Update on kiddie in crocs

[balloon]

Background for those who did not read original post:
Mindee 3.5 years has been wearing croc type shoes to sessions the last couple of weeks. They are the cheaper version which are lethal on smooth wet surfaces (they turn into 'ice skates'!) I have asked her no less than 4 times and probably more, not to send her in them cos they are not fit for childminding purposes and we have all had to stay at home cos we couldn't go to the park. I have put it in the accident book when said shoes rubbed her poor little feet so raw that they bled and said on the form that Mum has been asked not to send the child in them again. She still turned up in them daily. On Friday I sent a newsletter home saying that children turning up in crocs will not be admitted and asked parents to send lightweight waterproof jackets and sunhats for their children whatever the weather (they can leave them here if they choose to do so).

Mindee turned up this morning in 'crocs' and a denim jacket with no sunhat! :angry: :angry: :angry:

I said to mum that it said in the letter that if the child turns up in crocs they won't be admitted and her answer was 'really?' so I said yes cos they're dangerous. Mum started getting a bit loud saying 'well she's been wearing them for 3 years and hasn't had an accident in them yet!!'

Ok so I don't want a row on my doorstep at 7am (rented accommodation) so I let the child in. (You may think this was stupid and I don't blame you ...)

This parent has messed me about with one thing or another from the day she started. From booking 5 days and only wanting 4, not letting me know her hours until just before child started, to turning up late, to cancelling BHs at last minute and not paying for them, to paying late, sending child with no food and expecting me to have something in the cupboard to feed her, sending me a text saying she'd be late to pick up and then turning up half an hour late after I'd said no you can't cos we are going out - the list goes on. The child was let run rings round her mum before she started here and has been very hard work but we've gotten her behaving well here (she's still a pain for mum and stepdad)

She has just changed her hours (at 2 weeks notice not the required 4) from 33 to 11 which I am fine with (not the 2 weeks notice but I cut her some slack cos she's getting married - as I've cut her slack with every other thing cos she's young or cos she's a single mum etc). Because there's no room on the contract to change it any more we agreed to terminate the current one which runs out Friday and start a new one next week after she's married her partner so new name etc . I haven't done the new contract yet and tbh I don't want to now I really have had enough.

My feeling right now is to give her a note tonight stating that due to being unable to work with her to the best interests of her child I am unable to offer her a new contract next week...

Although I know she's gonna get loud and aggressive and cause me probs for the rest of the week so I'm tempted to leave it til Friday... (but she gets married Saturday so that would be a bit mean...but she's been living with this bloke for months though... )

Your thoughts?

[huggableshelly]

just briefly read as dahsing out on school run


can you ask parent to provide a change of shoes for outdoor play to allow the child to climb and play in safer shoes?

[wendywu]

SHE sounds like the spoilt child here, its about time someone said no to her.:angry:

She is being ****** minded for the sake of it about the crocs. You dont need to play out a battle of wills with her. I would end the contract if you can afford to loose the money.:(

[ajs]

i would give notice too but make sure you do it within the confines of your present contract please, she sounds like she could get nasty.

silly woman does she not realise how cruel she's being to her poor child, those fake crocs are not suitable wear for small feet and what's more they are beach shoes there is no support in them her feet will spread and she won't be able to get her into proper shoes come winter as nothing will fit.

i think i would do the notice tonight and put up with the rubbish this week, it is a bit harsh to wait until friday.

good luck to you though

[balloon]

just briefly read as dahsing out on school run


can you ask parent to provide a change of shoes for outdoor play to allow the child to climb and play in safer shoes?

I have done hun, several times in fact, but no joy...

Thank you for taking the time to post when you're in a rush.

[balloon]

i would give notice too but make sure you do it within the confines of your present contract please, she sounds like she could get nasty.

silly woman does she not realise how cruel she's being to her poor child, those fake crocs are not suitable wear for small feet and what's more they are beach shoes there is no support in them her feet will spread and she won't be able to get her into proper shoes come winter as nothing will fit.

i think i would do the notice tonight and put up with the rubbish this week, it is a bit harsh to wait until friday.

good luck to you though

Totally agree about the cruelty bit, the child's feet were rubbed raw. She already has really broad feet so I hope for her sake they don't spread more, poor kid.

If she's terminated the contract in writing (which she has) with no mention on that about a new contract does that mean I still have to terminate within terms of contract (ie 28 days notice) or can I just refuse to begin another one?

[Chatterbox Childcare]

I know that it is easier to terminate the contract but is it in the best interest of the child? You say that you have her behaving as you would like so why not now ask for a meeting with mum one night this week when she collects and hash out the problems. I expect mum is under some stress at the moment too with the wedding.

I understand that we get parents who are not what we would want but in the interest of the mindee would it not be worth another go?

[wendywu]

What you could do is to front her. Have the letter of termination in your hand tonight. Tell her you are going to hand it to her if she will not back down about the crocs. Tell her life is too stressful without having to have a running battle every morning. Tell her its up to her, is she really going to disrupt her child and loose childcare over a pair of shoes that only cost about 3 pounds.

Tell her that as you get older and wiser you sometimes have to concede your priniples for a quite life. So whats it to be. ;)

[Daftbat]

I know that it is easier to terminate the contract but is it in the best interest of the child? You say that you have her behaving as you would like so why not now ask for a meeting with mum one night this week when she collects and hash out the problems. I expect mum is under some stress at the moment too with the wedding.

I understand that we get parents who are not what we would want but in the interest of the mindee would it not be worth another go?

Whilst i would agree that every avenue of communication should be taken in order to make the best choice for the child i think that the cm has tried her best already. This parent is obviously not going to change and from the other instances quoted is oblivious to other peoples needs (pick up times etc.)

I would terminate contract, wedding or no wedding.

[cabby]

she sounds so much like one of my parents:mad: lo turns up in all weathers wearing his cheap crocs, i have asked her time and time again for him not to come in them, her excuse is always " he refuses to leave the house wearing any other shoes" :censored: he is 3 years old:angry: ive told her to bring another pair with her because there is no way he will refuse to wear different ones for me, ( dont want to make my self sound like some evil old bag), hes turned up again this morning wearing them, ive had to find him a pair of socks because his feet are BLACK, just sent mum a text to say if he turns up in them tomorrow she will have to go home and pick up a different pair, :mad:

[balloon]

something I haven't thought to mention is that the mindee will be leaving me in September anyway to go to playschool (so will be disrupted then anyway). Mum expected me to pick her up and have her for one hour a day in the middle of the day but when I said I'd have to charge her for the whole morning if I did that (rather than the one hour) cos I can't let the place to another child changed her mind.

I have tried talking to her loads, she always says 'oh yes I will...' and then never does. She just says 'sorry' and then expects it to be ok... It's not that I haven't tried, just that it's making me stressed, I'm a single mum too and I end up taking it out on my kids cos there's nowhere else for it to go...

[rickysmiths]

The parent here does sound a bit daft to say the least. However a contract that needs to be reviewed because of changing circumstances does not mean it expires on Friday. You should still give the reqiured notice to end it.

Have you thought about taking some photos of the childs feet and attaching them to the incident report? I have done this with injuries in the past especially if the parent denies something is happening.

I would then give notice tonight, but on condition that if the shoe situation is resolved before the end of the notice period you will continue to care for the child but there will be a clause in the new contract to the effect that if this happens again the contract will end, immediately, without notice.

Also be clear that this is not you being difficult, that this situation affects your whole business and you cannot be put in a position by one parent that stops you going out with the children. Also that you feel sure she would be concerned if this was being done by someone else and her child could not go out.

[angeldelight]

Sounds like you have had enough of this parent and the child wearing the crocs is just the last straw for you

Think you should do what is right for you here

Angel xx

[LOOPYLISA]

I do hope it gets sorted soon, best of luck x :thumbsup:

[Mouse]

If this family is causing you so much stress, then you should consider ending the contract.

I would make it about everything, not just the shoes. If you can, speak to the mum & tell her all your grievances (changing hours, late collection). Don't let it just be about shoes or it might sound petty (even though it isn't!)

I think you will have to give 28 days notice (or whatever it says in your current contract). If mum asks to stay, tell her you'll see how things go through the notice period.

And like someone else said, keep a record of all the incidents incase mum turns funny. Personally I wouldn't take photos of the child's feet though as I'm not sure that would be allowed.

[Ripeberry]

Sorry you're having so much trouble :mad: Those fake crocks are rubbish. I would not even call them beach shoes as my daughter had some and when sand gets in them it rubs her feet raw!
Nasty things!

[wendywu]

Well if she is going anyway i would give notice tonight.

But as stated put in writing that in the notice period you will not accept the child while wearing the crocs.

Silly women, sounds like the type who makes every situation a confrontation:mad:

[flora]

I have to say and I know this won't be popular, but if I wanted to keep this lo ( and it sounds like you don't) I would just buy a cheap pair of doodles type shoes.

That way she can keep them at yours and prob solved.

I have done this with my lo as she often turns up in daft shoes, we keep the daft shoes for indoors like slippers and if we go out she wears the doodlie type ones.


I know it's NOT our responsibility to clothe/ feed and shoe our mindees to compensate for feckless parents but sometimes........

Just a thought :blush:

[wendywu]

Yes but if the parent finds out you are changing the childs shoes she may get funny about it. This mum sounds a bit of a control freak.:mad:

[Pipsqueak]

You were saying that it impacts on the other children - which it must do if this lo can't go out and play or you can't walk places - then I would ask mum in for a chat tonight and explain this (perhaps again). Make it very clear that unless altenative suitable footwear is provided then you cannot take the child for that day as it is negatively impacting blah blah.
You can give her two choices - either you can buy a cheap pair of sandels/pumps/trainers and bill the parent or they can provide a pair.

[Pipsqueak]

And like someone else said, keep a record of all the incidents incase mum turns funny. Personally I wouldn't take photos of the child's feet though as I'm not sure that would be allowed.

Yes you can take pix!

[Helen79]

I'm sorry you're still having problems with this. Hope you manage to come to a decision about it today.

on days when it doesn't matter what shoes my dd wears (like a quick trip to the shop or playing in the garden) she's allowed to choose. On other days like nursery days when it matters she doesn't get a choice & wears the right shoes.
If she has a strop about it then she leaves without shoes on. She usually agrees to putting the shoes on 2 steps out the front door & puts them on.

[LittleMissSparkles]

something I haven't thought to mention is that the mindee will be leaving me in September anyway to go to playschool (so will be disrupted then anyway). Mum expected me to pick her up and have her for one hour a day in the middle of the day but when I said I'd have to charge her for the whole morning if I did that (rather than the one hour) cos I can't let the place to another child changed her mind.

I have tried talking to her loads, she always says 'oh yes I will...' and then never does. She just says 'sorry' and then expects it to be ok... It's not that I haven't tried, just that it's making me stressed, I'm a single mum too and I end up taking it out on my kids cos there's nowhere else for it to go...


Personally I would give notice if she is going in september anyway, its only a matter of 3 months unless you need the income from her till you fillthe space,she sounds like a nightmare to try communicate with, sending you a big hug babe xxx

[FizzysFriends]

I think from what I have read I would give notice too and Im thinking its not just the shoes that is the problem its lots of things the parent is saying/doing/not doing.

If the mom has terminated the contact in writing I don't think you have to give 28 days notice too?

[Spangles]

I would be tempted to say to terminate the contract as this mum sounds a nightmare but if the child is leaving in 3 months anyway could you not put up with it a bit longer but just be really firm with the mum?

You need to carry out your 'threats' because she's not taking you seriously and is ignoring you.

I guess it's like with a child, only make 'threats' that you fully intend to carry out otherwise it's pointless and just makes things worse.

You have to do what's best for you, only you know how bad it is and if you can handle it for any longer or not.

I do feel for you though, sounds like this woman is one that I just wouldn't be able to bear!x

[mandy moo]

Yes but if the parent finds out you are changing the childs shoes she may get funny about it. This mum sounds a bit of a control freak.:mad:


In my opinion I think thats tough, shes been asked several time not to bring the child in them and why.
So long as the child is back in his own shoes when he goes home, I wouldnt have there could be too much of a problem?
Just an observation:)

[Twinkles]

I know this is aside from your issue really but......my son who's a design consultant for a lift engineering company took one look at my mindees crocks and said
'Whatever you do don't take him on escalators wearing those things will you ?'
When I asked why he said that they'd had reports of children having serious accidents when the croc got stuck to the escalator even to the point of losing a limb !

[balloon]

Thanks for all your replies.

Re buying shoes - Yes I could do this but as we do not have shoe shops here it would mean taking 2 babies and a 3.5 year old on a bus 30 miles to the city to buy them along with my own two kids of course, (better not leave them at home, lol) which puts the price of a cheap pair of shoes at akin to Clarks/Startrite. :eek: It is something I had considered though and it's a good thought, thank you. (I have bought this child a waterproof coat, slippers, a sun hat and other things that Mum failed to provide when asked so it's not that I am too tight to buy things for the mindees, honest, lol)

Re 28 days notice: I spoke to the childminding association this morning and because parent terminated her contract I am under no obligation to renegotiate a new one. (legally) I can say to the parent that if she wants to remain in my care she must stop sending her child in crocs or I can simply refuse to do a new contract. The advisor said nurseries and playgroups etc all over the country are also banning crocs so I am not alone.

Flora, thank you for your thought. It's not that I don't want to keep the little one, she darned hard work but gorgeous and I love her just a little bit BUT I cannot carry on with Mum expecting to get away with stuff the other parents have to do, I've bent over backwards to help her, to do things for her that I don't do for the others and to cut her slack when things dont go to plan. I am just so exhausted from running around after her and these little 'battles' of will that I cannot continue.

Spangles, you are totally right about carrying out my threats, I'm with you 100% on that. I was stupid this morning when I let the child in, I should have sent her off to get shoes as I said in the letter. Unfortunately I chose the easy path which means if she stays she will just walk over me more. :(

Thank you so much to everybody who replied, I think I've got all the specific questions asked but if I've missed you please don't be offended (these babies will only sleep for so long so I'm rushing, lol!)

Mum has collected now and I was calm and professional as usual. I am going to type out a letter tonight along with her invoice for this week but sleep on it and see if I still feel the same tomorrow.

WRT the escalator thing I shall do a search in a mo if sleeping babes allow to see if I can find any news reports as I'd hate to see the poor child go through anything like that. Thank you for telling me.

Thanks again to everybody who replied, I really do appreciate it.

Blue x

[aly]

WRT the escalator thing I shall do a search in a mo if sleeping babes allow to see if I can find any news reports as I'd hate to see the poor child go through anything like that. Thank you for telling me.


found these for you...not checked if real stories but could be useful

http://consumerist.com/296972/children-crocs-and-escalators-combine-to-produce-mangled-feet

http://www.scribd.com/doc/2058526/The-Croc-Bites-a-products-liability-lawsuit-follows

http://www.theinsider.com/news/362409_THE_LATE_SIFT_Escalators_Mangling_Crocs_cla d_Toes

these were a google search just for 'Hazards of crocs' I didxnt even put escalator in search!!!

[rickysmiths]

I must confess I would be quite weary of giving any of the links or info to this mum. It is quiet out of date and although I'm not diputing the fact that the shoes could be dangerous and it makes interesting reading, I think we have to be very careful about what we quote.

I would stick to your guns on your own evidence and risk assess on the basis of that as well.

Personally, although they are ugly, I have recently bought a pair of Crocs from Costco, because when I tried them on they were soooo comfortable. :laughing:
My 16yr hates them! They are as light as a feather and kind of massage your feet as you are wearing them. I would not go out in them apart from the Garden. But excellent for slipping on in the middle of the night to go to the loo if you are camping or to wear in the showers.

[Hebs]

my 18 month old mindee wears shoes that i bought for her, mum has no idea as she's always back in her own shoes by the end of the day :blush:

she wears sandals no matter what the weather, i bought a pair of clarks cruisers off ebay for 99p :thumbsup:

good luck x

[candy cat]

Background for those who did not read original post:
Mindee 3.5 years has been wearing croc type shoes to sessions the last couple of weeks. They are the cheaper version which are lethal on smooth wet surfaces (they turn into 'ice skates'!) I have asked her no less than 4 times and probably more, not to send her in them cos they are not fit for childminding purposes and we have all had to stay at home cos we couldn't go to the park. I have put it in the accident book when said shoes rubbed her poor little feet so raw that they bled and said on the form that Mum has been asked not to send the child in them again. She still turned up in them daily. On Friday I sent a newsletter home saying that children turning up in crocs will not be admitted and asked parents to send lightweight waterproof jackets and sunhats for their children whatever the weather (they can leave them here if they choose to do so).

Mindee turned up this morning in 'crocs' and a denim jacket with no sunhat! :angry: :angry: :angry:

I said to mum that it said in the letter that if the child turns up in crocs they won't be admitted and her answer was 'really?' so I said yes cos they're dangerous. Mum started getting a bit loud saying 'well she's been wearing them for 3 years and hasn't had an accident in them yet!!'

Ok so I don't want a row on my doorstep at 7am (rented accommodation) so I let the child in. (You may think this was stupid and I don't blame you ...)

This parent has messed me about with one thing or another from the day she started. From booking 5 days and only wanting 4, not letting me know her hours until just before child started, to turning up late, to cancelling BHs at last minute and not paying for them, to paying late, sending child with no food and expecting me to have something in the cupboard to feed her, sending me a text saying she'd be late to pick up and then turning up half an hour late after I'd said no you can't cos we are going out - the list goes on. The child was let run rings round her mum before she started here and has been very hard work but we've gotten her behaving well here (she's still a pain for mum and stepdad)

She has just changed her hours (at 2 weeks notice not the required 4) from 33 to 11 which I am fine with (not the 2 weeks notice but I cut her some slack cos she's getting married - as I've cut her slack with every other thing cos she's young or cos she's a single mum etc). Because there's no room on the contract to change it any more we agreed to terminate the current one which runs out Friday and start a new one next week after she's married her partner so new name etc . I haven't done the new contract yet and tbh I don't want to now I really have had enough.

My feeling right now is to give her a note tonight stating that due to being unable to work with her to the best interests of her child I am unable to offer her a new contract next week...

Although I know she's gonna get loud and aggressive and cause me probs for the rest of the week so I'm tempted to leave it til Friday... (but she gets married Saturday so that would be a bit mean...but she's been living with this bloke for months though... )

Your thoughts?

You sound life a wonderful CM and i feel you are not being appreciated by this parent....i would end her contract as i am sure you will have no problems filling this place.The job is hard enough without getting grief like this.I hope you resolve it soon cx

[balloon]

I spent a long time drafting a letter last night that was professional polite and to the point. It said (in brief) that as we had been unable to reach a compromise with regard to her child's footwear I would be unable to offer the child a new contract.

Child ironically turns up at 7am in trainers today. I'm guessing Mum realised she'd pushed one step too far this time. :rolleyes: I gave Mum the letter and politely said that I'm unable to offer her a new contract. Mum seemed shocked! :eek: I cannot understand why...

Totally unrelated to this but a good thing: I got stopped by a parent last night (after I'd written letter to first) who'd made 'loose' enquiries about another child (actually 2 but older one is ad hoc) starting here a few weeks ago, and they definitely want a place and are coming in at 9am to sign paperwork. :clapping: New child will start in 2 weeks :)

What is it they say? When one door closes ...

Thanks again to everybody who offered suggestions and advice, all very much appreciated. xx

[Pudding Girl]

Bet that feels like a weight off :)

[Spangles]

Good for you that's brilliant news!

[Bushpig]

Well done - what a fabulous outcome!!! I am so glad you stuck with your guns and gave notice - and then have filled the vacancy already :clapping: :clapping: :clapping: I hope that mother has learnt a valuable lesson and will not make the same mistakes (not listening ever!) at her next child carer.

Re crocs - in SA where I am from - people live in them... they are for sunny weather imo... I have some too and love them. A mindee wears them and we have yet (touch wood) had any accidents with them. First I'd heard re the escalator :eek: accident!

[flora]

Blue moon, I am so glad the other door opened :clapping:

Enjoy your new mindee :thumbsup:

[MissTinkerbell]

:clapping: Oh so pleased that its sorted and as you say when one door closes.... this was my grandma's favourite saying and one I strongly believe in.

Good luck with the new mindee. :jump for joy:

[Lady Haha]

Just read the whole thread and I do like a happy ending!!! Well done you for sticking to your guns and giving notice. I know I would be umming and ahhing, thinking am I being mean etc. But as some one else said, hopefully, this mother will have learnt a lesson here.

[Chatterbox Childcare]

Glad it has all worked out for you and now you can sit back and enjoy your job once again

[HomefromHome]

if this particular contract is ending this week anyway then you dont have to give notice??!!??? and i would do what someone else says - say you are not willing to continue unless she sends her child in appropriate clothing and footwear.... tell her tonight too as she would need to sort out somewhere else.

[balloon]

You are right HFH, I don't have to give her notice. I just put it in writing so she could read and digest rather than talk over me so I can't get a word in... :rolleyes:

I told Mum this morning. I also gave her a list of all other child carers in the area from childminders to nurseries so she shouldn't have any trouble finding replacement childcare. :)

Blackandsparkly, I have been umming and ahhing for the past 6 months (from when I realised parent had lied about her hours changing to secure a place). The shoes thing was just the straw that broke the camels back. When the child cried to stay with me today rather than going home I did feel mean though, VERY mean...