View Full Version : Teaching British values...
sarah707
11-08-2014, 04:59 PM
I have been having some thoughts about the latest Govt directive for early years providers to teach children 'fundamental British values' ...
I hope you find them interesting and thought provoking :D
Sarah's Blog: Teaching children British values (http://knutsfordchildminding.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/teaching-children-british-values.html)
mum67
11-08-2014, 05:19 PM
Interesting read, Floradora was discussing this on another thread with myself and Simona the other day.
Oops I only scored 6 so not very British at all apparently, I do have Irish descent in me so I shall use that as my excuse:)
Will they stop bringing something new in that Ofsted pick up on I'll never catch up.
Kiddleywinks
11-08-2014, 05:27 PM
ooo, I scored 9 out of 10, but I don't do sport so that's my excuse lol
CookieCutter
11-08-2014, 05:27 PM
I don't see why these are 'British values', I think they're good values which are taught to the children of good people from all over the world.
I scored 6/10- it's a good thing I passed the life in the UK test a few years ago, I wouldn't have passed it today!
AliceK
11-08-2014, 05:34 PM
Phew, I was worried, I only scored 7 :blush:
Thanks Sarah for the blog, certainly helpful :thumbsup:
xxx
mum67
11-08-2014, 05:50 PM
I don't see why these are 'British values', I think they're good values which are taught to the children of good people from all over the world.
I scored 6/10- it's a good thing I passed the life in the UK test a few years ago, I wouldn't have passed it today!
This is exactly what Floradora was saying the other day.
moggy
11-08-2014, 06:02 PM
The consultation link in your Blog seems to take me to something about School Finance? (yes, I am the only CM in the UK who actually reads these things) Thanks.
I'm sure we all can think of some British people who have values that 'stink', for want of a better word!
mum67
11-08-2014, 06:30 PM
I didn't press on the link I meant the blog was an interesting read. I Daren't tap on any other links to read yet because I still have so much from Simona, Sarah and all the others which I have downloaded previously, my poor children are starting to feel neglected.
Simona
11-08-2014, 06:35 PM
The consultation link in your Blog seems to take me to something about School Finance? (yes, I am the only CM in the UK who actually reads these things) Thanks.
That I understand Nicky Morgan has said we will be consulted in the near future on teaching values and also the EYFS will be tweaked to reflect this
The link is about school finance but I think this is a separate consultation.....there is also one on the Pupil Premium and 2 year old funding currently open
The announcement about British values was made by Morgan around the 8 August so that consultation is about something else as it is dated 8 August too...maybe a bit too quick to get a consultation out so soon? but worth looking at
I think many people agree with Cookie Cutter...those are values that have no boundaries and already taught in Understanding the World 'People and Communities' with links to CL and PSED
I am sure no one disagrees with teaching respect and so forth but why threaten providers to remove funding is puzzling...and where is the evidence that children could be radicalised in EY settings?
The quiz in The Guardian is more about knowledge that values in my view but I am sure some may not agree
With Gove gone it has made no difference to style and approach in the DfE...nor their knowledge of EYFS or EY teaching?
Has anyone heard from the new Childcare minister?
sarah707
11-08-2014, 08:38 PM
Moggy - I got the consultation link from here - Nurseries must teach children 'British Values' or lose their funding | Nursery World (http://www.nurseryworld.co.uk/nursery-world/news/1145873/nurseries-teach-children-british-values-lose-funding)
This is the one that NW give - https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/341923/Consultation_Document_-_School_and_Early_Years_Finance__England__Regulati ons_2014.pdf
xx
sarah707
11-08-2014, 08:41 PM
The 2 links at the bottom - the quiz and the blog - were a bit of light relief!
Sorry if they confused the issue :/
Simona
11-08-2014, 08:49 PM
Moggy - I got the consultation link from here - Nurseries must teach children 'British Values' or lose their funding | Nursery World (http://www.nurseryworld.co.uk/nursery-world/news/1145873/nurseries-teach-children-british-values-lose-funding)
This is the one that NW give - https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/341923/Consultation_Document_-_School_and_Early_Years_Finance__England__Regulati ons_2014.pdf
xx
Sarah...I think the 2 consultations are linked...thanks for posting the link as it will remind us to respond
The one about the Pupil Premium and 2 year old funding does say the govt will consult on finances...hence the EY and School Finances consultation which they launched last week and closes in October
It may be useful for CMs to read the EYPP consultation...the premium is set at ...53 pence per hour per child...and it has no conditions on how it is spent
The amount paid is the same nationally and added to the Free Entitlement
If cms wish to respond the deadline is 22 August
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/323495/EY_Funding_ConDoc_-Branded_final_with_foreword.pdf
FussyElmo
11-08-2014, 08:49 PM
I have been having some thoughts about the latest Govt directive for early years providers to teach children 'fundamental British values' ...
I hope you find them interesting and thought provoking :D
Sarah's Blog: Teaching children British values (http://knutsfordchildminding.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/teaching-children-british-values.html)
Well all Im saying is that its not British to boast of your score :laughing::laughing:
The children who come to my house will be ok - well as long as I can teach them in the true way of the force :laughing::laughing:
Daisy1956
11-08-2014, 09:02 PM
I know it's not very British but, I scored 9 out of 10. :clapping:
loocyloo
11-08-2014, 09:02 PM
I'm not going to boast either! ;) :laughing:
very interesting, thank you Sarah. :D
just thought ...
... does that mean we'd better stop eating pasta ? and curry ? and pizza ? and noodles ? and chilli ? and sushi ? !!!!
Simona
12-08-2014, 07:23 AM
This British value was posted on Twitter....priceless!!!
Government insists on knotted hankie on head for nursery sand & water play #BritishValues
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Buq0Et5IEAE3uzR.jpg:large
FloraDora
12-08-2014, 09:30 AM
That has made me smile Simona.
Late breakfast here, toast and home made jam( from our french neighbours) is that being 'very British' since we are in France- I expect it is because I have called it jam!
I am as British as you could get- my ' culture' has roots in Scotland and Ireland and I was the only member of my family born in England ....but I am going to boast because I am currently living in France that I scored 100% - a bit of a dodgy moment on the jury service question though!
Having lots of lovely discussions with French friends on the 'British' theme. They have all laughed and are intrigued at the difference it will make in education...and if it is different to France, its a bit difficult and I haven't got good enough french language to discuss the intolerance in what children can wear to school that might represent their faith in France.
Glad to hear Bertha has left Britain - see, very British...talking about the weather!
Simona
12-08-2014, 09:39 AM
That has made me smile Simona.
Late breakfast here, toast and home made jam( from our french neighbours) is that being 'very British' since we are in France- I expect it is because I have called it jam!
I am as British as you could get- my ' culture' has roots in Scotland and Ireland and I was the only member of my family born in England ....but I am going to boast because I am currently living in France that I scored 100% - a bit of a dodgy moment on the jury service question though!
Having lots of lovely discussions with French friends on the 'British' theme. They have all laughed and are intrigued at the difference it will make in education...and if it is different to France, its a bit difficult and I haven't got good enough french language to discuss the intolerance in what children can wear to school that might represent their faith in France.
Glad to hear Bertha has left Britain - see, very British...talking about the weather!
I thought it might...we need one on socks and sandal wearing!!!
I too have had many discussions with people not involved in EY...they all seem of the same view...the values cross borders and are not just British and we uphold them wherever we are or whichever society we choose to settle in....or so I hope
I will keep my survey result for Ofsted as evidence that...despite not being British...I do agree with those values...now back to my espresso shot and Panini!!!
rickysmiths
12-08-2014, 09:45 AM
This British value was posted on Twitter....priceless!!!
Government insists on knotted hankie on head for nursery sand & water play #BritishValues
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Buq0Et5IEAE3uzR.jpg:large
Gosh I remember my grandpas doing that when we went to the Beach!!
Glitter
12-08-2014, 12:07 PM
I found your blog very interesting. If we really teaching British values shouldn't these be included:
How to make the perfect cup of tea.
How to queue properly.
How to tut at people who do not queue properly.
How to never complain about bad service/food when we are out.
Saying sorry- especially when it is not your fault.
Talking about the weather.
The art of cooking the perfect Sunday lunch.
sing-low
12-08-2014, 07:47 PM
I've been thinking about this a lot over the past few days. Britishness seems to be one of those things that is hard to define but you know it when you see it. Glitter, your suggestions are spot on! But I also think that it is easier to see it through the eyes of a child. For example, many traditional British songs are learnt in childhood. ( the hokey kokey; she'll be coming round the mountain; daisy, daisy). There's a whole wealth of songs and rhymes (many of them with an a interesting and historical backstory). And then there's the language. English is a hugely rich language with so many weird and wonderful words and phrases.
How Mrs O will interpret this new emphasis on 'British values', remains to be seen. As many others have said, the values themselves are not inherently British. But I am pleased in a way that there is now a focus on Britishness, as I have worried that with all the multi-cultural things we do with the children, there's a danger of missing out on our own culture. And possibly confusing children.
sarah707
13-08-2014, 06:25 AM
Some excellent suggestions to add to our planning list thank you guys! :clapping:
I do worry how individual Ofsted inspectors will translate it ... we have a member on the Facebook group who was told by an inspector that her house was 'too British' a while ago and she needed more diversification for the children ... will that type of comment be considered appropriate in the future?? ... not that I think for one moment it was appropriate when it was made!! :panic:
Keep the ideas coming ...
mama2three
13-08-2014, 06:47 AM
The worrying part for me is not 'teaching' anything without scientific or historical fact.
I understand that this is a knee jerk reaction due to the Brmingham schools , but
I had a wonderful Noahs Ark mini theme going on a while ago - one lo goes to church every week an had been telling us about it , another is animal mad! We had a gorgeous display , we had fun , the children learned lots about lots - every development area - it was one of the favourit things Ive done for a while. Is there any scientific fact or historical fact ? No. Id need to teach it as 'just a story' - but it isn't to millions of ' British' 'Christians' , its a lot more than that. if I cant 'teach' the children about Noahs Ark for example , or Holi , or any of the other wonderful world festivals - then how is that promoting British values? Surely the wonderfully diverse society we live in IS British!
Simona
13-08-2014, 08:24 AM
Some excellent suggestions to add to our planning list thank you guys! :clapping:
I do worry how individual Ofsted inspectors will translate it ... we have a member on the Facebook group who was told by an inspector that her house was 'too British' a while ago and she needed more diversification for the children ... will that type of comment be considered appropriate in the future?? ... not that I think for one moment it was appropriate when it was made!! :panic:
Keep the ideas coming ...
Well that will be fun...planning British values!!!!!!!!!!!...off to add another column to my planning sheet!
and decorating our settings so they reflect other cultures...but that's it Sarah...maybe it is a question of how the inspectors view our settings and their experience of cultures?
Great ideas I agree ...are we not though mentioning things that are really 'cultural'?
for instance cooking the perfect Sunday roast...queueing....very British I know but often forgotten when the British are abroad??? ;)
Calling preserve jam...or teaching please and thank you ...saying sorry or pardon...which I think is a question of manners rather than values and apply in most cultures
Never complain...yes British people are reluctant to do so...they do so too politely I think!
But these are part of the culture as much as some Europeans kiss each other on both cheeks when they greet or the French take to the street to demonstrate
There a difference I think.... Gove mentioned liberty ...democracy and respect following the Trojan Horse affair
so how do we evidence liberty and democracy in our practice?
I read that the govt has been asked to define British values as they are blurred...personally I don't think so
I believe British culture has well defined customs as have others but I wait to see how British values will be translated in the EYFS or the inspection framework....we are in for a very long period of individual interpretations when it comes to inspections!
Off to think if I can redecorate each room in my setting to reflect other cultures...should I put 'rest time' for children as 'siesta' in my planning?
Great discussion!
Jiorjiina
16-08-2014, 11:30 AM
For example, many traditional British songs are learnt in childhood. ( the hokey kokey; she'll be coming round the mountain; daisy, daisy). There's a whole wealth of songs and rhymes (many of them with an a interesting and historical backstory). And then there's the language. English is a hugely rich language with so many weird and wonderful words and phrases.
Sorry to put a spanner in the works, but "She'll be coming round the mountain" is actually a traditional American song. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/She'll_Be_Coming_'Round_the_Mountain)
Perhaps in line with other government educational strategies we should remove it and other American classics, and make sure we only focus on British children's classics?
sing-low
16-08-2014, 04:30 PM
Sorry to put a spanner in the works, but "She'll be coming round the mountain" is actually a traditional American song. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/She'll_Be_Coming_'Round_the_Mountain) Perhaps in line with other government educational strategies we should remove it and other American classics, and make sure we only focus on British children's classics?
Oops, sorry. In my defense, I spent three years of my childhood in America.
Rachel6
16-08-2014, 07:49 PM
Wow I got 8/10 & that's after doing a whole day on a safeguarding course :-)
It might be easier/clearer if we think about which values are NOT 'British'...
lizduncan72
16-08-2014, 08:23 PM
10 out of 10!! Not bad considering I guessed at least three of them lol
lucy barningham
17-08-2014, 11:43 AM
8 out of 10. Not to bad. Above average.
bunyip
18-08-2014, 07:15 AM
It might be easier/clearer if we think about which values are NOT 'British'...
It might be clearer if they just put a Dept for Education cover on the latest Tory Party manifesto having taken a big crayon and crossed out the uncomfortable bits about scr3w1ng the poor and bombing the civilian populace of anywhere with an oil reserve. :mad:
It might be clearer if they just put a Dept for Education cover on the latest Tory Party manifesto having taken a big crayon and crossed out the uncomfortable bits about scr3w1ng the poor and bombing the civilian populace of anywhere with an oil reserve. :mad:
Exactly. Very British to 'beat about the bush' and not say exactly what they mean in fear of offending someone.
bunyip
18-08-2014, 09:29 AM
Exactly. Very British to 'beat about the bush' and not say exactly what they mean in fear of offending someone.
Yup.
Some Tory think-tank has come up with this one as a vote-winner. It's a jolly good sound-bite (like the way Cameron keeps throwing the phrase "hard-working families" into every interview) but impossible to pin down.
One could have a mass-debate (fnarr, fnarr) over whether such a thing as national values exists (except maybe within mid-European dicatatorships of the 1930's-1940's.) If they do, then they are very changeable.
Within my lifetime, "British values" includes hanging up signs saying "No dogs, no Irish, no blacks" in the windows of pubs and rented houses. :mad: The British Empire was built on plundering the equatorial countries for natural resources and slavery. :(
Anyone remember "Victorian family values"? The only difference being this plays on some un-historic notion of British-ness and patriotism, and so is a direct appeal to all the neo-fascists they've lost to the UK Intolerence Party in the last couple of years. I suspect and hope this one may go the same way.
Simona
18-08-2014, 09:35 AM
Latest news on teaching British values ...creationism and another consultation looming on the horizon
Teaching nursery children British values is 'dangerous' and implies we are 'morally superior' (http://www.daynurseries.co.uk/news/article.cfm/id/1564819/teaching-nursery-children-british-values-dangerous#.U_HHHpIHBS0.twitter)
bunyip
18-08-2014, 03:23 PM
Latest news on teaching British values ...creationism and another consultation looming on the horizon
Teaching nursery children British values is 'dangerous' and implies we are 'morally superior' (http://www.daynurseries.co.uk/news/article.cfm/id/1564819/teaching-nursery-children-british-values-dangerous#.U_HHHpIHBS0.twitter)
Do I class as an "extremist nursery" within the terms of reference of that article?
The lo's cannot yet strip down and reassemble an AK47 in the dark, but they're getting there.
I don't suppose reclassifying the "People Who Help Us" theme as "Agents of State Oppression" did us any favours. :rolleyes:
Honestly, you can see the effort on Cameron's face as he struggles not to let the phrase 'Master Race' slip from his lips. :panic:
WibbleWobble
18-08-2014, 06:36 PM
Yup. Some Tory think-tank has come up with this one as a vote-winner. It's a jolly good sound-bite (like the way Cameron keeps throwing the phrase "hard-working families" into every interview) but impossible to pin down. One could have a mass-debate (fnarr, fnarr) over whether such a thing as national values exists (except maybe within mid-European dicatatorships of the 1930's-1940's.) If they do, then they are very changeable. Within my lifetime, "British values" includes hanging up signs saying "No dogs, no Irish, no blacks" in the windows of pubs and rented houses. :mad: The British Empire was built on plundering the equatorial countries for natural resources and slavery. :( Anyone remember "Victorian family values"? The only difference being this plays on some un-historic notion of British-ness and patriotism, and so is a direct appeal to all the neo-fascists they've lost to the UK Intolerence Party in the last couple of years. I suspect and hope this one may go the same way.
I remember ' family values' ... Was a John Major govt initiative.... And now we know he was getting jiggy with Edwina salmonella in eggs Curry!
It's just a knee jerk reaction, a back of a fag packet down the boozer idea... Like most of the rubbish which comes out of govts!
Getting off my soap box now
Wibble x
wobbling my way through life....
Simona
19-08-2014, 08:22 AM
I remember ' family values' ... Was a John Major govt initiative.... And now we know he was getting jiggy with Edwina salmonella in eggs Curry!
It's just a knee jerk reaction, a back of a fag packet down the boozer idea... Like most of the rubbish which comes out of govts!
Getting off my soap box now
Wibble x
wobbling my way through life....
A very good reminder and as usual the whole thing turns to be political...yesterday the PM was on TV talking about how much he is behind families etc etc etc
Sorry this is a slight deviation from the topic ...but pertinent
I think that most people do not mind been engaged in this discussion on what we should or not...teach as values....with the very politicians who...while imposing their vision on us ...do the opposite themselves...and we could mention a few of them but let them remain unnamed
This is a prime example
Boris fails the character test for social conservatives (http://conservativewoman.co.uk/laura-perrins-swivel-eyed-loons-unite-boris-fails-character-test-social-conservatives/)
I suppose we will have to wait and see what questions are asked in the consultation when it is open and whether those who consult actually listen to us and engage positively but it looks like it is business as usual at the DfE