First Aid Certificate due to expire

[DudleyChildmind]

Does anyone know what the procedure is if a first aid certificate is due to be renewed but you can't get on a course right away? Are you still able to childmind if you can prove to ofsted that a course has been booked?

[claires]

As far as I understand, if you have proof you are booked on a 1st aid course or at least on the reserve list then i think Ofsted are ok. I think!
xx

[sonia ann]

Thats what I have always understood as well:)

[Pipsqueak]

you are in breach of regulation not having a current certificate. a childminder in our area was marked as inadequate because her certificate had lapsed by days by the time of her inspection - even though she was booked on a course for that weekend.

if you can't get on a course - give your local St Johns Ambulance a call and ask them if you can get on one of theres. you may have to travel for it though

[sarah707]

you are in breach of regulation not having a current certificate. a childminder in our area was marked as inadequate because her certificate had lapsed by days by the time of her inspection - even though she was booked on a course for that weekend.

if you can't get on a course - give your local St Johns Ambulance a call and ask them if you can get on one of theres. you may have to travel for it though

This has always been my understanding as well.

I suggest you ring Ofsted and ask tomorrow - 08456 404040

[claires]

blimey sorry to give you wrong info :(

[Pipsqueak]

blimey sorry to give you wrong info :(

don't be hard on yourself - we all make mistakes.
Its in the EYFS somewhere (to tired to look now), once over the info you gave was correct though hun:)

[rickysmiths]

Just got back from a course on 'Graded Inspections'. This came up and Ofsted will now grade you as inadequate if your First Aid Cert has lapsed.

It is part of your conditions of registration. Sorry but you should have thought further ahead. I would ring your nearest St John Amblulance, Red Cross and or speak to your Development Worker/ Childrens Centre with some urgency.

[miffy]

you are in breach of regulation not having a current certificate. a childminder in our area was marked as inadequate because her certificate had lapsed by days by the time of her inspection - even though she was booked on a course for that weekend.


That's my understanding too, it's now a legal requirement so there is no lee-way.

Miffy xx

[angeldelight]

Does anyone know what the procedure is if a first aid certificate is due to be renewed but you can't get on a course right away? Are you still able to childmind if you can prove to ofsted that a course has been booked?


Poor you

I had the same problem about a month ago and I was in a panic because I thought Ofsted were due too

Ask Carol I was almost crying and could not get on a course at all even a paid one

Call your local training team and explain the situation , they were fantastic in our area and did get me on one

I had been on a waiting list since last year and they said there were no places till Sept this year

Anyway what annoyed me is that there was supposed to be 21 in our group and only 11 turned up
So others like us who were in a panic would have jumped at those places

They told me that they can sometimes still fit you in on a day if someone does not turn up - not sure how that works or if its true though

Anyway my advice is pester , pester and pester more

Good luck keep us posted

Angel xx

[DudleyChildmind]

Thank you all very much for your help. It's not actually for me it's for another childminder who isn't a member on here. She has booked herself on a course but the earliest is June even though she told the CIS it was urgent.

[SimplyLucy]

From now on when you renew your first aid, Ofsted will be informed so they will have your details on record of when your certificate expires.

I'm half way through my course, got the second half tomorrow. We had to give all our details so the company can inform Ofsted of who has passed.

[christine e]

If your friend is really desperate then I think I would check out what courses are being held locally that she (or he) could attend and just turn up and see if they will let her/him join if someone doesn't turn up 'cos as someone has previously mentioned there seems to always be a few who do not turn up. Nothing to lose and everything to gain!

Cx

[miffy]

I'm half way through my course, got the second half tomorrow. We had to give all our details so the company can inform Ofsted of who has passed.

Haven't heard that before, makes sense though

Miffy xx

[angeldelight]

From now on when you renew your first aid, Ofsted will be informed so they will have your details on record of when your certificate expires.

I'm half way through my course, got the second half tomorrow. We had to give all our details so the company can inform Ofsted of who has passed.

I have not heard that its a good idea though

Where did you hear that Lucy ?

Angel xx

[Pudding Girl]

Sorry but you should have thought further ahead.
.


That's rather harsh - I have been attempting to get on a first aid course without success for 18 months ( thinking well ahead!!! :rolleyes: ) - no fault of my own, there simply isn't the provision in some areas, not everyone lives in big towns with loads of resources.
If you cannot get on a course, you cannot get on a course.

Luckily when I was inspected my First Aid was still in date. I'm finally getting my course done in April.

[angeldelight]

Just got back from a course on 'Graded Inspections'. This came up and Ofsted will now grade you as inadequate if your First Aid Cert has lapsed.

It is part of your conditions of registration. Sorry but you should have thought further ahead. I would ring your nearest St John Amblulance, Red Cross and or speak to your Development Worker/ Childrens Centre with some urgency.

That is a bit mean Ricky

We are not all perfect you know and only human after all

Angel xx

[angeldelight]

That's rather harsh - I have been attempting to get on a first aid course without success for 18 months ( thinking well ahead!!! :rolleyes: ) - no fault of my own, there simply isn't the provision in some areas, not everyone lives in big towns with loads of resources.
If you cannot get on a course, you cannot get on a course.

Luckily when I was inspected my First Aid was still in date. I'm finally getting my course done in April.


Yes same here I was on our list for ages and in the end did get a cancellation

So much for thinking ahead !!!

Angel xx

[christine e]

I start to look for suitable courses after 2 years then I'm sure to get it organised in good time before certificate expires.

Cx

[aly]

we were toldon my one last month that the renewal is up to us to find as we wont get notified. we were also told that it has to be in advance BEFORE they run out.

But I'm in Wales so obviously different here.

[Lady Haha]

Blimey! Mine expires this time next year, I better start looking then!

[~Chelle~]

you are in breach of regulation not having a current certificate. a childminder in our area was marked as inadequate because her certificate had lapsed by days by the time of her inspection - even though she was booked on a course for that weekend.

if you can't get on a course - give your local St Johns Ambulance a call and ask them if you can get on one of theres. you may have to travel for it though

When I had my inspection, the inspector said that as I had proof that I was book on a course for the following week that was fine. If I didnt have the proof I would have been marked as inadequate.

I think it is down to the individual inspector.

I am sure that if you contact Ofsted they will be fine as long as you can prove that you have a course booked.

My advice for anyone would be to get booked on a course before your certificate runs out, even if it hasnt yet expired, I will definately be doing that in 3 years time xx

[yummymummy]

I would advise to look around a good few months ahead, just had an absolute nightmare with mine!!!!! and to top it all no funding in my area so had to pay myself!
Red Cross and St Johns were really expensive over £100 and I would have had to travel to central London for the Red Cross one!
In the end although I had tried our local Preschool Learning Alliance and they were full I rang again on the off chance and got a cancellation. Still £70 but at least local and in good time so that my old certificate hadn't lapsed!
Found the whole experience really stressful and will never be caught again like that.

[angeldelight]

I would advise to book about a year ahead

Angel xx

[Pipsqueak]

When I had my inspection, the inspector said that as I had proof that I was book on a course for the following week that was fine. If I didnt have the proof I would have been marked as inadequate.

I think it is down to the individual inspector.

I am sure that if you contact Ofsted they will be fine as long as you can prove that you have a course booked.

My advice for anyone would be to get booked on a course before your certificate runs out, even if it hasnt yet expired, I will definately be doing that in 3 years time xx

sorry Chelle - its says here in the EYFS Legal Requirement bit
At least one person who has a current paediatric first aid certificate must be on the premises at all times when children are present. There must be at least one person on outings who has a current paediatric first aid certificate. First aid training must be approved by the local authority and consistent with guidance set out in the Practice Guidance for the Early Years Foundation Stage. First aid training must be approved by the local authority and consistent with guidance set out in the Practice Guidance for the Early Years Foundation Stage.
http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/eyfs/site/requirements/welfare/safeguarding/2.htm
Illness and Injury - specific legal requirements
The bit quoted in red I take to mean that your first aid certificate must be current or else you are breaking the law - not that your certificate has expired and its ok because you are booked onto a course.


People in my area are being marked inadequate because they are breaking the law by not having a current certificate (even if its lapsed by a few days) EVEN when they have shown proof that they are booked onto a course.
I think in the early days of EYFS the inspectors have been a bit more leinent - but its now 6months on - we should all be complying with the legal bits

[~Chelle~]

It is so hard to find a course on the weekend too, I am still technically on another First Aid companies waiting list and havent heard from them since January, luckily I did my course at the beginning of March!

I wanted a weekend because it would have meant having two days off, thereby losing two days money and also having to pay out for a course.

I also think the cost is awful. I was quoted £80.00 for mine. I checked with my local council and found out that they would subsidise the cost of the course and I ended up paying £47.00 in the end.

When I first started childminding in 2005 my course cost me £15.00!!! How times change!

[angeldelight]

sorry Chelle - its says here in the EYFS Legal Requirement bit
At least one person who has a current paediatric first aid certificate must be on the premises at all times when children are present. There must be at least one person on outings who has a current paediatric first aid certificate. First aid training must be approved by the local authority and consistent with guidance set out in the Practice Guidance for the Early Years Foundation Stage. First aid training must be approved by the local authority and consistent with guidance set out in the Practice Guidance for the Early Years Foundation Stage.
http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/eyfs/site/requirements/welfare/safeguarding/2.htm
Illness and Injury - specific legal requirements
The bit quoted in red I take to mean that your first aid certificate must be current or else you are breaking the law - not that your certificate has expired and its ok because you are booked onto a course.


Yes that is true Pip

I put my name down for a course a year before mine was up and still could not get on one

I knew Ofsted were due so I called them and asked if it was ok that I had my name down - they said NO NO NO

You must have it in place to be able to childmind and remain registered

Angel xx

[angeldelight]

It is so hard to find a course on the weekend too, I am still technically on another First Aid companies waiting list and havent heard from them since January, luckily I did my course at the beginning of March!

I wanted a weekend because it would have meant having two days off, thereby losing two days money and also having to pay out for a course.

I also think the cost is awful. I was quoted £80.00 for mine. I checked with my local council and found out that they would subsidise the cost of the course and I ended up paying £47.00 in the end.

When I first started childminding in 2005 my course cost me £15.00!!! How times change!


Dont you get it free in your area Chelle?

Angel xx

[~Chelle~]

sorry Chelle - its says here in the EYFS Legal Requirement bit
At least one person who has a current paediatric first aid certificate must be on the premises at all times when children are present. There must be at least one person on outings who has a current paediatric first aid certificate. First aid training must be approved by the local authority and consistent with guidance set out in the Practice Guidance for the Early Years Foundation Stage. First aid training must be approved by the local authority and consistent with guidance set out in the Practice Guidance for the Early Years Foundation Stage.
http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/eyfs/site/requirements/welfare/safeguarding/2.htm
Illness and Injury - specific legal requirements
The bit quoted in red I take to mean that your first aid certificate must be current or else you are breaking the law - not that your certificate has expired and its ok because you are booked onto a course.

I am only saying what I was told by an Ofsted inspector and I was graded good in my inspection.

My certificate expired on the 18th February 2009 and I had my inspection on the 27th February 2009 and was booked on a course on the 7th March 2009.

The inspector looked at the booking document that I had for the first aid course and her actual words were "you are lucky that you have this because if you didnt it would have been an unsatisfactory straight away"

I think that as is was only a matter of a few weeks and she knows how hard it is to get on a course in my area, she was lenient with me.

Ofsted are only human and know that sometimes these things happen, I would contact them to see what they say.

[angeldelight]

I am only saying what I was told by an Ofsted inspector and I was graded good in my inspection.

My certificate expired on the 18th February 2009 and I had my inspection on the 27th February 2009 and was booked on a course on the 7th March 2009.

.

Another way in which Osted inspectors work different

I called them and they said they would not allow it

You were really lucky because I was in a panic when it happened to me

Angel xx

[~Chelle~]

Dont you get it free in your area Chelle?

Angel xx

No Angel, I am under Medway council who are rather tight lol

I also got no help with start up costs, although my friend who lives a few streets away, but comes under Kent County Council, did!!:eek:

[angeldelight]

No Angel, I am under Medway council who are rather tight lol

I also got no help with start up costs, although my friend who lives a few streets away, but comes under Kent County Council, did!!:eek:

Thats unfair and really annoying

I wish everyone had the same rules

Angel xx

[~Chelle~]

Another way in which Osted inspectors work different

I called them and they said they would not allow it

You were really lucky because I was in a panic when it happened to me

Angel xx

I think I was really lucky with my inspector then, luckily for me;)

[~Chelle~]

Thats unfair and really annoying

I wish everyone had the same rules

Angel xx

I know, I think she got about £150 towards the cost of prams, highchairs, resources etc. I got my course paid for and that was it :mad:

I think I was working in the negative for about 3 weeks, as I had to buy a pram and highchair and baby toys when I first starte working, was gutted :o(

[angeldelight]

I think I was really lucky with my inspector then, luckily for me;)

Very lucky

I was in a right panic when I knew I had to find a course and they were all booked - almost crying ha

In the end I did get a cancellation but guess what I still have not heard from Ofsted so the panic was for nothing anyway haha

At least its done I suppose

Angel xx

[angeldelight]

I know, I think she got about £150 towards the cost of prams, highchairs, resources etc. I got my course paid for and that was it :mad:

I think I was working in the negative for about 3 weeks, as I had to buy a pram and highchair and baby toys when I first starte working, was gutted :o(


Someone a few miles from me got money for a washing machine and dishwasher

Think I might move areas haha

Angel xx

[Pipsqueak]

sorry Chelle I am not shooting the messenger - didn't mean for that to come across as snotty.

Again its goes down to inspectors personal judgements and its wrong. We should all be working to EYFS legal bits and IMO there should be no give or take. Part of me says its unfair to give leniency on the specific legal bits when other childminders work so darned hard to make sure they are complying right down to the last t that is crossed. We all make mistakes and forget things (thats me - I forget things:) ) but at the end of the day its a mandatory thing.

I know its hard to get on a FA course - blimey I am constantly reminding my lot to make sure they are booked on one. I am eagerly awaiting the new training manual at the moment as I need to get on one - my certificate expires October. Think ours are £50.

Probably still coming across as snotty and I don't mean to - am explaining myself badly. I hear it all the time from my support/vacancy lot - the excuses of why they haven't done this or that - the biggest one is that they haven't even looked at EYFS and I guess that I get a little tired of hearing it.

[angeldelight]

sorry Chelle I am not shooting the messenger - didn't mean for that to come across as snotty.

Again its goes down to inspectors personal judgements and its wrong. We should all be working to EYFS legal bits and IMO there should be no give or take. Part of me says its unfair to give leniency on the specific legal bits when other childminders work so darned hard to make sure they are complying right down to the last t that is crossed. We all make mistakes and forget things (thats me - I forget things:) ) but at the end of the day its a mandatory thing.

I know its hard to get on a FA course - blimey I am constantly reminding my lot to make sure they are booked on one. I am eagerly awaiting the new training manual at the moment as I need to get on one - my certificate expires October. Think ours are £50.

Probably still coming across as snotty and I don't mean to - am explaining myself badly. I hear it all the time from my support/vacancy lot - the excuses of why they haven't done this or that - the biggest one is that they haven't even looked at EYFS and I guess that I get a little tired of hearing it.



Maybe you should just shut up now ??? :laughing: :laughing:

Kidding

We know what you mean and do agree I am sure Chelle does too

Angel xx

[Pipsqueak]

Maybe you should just shut up now ??? :laughing: :laughing:

Kidding

We know what you mean and do agree I am sure Chelle does too

Angel xx

I agree - I will zip it:D

[~Chelle~]

I had actually been on 3 waiting lists since last June!

No where were doing them, I had to practically beg one company to do it on a weekend as they said there was no demand for them. When I actually went on my course there were only two of us there!

I think I get what you are trying to say but it did come across as though I wasnt really bothered when I really was.

Like I said my advice now would be to start looking well in advance of when your FA certificate expires.

I think that in my case, as I had kept all the emails from the first aid companies dating back to June 08, my inspector could see that I had been actively looking for a course and not just started looking because I had an inspection coming up.

Hope this makes sense lol

[~Chelle~]

Maybe you should just shut up now ??? :laughing: :laughing:

Kidding

We know what you mean and do agree I am sure Chelle does too

Angel xx

Hahahaha:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: I will also zip it, i think lol

[rickysmiths]

That's rather harsh - I have been attempting to get on a first aid course without success for 18 months ( thinking well ahead!!! :rolleyes: ) - no fault of my own, there simply isn't the provision in some areas, not everyone lives in big towns with loads of resources.
If you cannot get on a course, you cannot get on a course.

Luckily when I was inspected my First Aid was still in date. I'm finally getting my course done in April.

I'm not being harsh I don't think. It is our responsiblity to have a First Aid qualification. I know some areas have difficulty and courses are not provided the way they should be. We had to batter Herts a couple of years ago because of the lack of courses and the inaccessability of the ones there were. We now have loads of courses. We are lucky we only pay £10.

I have a friend in Bucks who has to arrange her own with a group and it has cost her £75-£100 for years, she also has to pay a lot for Food Hygiene and has had to be registered as a food business for years. She doesn't moan they just have to get on with it and sort it out hard and as unfair as it might be.

[angeldelight]

I'm not being harsh I don't think. It is our responsiblity to have a First Aid qualification. I know some areas have difficulty and courses are not provided the way they should be. We had to batter Herts a couple of years ago because of the lack of courses and the inaccessability of the ones there were. We now have loads of courses. We are lucky we only pay £10.

I have a friend in Bucks who has to arrange her own with a group and it has cost her £75-£100 for years, she also has to pay a lot for Food Hygiene and has had to be registered as a food business for years. She doesn't moan they just have to get on with it and sort it out hard and as unfair as it might be.

Lighten up Ricky

We are all human and all forget things

Have you never done anything wrong in your life ??

Angel xx

[~Chelle~]

I'm not being harsh I don't think. It is our responsiblity to have a First Aid qualification. I know some areas have difficulty and courses are not provided the way they should be. We had to batter Herts a couple of years ago because of the lack of courses and the inaccessability of the ones there were. We now have loads of courses. We are lucky we only pay £10.

I have a friend in Bucks who has to arrange her own with a group and it has cost her £75-£100 for years, she also has to pay a lot for Food Hygiene and has had to be registered as a food business for years. She doesn't moan they just have to get on with it and sort it out hard and as unfair as it might be.

Very harsh I think - we are not all perfect - only human and we do make mistakes - yes it is our responsibilty but you cant book on a course that does'nt exist.

I dont think anyone is moaning just expressing how hard it is!

Chelle x

[Pudding Girl]

I'm not being harsh I don't think. It is our responsiblity to have a First Aid qualification. I know some areas have difficulty and courses are not provided the way they should be. We had to batter Herts a couple of years ago because of the lack of courses and the inaccessability of the ones there were. We now have loads of courses. We are lucky we only pay £10.

I have a friend in Bucks who has to arrange her own with a group and it has cost her £75-£100 for years, she also has to pay a lot for Food Hygiene and has had to be registered as a food business for years. She doesn't moan they just have to get on with it and sort it out hard and as unfair as it might be.

It's not the money - we get some free places that we are up against nurseries, playgroups etc for free places - don't get me started on that one please I'd be here all day!!

I couldn't even get on any paid for courses, I was prepared to inconvenience all my parents and also lose a days pay and fork out travel costs and almost £100 out of my own pocket for a course - and it wasn't for want of trying! - atually telling a lie I did get on one course but that was cancelled get this, for lack of interest!!!! :rolleyes:

[Lady Haha]

I think it is quite harsh to say people should think about it alot more ahead! To be absolutely honest, I didn't even realise that it was so hard to get on a course til I read this thread! When I did mine two years ago, I booked it about two weeks before hand, so I must have been lucky without even realising at the time. If I hadn't read this thread, I would honestly have left it til about two or three months before the cert expired to look into getting on another one.

If you don't know you need to book so far in advance why would you?

[angeldelight]

Does anyone know what the procedure is if a first aid certificate is due to be renewed but you can't get on a course right away? Are you still able to childmind if you can prove to ofsted that a course has been booked?


Did you manage to sort one out now ?

Angel xx

[helenlc]

Mine ran out last July and I tried and tried to get on a course. One was when I was on holiday and another I couldnt do cos of prior commitment.

I ended up doing it in February of this year:blush: .

I think as long as you are trying to get yourself on a course, there is very little they can do.

[DudleyChildmind]

Did you manage to sort one out now ?

Angel xx

Not really Angel :(

She has recently returned back to childminding and she is now getting everything into place but she can not get on a course until June, either paid or unpaid, we've tried everything.

[jellytot]

Thats unfair and really annoying

I wish everyone had the same rules

Angel xx

I had to pay for mine and hubbys also £50 each

[DudleyChildmind]

I had to pay £25 booking it through the CIS.

[John]

We must be very lucky in the Cumbria area as all the main training is free and also with the First Aid Certificate. We get a training bulleting twice a year will all the courses for childminder's and you always get on the course.

I think if it's a legel requirerment OFSTED should be trained to give First Aid trainning to childminders that can't get on a course as it's their requirment.

John.

[DudleyChildmind]

That's a good idea John :D

[angeldelight]

Hope you sort it out soon

Another bit of advice I was given by our early years team was if you have a local nursery - then call and ask them if they can slot you in with their training with their staff

They get theirs booked really quickly so I am told not sure if it is true

It was actually my daughters manager / owner of her nursery that managed to get me on a course - she rang the very same people that I had rang too and she managed to get me in straight away

So if you do know your local nursery it might be worth asking if they can help?

Angel xx

[sonia ann]

I always do mine with the local preschool,they automatically include me in their numbers when they book their course. Because so many of them do it at the same time they are able to book an instructor to come to them. We all know each other as well which is much less intimidating than going somewhere alone. So it is always worth asking local playgroups/preschools etc. It also helps me with communication with other providers as they are more than willing to share their plans and observations as they know and understand and respect what I do.:)