect and deal with the situation,,

good luck see what the parents think but tell them you will still charge for thoes hrs unless they want you to drop off at this friends house and end contract hrs on that day and for parents to collect from them not you!!

xx

[Willowdancer]

Quick! They're not here yet but I just knocked up a permission for just in case. Does this make sense?

"I give permission for my child to leave the care of my childminder to go on the following playdate during their contracted hours. I understand that during this period my childminder cannot be responsible for my child and that her public liability insurance will not be effective during this time."

And then I have boxes under that for name, address and phone number, date, drop off and collection times.

Have I missed anything? :eek:

[nannymcflea]

Do you have something for the friends parent to sign too?

That sounds good. You could add that you will have to drop off collect(so child is not walking the street) and are available to collect in emergencies.

[The Juggler]

but to be paid you have to be responsible for them and that means either being with them or having them within earshot

what about days you're paid and parents don't bring them - couldn't it count as similar situation?

[Pipsqueak]

what about days you're paid and parents don't bring them - couldn't it count as similar situation?

sorry wasn't explaining myself well at all at that point:blush: .

What I meant was when you actually have them signed in (attendance sheet and all that) - technically they are meant to be in your sight/sound. If a parent doesn't bring them on a contracted day - thats different.

[Willowdancer]

Right, here's my form (http://www.coolperson.co.uk/playdates.pdf). Can somebody take a look at it for me?

Today's playdate isn't happening but mindees' mum has said there is one on Tuesday instead. I am a bit happier about that one as I know the friend and her mum this time but obviously will still get the form filled out!

[Pipsqueak]

looks good to me:thumbsup:

[Tinglesnark]

i had a thought...could you not arrange to meet mindees mum and pal in the park or similar? then you would be there and your other mindees can benefit too? kinda takes away any problems then?
good luck
x

[Rubybubbles]

sorry but if I am being paid to look after a child, then tough they would have to arrange play dates when not booked in with me:D

My own dd has her friend round to play today, I am NOT working and have no children to look after so I am more than happy!! But would not have her friend round whilst I was working does that make sense?

I also don;t let ANY of my childminded children go out to the park and things as they would itf at home, as above I am being paid to LOOK AFTER them:o

[Rubybubbles]

also good idea during the hols to get contracted hours required before the start then if they descide for there child to go to friends house and not you, they would still pay IYSWIM

[The Juggler]

sorry wasn't explaining myself well at all at that point:blush: .

What I meant was when you actually have them signed in (attendance sheet and all that) - technically they are meant to be in your sight/sound. If a parent doesn't bring them on a contracted day - thats different.

no worries, sometimes I re-read some of my posts and none of them make sense! :laughing:

Anyway, on that point, presumably if you sign them out during charged hours to go to their friends and sign them back in when they come back assume that would just be the same as them being absent on a chargeable day if parents don't bring them. Just need permission forms etc for the hours they are gone?

[Willowdancer]

I also don;t let ANY of my childminded children go out to the park and things as they would itf at home, as above I am being paid to LOOK AFTER them:o

I wouldn't let them go to the park on their own etc, but surely a playdate at a friend's house where a responsible adult is present (with parents agreement and written permission) is no different to the couple of days they spent at their grandma's house, which I still got paid for?

[sweets]

I wouldn't let them go to the park on their own etc, but surely a playdate at a friend's house where a responsible adult is present (with parents agreement and written permission) is no different to the couple of days they spent at their grandma's house, which I still got paid for?

its no different. i would let them go no problem, just get written permission from parents first. thats what summer hols are for, socialising with friends, and meeting up. its not fair, just because a childs parents work shouldn't mean the children should miss out.

[Andrea08]

hi,,,, sorry but im going to put myself in your position,,,,,

1,,, depends on age
2 am i going to be contracted for the hrs child is away
3 i still want payment for hrs away!!! as contracted
4 its the holidays and kids want to be with friends not the childminder and the LO's parents pay us to have their LO's coz family wont have them,,, if a friend want s the LO's to come play and it was yor child what would your say!

think you are contracted to work and should be paid
how many hrs is said child to be at friends house
are you responsible during said hrs at friends house

if parent not happy sign out for said hrs and sign bk in when he returns...

good luck x

[helenlc]

I think the biggest question that needs to be addressed is : Who is responsible if something happens to the child while they are with the other parent?

Is it you as the childminder, or the child's parents if you say you cannot be responisble for them while there or the other childs parents where they are playing?

My 3 yr old (that just finished) was invited to a party at my friends house for her son (mindee and her son went to pre-school together). She said about me leaving him there and I said I cant really as he's my responsibility. But for me to stay there with him would mean me having to have someone look after my 2 children as at 11 and 9 they were too old to attend.

Its a hard one. The 3 yr olds brother I looked after was 9 and was allowed to play outside his house at home. I think some of his boredom here was that he didnt have the freedom he has at home.

[Pipsqueak]

How sad am I at this time of night!!!!

but here goes:

taken from NCMA handbook 08/9 page 154
'if the children you mind (aged under 8) are invited out, ie birthdas party, you should stay with them. The insurance cover wil not apply if the registered childminder is not present, except in a geniuine emergecny. This does not apply to over 7' childminders who care only for children 8 and over. However we wold suggst you have written permission from the parent for the children to attend such events and as they are not under your supervision there is no cover under the policy'

I think I would check with NCMA/Ofsted where I stood on this issue.

[nokidshere]

I have lots of over 8's, they often have playdates. If it is on a school day then the parent arranges it and just lets me know I am not needed. They go home with the friend from school and the parent picks them up at he friends house. Its nothing to do with me.

If they are going somewhere in the holidays it is all arranged with the parent. I do not get involved in arrangements that are being made outside of my home. Sometimes the parent will ask me to drop them off at someones house at a given time and then they (the parent of the playdate friend) will bring them back to me, or the mindees parent picks them up from their friends. I am not responsible for them during the time they are out of my house. I still get paid of course because they were originally booked in with me.

[nokidshere]

How sad am I at this time of night!!!!

but here goes:

taken from NCMA handbook 08/9 page 154
'if the children you mind (aged under 8) are invited out, ie birthdas party, you should stay with them. The insurance cover wil not apply if the registered childminder is not present, except in a geniuine emergecny. This does not apply to over 7' childminders who care only for children 8 and over. However we wold suggst you have written permission from the parent for the children to attend such events and as they are not under your supervision there is no cover under the policy'

I think I would check with NCMA/Ofsted where I stood on this issue.


I can't think of an instance though where a parent would expect me to be responsible for a child if they are not with me. If a party or playdate is arranged by the parent then thats up to them. If the child is not at my home then I am not minding them. If someone invites Me AND my mindees to an event then it would be part of my working day and I would stay with them.

[Chatterbox Childcare]

My children come first and if I have the space under my insurance then they can come and play.

If there was an accident you would be responsible whether you were a childminder or not if the parents were not close to call.

I don't see why you need all these forms if you are not contracted?

Just have them to play.

[Pipsqueak]

I am being even sadder -

page 155 of Handbook 08/09

'children aged 8-15 (inclusive) are covered by the insurance for outside recreational activities or walking to and from school unaccompanied if the childminder is the person responsible for thm at that time. You will need to obtain written permission from the child(rens) parents.

didn't see that bit last night. so its now down to defining 'recreational activities' - again I would ask NCMA/insurance to clarify that this includes playdates

[Pipsqueak]

I can't think of an instance though where a parent would expect me to be responsible for a child if they are not with me. If a party or playdate is arranged by the parent then thats up to them. If the child is not at my home then I am not minding them. If someone invites Me AND my mindees to an event then it would be part of my working day and I would stay with them.

yes but what is under discussion here is a child in your minded care going out to a friends house on a play date. If they are contracted to be with you - should you let them go or not? Who is the responsible party - after all it does say that minded children should be within sight/sound. We/You/I are being paid to care for that child during contracted hours and therefore responsible.

[nokidshere]

yes but what is under discussion here is a child in your minded care going out to a friends house on a play date. If they are contracted to be with you - should you let them go or not? Who is the responsible party - after all it does say that minded children should be within sight/sound. We/You/I are being paid to care for that child during contracted hours and therefore responsible.

If a child was leaving my home to go to a friends for a playdate (arranged by the parent) then they wouldn't be in my care and I would not be responsible for them. On my register they would be booked out (and back in if they are returned to me). The parent would still pay me because the space was booked for their child.

I would never allow myself to be held responsible for a child that I am not physically caring for.

[Andrea08]

Hi,, whats the update on this?
what arrangements have you made with the parents, I think after reading all the posts i have to agree book the child out and then back in, cover yourself as much as possible and as contracted hrs you still should be paid unless notice was given for a day off!!

good luck xx

[Willowdancer]

Oooh look at all kerfuffle I created!! Ooops :blush:

I am still not entirely sure what is happening tomorrow as mum doesn't have much time to talk before whizzing off to catch her train in the morning (especially when I forgot to set the alarm and she was on my doorstep ringing my mobile :o ) so I will collar her tonight to find out as the girls are adamant that the younger one is going to her friend's house for part of tomorrow and the mum is picking her up from here.

I will have a copy of my form ready for mindee's mum to fill in and will sign the mindee out and back in again and get the other mum to sign my form too.

Argggh, its so tricky to know what to do! If its a pre-arranged playdate (as in pre-arranged between the parents, not the mindees and their friends) then fine I suppose but I'd never allow anything that happens off the cuff and in that situation the friend could come here at a push (although I am limited with space and I can't just herd them out into the garden as its not registered for use at the moment :( )

[Willowdancer]

Right, have phoned my CDO and she said:

1) Get written permission from the parents.

2) Ask friend's mum to identify herself when she collects the mindee (just as you would any visitor who arrives when mindees are present.)

3) Collect a full day's pay (and have a quieter house for a few hours!)

:D