Child attending pre school

[redtiger21]

Hi, I have a LO who attends one day a week. From Jan she will be starting at a pre school nursery setting 3hrs a day, so on my day I will be taking and collecting her. I don't charge whilst children are at nursery as I'm happy enough for the parents to fully access their free funded hours (I don't do 3/4yr funding). However, I also want to make it clear in as nice a way as possible that I'm not the person that the nursery should call if the child is ill or (heaven forbid) has an emergency- if it's the latter there's nothing I can do, because I'm a walking childminder so can't get them to hospital, and if it's the former then they need to go home as I don't take ill or infectious children. Does anyone else have this rule? I feel a bit bad because mum and dad don't actually work in our town so I'm the closest person, but if their child is so unwell that they need to be collected, then firstly I'd feel bad dragging them out to walk back to my house, and secondly I have a duty to protect the other children in my setting from the spread of infection- surely it's not unacceptable to expect the nursery to make LO comfortable in their quiet area until parents can collect? I'd appreciate hearing what others think x

[Simona]

Hi, I have a LO who attends one day a week. From Jan she will be starting at a pre school nursery setting 3hrs a day, so on my day I will be taking and collecting her. I don't charge whilst children are at nursery as I'm happy enough for the parents to fully access their free funded hours (I don't do 3/4yr funding). However, I also want to make it clear in as nice a way as possible that I'm not the person that the nursery should call if the child is ill or (heaven forbid) has an emergency- if it's the latter there's nothing I can do, because I'm a walking childminder so can't get them to hospital, and if it's the former then they need to go home as I don't take ill or infectious children. Does anyone else have this rule? I feel a bit bad because mum and dad don't actually work in our town so I'm the closest person, but if their child is so unwell that they need to be collected, then firstly I'd feel bad dragging them out to walk back to my house, and secondly I have a duty to protect the other children in my setting from the spread of infection- surely it's not unacceptable to expect the nursery to make LO comfortable in their quiet area until parents can collect? I'd appreciate hearing what others think x

It will depend on what you have agreed in your contract?
if you are the person on 'stand-by' in case of an accident or other unforeseen circumstances then you need to keep that space open with financial implications.
Apart from you the preschool should have an alternative person/s they can contact in these cases.

Also it depends if the child is contracted to be with you 'full time' when the preschool closes for their holidays....again there are financial implications to be considered and agreed.

[redtiger21]

It will depend on what you have agreed in your contract?
if you are the person on 'stand-by' in case of an accident or other unforeseen circumstances then you need to keep that space open with financial implications.
Apart from you the preschool should have an alternative person/s they can contact in these cases.

Also it depends if the child is contracted to be with you 'full time' when the preschool closes for their holidays....again there are financial implications to be considered and agreed.

It's not currently stipulated in the contract, because in the current contract the child doesn't attend nursery, she's with me all day- she will begin nursery in January- I will take and collect her during term time, and she will be with me all day during the holidays. I won't be charging whilst she's at nursery. My query is whether it's acceptable to stipulate that it needs to be the parents who collect in the case of illness or emergency x

[BallyH]

As you have said it's not in their contract so next time you see the parents mention it then as a 'oh by the way.....', or you could ask who they have put as their emergency contact numbers at preschool then you may not need to say anything if you aren't one of them. We all live and learn constantly in this business and next time you will know to say 'no' to collection of ill children at preschool if the occassion arises. I refuse to be an emergency contact if the parents aren't paying for the space. I think it's acceptable. You could say you'll be over your numbers as the space is going to be taken by a 'term time only child'.

[moggy]

So, you are adjusting contracts to suit the new situation (of child now going to nursery)?
There is no problem in stipulating that when child is at nursery you are not the emergency contact- as long as it is clear and all agree, it is fine.
You can fill that child's space in nursery hours if you want to too.
BUT make sure you have thought through all the possibilities- who will have the child if... this nursery has an inset day (some close for staff training), if there is heavy snow and you can not get to the nursery, if the nursery suddenly needs to close mid-session due to a gas/water leak or their boiler breaking down... etc etc As long as it is clear and agreed you can put anything in your contact as long as it is 'reasoinable' and not being the emergency contact is reasonable.

[redtiger21]

So, you are adjusting contracts to suit the new situation (of child now going to nursery)?
There is no problem in stipulating that when child is at nursery you are not the emergency contact- as long as it is clear and all agree, it is fine.
You can fill that child's space in nursery hours if you want to too.
BUT make sure you have thought through all the possibilities- who will have the child if... this nursery has an inset day (some close for staff training), if there is heavy snow and you can not get to the nursery, if the nursery suddenly needs to close mid-session due to a gas/water leak or their boiler breaking down... etc etc As long as it is clear and agreed you can put anything in your contact as long as it is 'reasoinable' and not being the emergency contact is reasonable.

Yes we'll be signing a new contract to incorporate the change in her hours with me. I'm more than happy to have the child when the school is closed, be it expected or unexpected, it's only the illness and emergency situations that I would not want to be the contact for, I just wanted to check really that that's not too hard-hearted and unreasonable of me. I know we can technically put whatever we want in the contract, but I still want to be decent about it. Thanks :) xx

[Mouse]

Yes we'll be signing a new contract to incorporate the change in her hours with me. I'm more than happy to have the child when the school is closed, be it expected or unexpected, it's only the illness and emergency situations that I would not want to be the contact for, I just wanted to check really that that's not too hard-hearted and unreasonable of me. I know we can technically put whatever we want in the contract, but I still want to be decent about it. Thanks :) xx

I don't think it's unreasonable at all. I always made it clear that I wasn't an emergency contact, even if I was being paid when the child was at nursery. I made it clear that parents had to be the ones who were contacted. There was once a situation where the nursery had to close early due to a burst pipe. They phoned parents, who phone me and asked if I would mind going to nursery early. I was at a toddler group close by and the child wasn't ill, so I was happy to go then. If the child had been ill I know the parents wouldn't even have asked, but I had no problem with them asking for that reason.

As well as making it clear to parents, you also need to tell the pre-school you are not the emergency contact. I've had them phoning me before and expecting me to go and collect a sick child, even when parents hadn't named me on the form. The other sneaky thing they do is keep an ill child until it's home time, then say you'll have to take them as they're closing and it's too late to contact parents. You're stuck then as you have to collect the child and contact parents yourself.

You do feel sorry for the child, but at the end of the day, you have to consider the health of everyone in your care.

[redtiger21]

I don't think it's unreasonable at all. I always made it clear that I wasn't an emergency contact, even if I was being paid when the child was at nursery. I made it clear that parents had to be the ones who were contacted. There was once a situation where the nursery had to close early due to a burst pipe. They phoned parents, who phone me and asked if I would mind going to nursery early. I was at a toddler group close by and the child wasn't ill, so I was happy to go then. If the child had been ill I know the parents wouldn't even have asked, but I had no problem with them asking for that reason.

As well as making it clear to parents, you also need to tell the pre-school you are not the emergency contact. I've had them phoning me before and expecting me to go and collect a sick child, even when parents hadn't named me on the form. The other sneaky thing they do is keep an ill child until it's home time, then say you'll have to take them as they're closing and it's too late to contact parents. You're stuck then as you have to collect the child and contact parents yourself.

You do feel sorry for the child, but at the end of the day, you have to consider the health of everyone in your care.

Thanks Mouse :)

[Simona]

It's not currently stipulated in the contract, because in the current contract the child doesn't attend nursery, she's with me all day- she will begin nursery in January- I will take and collect her during term time, and she will be with me all day during the holidays. I won't be charging whilst she's at nursery. My query is whether it's acceptable to stipulate that it needs to be the parents who collect in the case of illness or emergency x

Thank you for your reply
I think I did understand your question very well as possibly most cms will have had that issue to deal with at some point
When I suggested putting this matter in your contract I didn't mean when any of your children start preschool but for it to be there stipulated well before any parent starts with you so they know what to expect when the time comes to share care with another provider.

I would guess you have an 'off the shelf' contract as none of them have this covered in their Terms and Conditions.
You also don't charge while the child is at preschool so in reality you could fill those 3 hours?
some cms charge a retainer so they are technically on 'stand-by' for emergencies.

If a child is ill at preschool and they have to exclude ...you need to ask yourself if that child should be with you or be sent home? so the first call would be to the parents which you should have clearly stated in your contract....same for when children are ill at school....the school should call the parents first.

if the preschool has to record an accident ...or even take the child to hospital...why would you be the one they contact? or even get involved by taking to hospital? all you would need is to be informed.


This is something all cms will have to reflect on and update as with the 30 hours it will be a recurring theme when the education and care will be shared

As Mouse says all can be clear if all parties have agreed procedures in place..

Good luck!

[AliceK]

I make it clear that I am not an emergency contact because if a child is too ill to stay at nursery then they are too ill to stay with me and I can't risk infecting the other children and myself. No-one has had a problem with it so far. I will happily cover inset days / emergency closure days but not illness.

xx

[redtiger21]

Thank you for your reply
I think I did understand your question very well as possibly most cms will have had that issue to deal with at some point
When I suggested putting this matter in your contract I didn't mean when any of your children start preschool but for it to be there stipulated well before any parent starts with you so they know what to expect when the time comes to share care with another provider.

I would guess you have an 'off the shelf' contract as none of them have this covered in their Terms and Conditions.
You also don't charge while the child is at preschool so in reality you could fill those 3 hours?
some cms charge a retainer so they are technically on 'stand-by' for emergencies.

If a child is ill at preschool and they have to exclude ...you need to ask yourself if that child should be with you or be sent home? so the first call would be to the parents which you should have clearly stated in your contract....same for when children are ill at school....the school should call the parents first.

if the preschool has to record an accident ...or even take the child to hospital...why would you be the one they contact? or even get involved by taking to hospital? all you would need is to be informed.

This is something all cms will have to reflect on and update as with the 30 hours it will be a recurring theme when the education and care will be shared

As Mouse says all can be clear if all parties have agreed procedures in place..

Good luck!

Hi, thanks Simona, I completely understand what you mean. I suppose I was just looking for what other childminders actually do themselves, perhaps I didn't phrase my question as well as I could. You're absolutely right on all of the contractual elements, and on all of the things I need to consider though, so many thanks for taking the time to reply. I'm going to rewrite my policy this evening!

[Simona]

Hi, thanks Simona, I completely understand what you mean. I suppose I was just looking for what other childminders actually do themselves, perhaps I didn't phrase my question as well as I could. You're absolutely right on all of the contractual elements, and on all of the things I need to consider though, so many thanks for taking the time to reply. I'm going to rewrite my policy this evening!

No problem...good to hear you will be reviewing your policy! you will stop being on the 'alert' all the time!
Make sure to share with the preschool...you know 'info sharing' and all that jazz :cool: ...and a good dollop of CPPD too!