Child turning up early?

[**Orchard CM**]

Hi all,

Ok so I have a child booked in for 8-6 and he turned up this morning at 7. No pre warn and I haven't been paid for it. The most concerning thing is I have epilepsy and rushing in the morning is a HUGE trigger for me which obviously scares me. Me and hubby were still in bed but luckily he jumped up and answered the door.

My question is though, what if this had happened and I was on my own? It would be an increased chance of me having a seizure but I wouldn't want to leave a child/parent waiting?

What would others do? How would I deal with this?

Really appreciate any insight on this!!

Thanks

Xx

[Kiddleywinks]

I'm afraid I would have refused on the doorstep!

I would now, as you have agreed to take the child, be informing parents on collection that they cannot do that again, and you WILL refuse to take child until 8am as per your contract.
I'd also be charging them at least double your normal rate for that hour.

You will have to be upfront about this now, or it will happen again and again. No one likes confrontation, but sometimes it has to be done

[moggy]

Was it some kind of emergency? I am dumbfounded- they really turned up an hour early expecting you to have them in?! That is ridiculous. If you feel they are likely to do it again I'd be seriously doubting whether they are a family I can work with at all.
I would be having a meeting and confirming in writing that my opening hours are 8am-6pm and I can not receive any mindees before that time without prior agreement of 1 week (or whatever notice you want). I would also remind them that hours outside my opening hours, by prior agreement only, are charged at double fees (payable in advance, depending on the family!).
If I saw them at the door I would PHONE them (not rush to the door) and remind them of the above.
Stand firm and make sure this is clear or they could walk all over you.

[**Orchard CM**]

Thanks for your replies, just have to clarify one thing, I open at 7 but he was my earliest child booked in at 8. Sorry forgot to mention that!!! He was dropped off by his nanny who has him overnight but then works in a day nursery so dropped him off on the way to work. No I txt mum straight away and she said that she forgot to tell me? I'm worried about my epilepsy being affected, it scares me a lot. Obviously I'm registered and my healthy declaration is clear as I haven't had a seizure in years but because I know I am at an increased risk it has played on my mind this morning after they turned up early xxxxxxx

[chris goodyear]

I would be very cross! If any of my parents (and especially the early starters) turn up even 5 - 10 mins early I get annoyed. Would they turn up that early for school or nursery and be expected to be let in? what about doctor's appointments for example? I definitely would be speaking to them at pick up. I think some parents do innocently assume that because we work from home we are there for them whenever they need us with no forewarning. Some however think it's their right as they are paying! Only you will know which category your parents fall in! Good luck for later.

[**Orchard CM**]

Chris - would you refuse to let them in??!! A childminder I know will do this but I wouldn't be so brave!!! Xxxxxx

[LCM123]

If you advertise as starting from 7am, have they maybe thought that you were open from then everyday? I open at 7.30 but have a child booked in at 6.30 3/4 mornings a week with prior agreement. One morning they turned up on her day off while I was in the shower so I politely refused them and went back to rinse my hair haha. They're lucky I was even in as I'd been up the stables mucking out 15 mins earlier.
It may have been a genuine oversight, however I would make it clear to them now that you need to know when they are arriving due to other commitments x

[Kiddleywinks]

So if you opened at 6 you'd be happy to let them in?!

Your opening hours are irrelevant to parents that aren't using it to be honest, as far as this contract is concerned, you don't start work till 8am, and so, particularly as you were in bed anyway, you weren't open for business at 7am as noone was due.

Having read that it was actually a nanny that dropped off, had she been made aware that you aren't contracted till 8am by the parents, or had they ok'd her to drop off an hour early?

It's not about being brave, it's about sticking to contracted hours....

[**Orchard CM**]

Thankyou winks, this is why I turn to this forum as it gives so many different ways of looking at things.

From what it sounds like mum had said to the nanny to drop off at 7. I didn't know the nanny was even dropping him off to be fair!!

And no I would not be happy if someone turned up an hour before opening!!

Next time do you think I should txt mum? Saying I know XXX is outside but I'm not contracted to work until 8. If she was to pre arrange it then fine but she hasn't??!!!

This is a new parent and quite honestly every week she's tried to push the boundaries.. Not paying for hours contracted, not paying when she should, holidays etc

Complete ball ache tbh!!!

Xxxxxxx

[Maza]

Thankyou winks, this is why I turn to this forum as it gives so many different ways of looking at things.

From what it sounds like mum had said to the nanny to drop off at 7. I didn't know the nanny was even dropping him off to be fair!!

And no I would not be happy if someone turned up an hour before opening!!

Next time do you think I should txt mum? Saying I know XXX is outside but I'm not contracted to work until 8. If she was to pre arrange it then fine but she hasn't??!!!

This is a new parent and quite honestly every week she's tried to push the boundaries.. Not paying for hours contracted, not paying when she should, holidays etc

Complete ball ache tbh!!!

Xxxxxxx


By saying 'next time' it sounds to me like you have it in your mind that there probably will be a 'next time'. The first step is to tell yourself that there will not be a next time.

Leaving someone on your doorstep is not really the answer - proper communication is called for. Realistically, what do you think would happen if you tried to leave them on your doorstep? They would start to knock louder, maybe start to call through the letterbox, maybe try to walk round the or come to knock on a window. My neighbours would rightly start to get very cross, especially at that time in the morning. You would also be stressed inside listening to it all.

If the nanny has to be at work early then this problem is not going to go away - she can't be late for work. Therefore the current set up is just not going to work and the parents need to be told that. You don't have to be confrontational about it, just honest. Don't wait for 'next time' to deal with it. Speak to the parents at collection - but please don't just mention it, speak to them properly and get an answer - are they able to drop off at 8 in future or do they want to change the contracted hours?

Sorry you are having to deal with this. Put your health first. Let us know how you get on. x

[Kiddleywinks]

Thankyou winks, this is why I turn to this forum as it gives so many different ways of looking at things.

From what it sounds like mum had said to the nanny to drop off at 7. I didn't know the nanny was even dropping him off to be fair!!

And no I would not be happy if someone turned up an hour before opening!!

Next time do you think I should txt mum? Saying I know XXX is outside but I'm not contracted to work until 8. If she was to pre arrange it then fine but she hasn't??!!!

This is a new parent and quite honestly every week she's tried to push the boundaries.. Not paying for hours contracted, not paying when she should, holidays etc

Complete ball ache tbh!!!

Xxxxxxx


There shouldn't be a 'next time' :laughing:

I said 'confrontation' although I agree with Maza's advice, it shouldn't be 'confrontational' as such, but I can't think of another firm enough word to use instead lol
You might need a set of Wibble's hairy ones :laughing:


First thing you need to decide is whether you WANT to start work at 7am or not, if the answer is no, then there's no need to ask if they wish to change contracted hours.
When parent arrives to collect tonight saying something along these lines should make it clear enough....
Hi parent, I just need to clarify with you that x's contracted hours are not until 8am, unfortunately, I happened to be in bed when nanny and x arrived this morning, which meant I wasn't ready and hadn't even had a shower or done my house checks which I normally do before x arrives.
Can you please make it clear to nanny that I won't be accepting x before your contracted time in future, thanks, oh and btw, the additional fee of £x amount needs to be paid with your next payment.

Obviously, if you ARE prepared to accommodate a change in hours, you can add, if you would like to change contracted hours to 7am in future, then I'm happy to do that, and that'll be an additional £x per week/month

Whilst I agree leaving someone on the doorstep isn't the best answer, sometimes, it's the only way repeat offenders get the message.
I've refused care before now, not a pleasant experience, but I had to do it after trying every other way and getting nowhere fast.

You have to put your foot down if parents try to push things, otherwise they will continue to think it's ok :thumbsup:

[Maza]

Kiddleywinks, just so that you know, I wasn't saying anything in my post to contradict your advice. Hope it didn't read that way. x

[chris goodyear]

No OrchardCM I'm not that brave either and also it looks so unprofessional! I would speak to the parents at pick up and say something like 'was there a particular reason that mindee turned up 1 hour early this morning?' depending on the answer will determine how I go from there. If it happened more often I would ask mum if she wanted to change the hours on the contract to cover the extra time (and still pay even if not used) or make sure she dropped off at the correct time. I do know of a childminder years ago who refused to let the children in as mum hadn't brought back the renewed contract! I think she was in the wrong as the old contract should have still been in force whilst waiting for the new one to come back.

[Kiddleywinks]

Maza, no lovely, I didn't read it that way at all X

Chris, I have to disagree about it being unprofessional refusing on the door as sometimes, granted not always, but sometimes it's the only way for parents to understand we are not a drop in centre, or at their beck and call 24 hrs a day.

My doorstep refusal was due to non payment, and as per my policies, I'd warned multiple times that if it happened again, I would refuse care, parent wasn't 'getting it' until that day, and they never paid late again.

It's not something to do lightly, but needs must

[mumofone]

No OrchardCM I'm not that brave either and also it looks so unprofessional! I would speak to the parents at pick up and say something like 'was there a particular reason that mindee turned up 1 hour early this morning?' depending on the answer will determine how I go from there. If it happened more often I would ask mum if she wanted to change the hours on the contract to cover the extra time (and still pay even if not used) or make sure she dropped off at the correct time. I do know of a childminder years ago who refused to let the children in as mum hadn't brought back the renewed contract! I think she was in the wrong as the old contract should have still been in force whilst waiting for the new one to come back.

On this topic if you have a new customer who's not signed a contract then it would be illegal for child to start wouldn't it?

[FussyElmo]

On this topic if you have a new customer who's not signed a contract then it would be illegal for child to start wouldn't it?

No contracts are good practise but you don't have to have them.
Though I would never recommend you working without one

[**Orchard CM**]

Thanks everyone, I'm going to speak to mum today. I don't mind starting at 7 but I need notice. No way can I just jump out of bed!!! I'll be ill which is just not worth it. To put it in perspective... If the door bell goes for a parcel and I'm still asleep or dozing i ignore it, same with the phone... I'm not prepared to put my healthy at risk.

Talking about beck and call 24 hours a day... I hate this!!! I have limited myself to be contactable 6am-6pm mon-fri. That's it, nothing else as it was starting to ruin my weekends. I was out in town with my friends - eating and letting my hair down and at 10.40pm I had a phone call from a parent!!! I didn't answer it but how ridiculous on a Friday night???? They wouldn't do that to a nursery would they? Xx

[BallyH]

You need to decide if you want to start at 7 or 8 and stick to it. It's no use saying to mum 'oh I don't mind starting at 7 as it may happen again'. I've had situations like this before and late pickups. But I don't like being confrontational so I have used the 'gym' as an excuse that I won't be back till 8am and my sons p/t jobs as a reason to leave the house directly after 5.30pm. I've even been known to have a son sitting in my car and us drive off around the block to show a parent that I was serious. It worked. The alternative was for them to wait outside my back door till I returned from my 25 minute round trip - and I've done this also with another parent (once was enough). I need my life outside contracted hours.

[**Orchard CM**]

Thankyou Bally.

I spoke to her and told her we were in bed and weren't ready to take him and she just said sorry it was last minute etc

If it happens again I will txt and say I'm not contracted to look after him till 8 and I'm not ready to take him yet... She will have to wait in the car or whatever??

I think I need to be more strict. At first I just wanted to please everyone but now I'm wising up to stuff parents do! Xxxxxxx

[Kiddleywinks]

At first I just wanted to please everyone but now I'm wising up to stuff parents do! Xxxxxxx

It comes to us all eventually :laughing::laughing:

[**Orchard CM**]

Haha thank goodness it's sooner rather than later!!! Xx

[fluff1975]

I ask the parents to wait with their children in the living room until I'm ready to work. Its happened with a parent who asked for an early start I said no and they pushed it by arriving 15 mins early. She didn't do it again!

[FloraDora]

I am usually ready by 6.30 and then go for a walk, chat to DH, do a job until the first LO arrives, usually at 8. This does mean that parents know I am ready to go on child's arrival...which also means I am ready much earlier. This comes in handy when on occasions a child comes earlier if parents have an earlier meeting, on a course a distance etc...
One parent has taken advantage of this on more than one occasion so if they came early, to show that I was technically not open yet I would be upstairs bringing a few items down, in the garden filling water trays.....so not there to greet, chat, help with shoes coats etc... As busy setting up still. I didn't like it though as ultimately it is the child that routine has changed for and they are the most important. But it does work, the parent visually sees you are not quite ready to accept them...the message is subtly there....well it did for me.

[mumofone]

I also hate it when a child is late, it means the day is "on hold" until they arrive. I don't want to change any nappies in that time incase the door suddenly goes, I find it really frustrating!

[rickysmiths]

Chris - would you refuse to let them in??!! A childminder I know will do this but I wouldn't be so brave!!! Xxxxxx

I think the thing you need to change is having 'Opening Hours' You are not a Nursery and I have never had them.

I have a Contract with parents and they have their Contracted hours written in their Contract an if they want anything else they ask and wait for a reply they can never assume. They can never say 'but I know xxx is with you so it doesn't matter'. Their hours are their hours and no one else's hours are anything to do with them.

I would have been furious and I would have told the Nanny to go home and come back at 8am. Not your problem that she has to be at work it is her problem that her child didn't make it clear what your hours were or failed to ask you if an early drop off was ok.

Double Fee for the hour to be paid in cash at drop off tomorrow morning with a big bunch of flowers if they have anything about them!

[rickysmiths]

I ask the parents to wait with their children in the living room until I'm ready to work. Its happened with a parent who asked for an early start I said no and they pushed it by arriving 15 mins early. She didn't do it again!

You are kind mine would be waiting on the doorstep.

[rickysmiths]

Thankyou winks, this is why I turn to this forum as it gives so many different ways of looking at things.

From what it sounds like mum had said to the nanny to drop off at 7. I didn't know the nanny was even dropping him off to be fair!!

And no I would not be happy if someone turned up an hour before opening!!

Next time do you think I should txt mum? Saying I know XXX is outside but I'm not contracted to work until 8. If she was to pre arrange it then fine but she hasn't??!!!

This is a new parent and quite honestly every week she's tried to push the boundaries.. Not paying for hours contracted, not paying when she should, holidays etc

Complete ball ache tbh!!!

Xxxxxxx



Sounds like you need a Contract review meeting to me. Maybe she needs to change her hours a bit? Also needs to be reminded about payment and late payment fees.

Needs sorting asap before it gets out of hand. You set the rules. Be kind but very firm.

[Mouse]

I think the thing you need to change is having 'Opening Hours' You are not a Nursery and I have never had them.

I have a Contract with parents and they have their Contracted hours written in their Contract an if they want anything else they ask and wait for a reply they can never assume. They can never say 'but I know xxx is with you so it doesn't matter'. Their hours are their hours and no one else's hours are anything to do with them.


I agree completely. I have a parent contracted for an 8am start. Another arrives at 7.30am. The 8am mum started arriving early, obviously thinking it was OK because the other child was already there. I spoke to her about it and offered a change of contracted hours, but she didn't want that, so now she sits outside in the car from about 7.45 and doesn't come to the door until 8. Often the 7.30 starter is late so they walk past the other mum & child still sitting in their car :p