Are any childminders setting up their own agencies?

[ClareMaher]

As I understand it anyone can set up agency and although it's not currently compulsory to join one I believe that we will be pushed and pushed to eventually join one as it will become harder and harder to remain independent.

I was talking to a family friend recently who said her childminder was thinking of starting her own agency with others in her area. They wouldn't charge CMs to join but would help organise group training and help parents find vacancies, again not charging them. They plan to let everything else remain the same so CMs still look after all their own paperwork, finances, running of their business etc. they plan for the to stop any other agency coming in to their area to take over.

What are people's thoughts on this? The not having an individual inspection thing would still be problematic for most CMs I think and what happens if you can't get many other CMs on board.

I became registered in October last year And have no intention of joining an agency but I also don't want to be forced out of a job I enjoy as I've only been doing it 6 months and I'm a long way off retiring lol!

[FussyElmo]

Who would be responsible when ofsted came to inspect. I wouldn't like to take the responsibility of making sure that all the cms got a good grade :-9

[miffy]

If they don't charge childminders to join and they don't charge parents either then who is going to pay the agencies ofsted registration fee?

Miffy xx

[SYLVIA]

my thoughts exactly. Think a group that called itself an agency might run into a few problems. Don't think I'd want to do that personally

[ClareMaher]

I don't know any more as i don't live near my friend. I'm not sure how serious they are about doing it.

Was worried to see anyone could set up an agency though. How on earth does that work? Someone coming in telling you what to do that's not even worked in childcare before?! Bit worrying.

[AdeleMarie88]

Was worried to see anyone could set up an agency though. How on earth does that work? Someone coming in telling you what to do that's not even worked in childcare before?! Bit worrying.

It's not much different to private day nurseries in that respect, with an owner and then managers...

I wouldn't mind looking into co-running an agency, it's better to be in charge of your own destiny, which us exactly why I came into CM in the first place (as we all did I'm sure)...interesting idea, not sure how it would work precisely... X

[Mouse]

I don't know any more as i don't live near my friend. I'm not sure how serious they are about doing it.

Was worried to see anyone could set up an agency though. How on earth does that work? Someone coming in telling you what to do that's not even worked in childcare before?! Bit worrying.

But if that was the case you wouldn't join the agency. Don't forget, just because an agency is there it doesn't mean you have to join it.

[AdeleMarie88]

But if that was the case you wouldn't join the agency. Don't forget, just because an agency is there it doesn't mean you have to join it.

I think people are sort of panic brainstorming their way out of Truss' schemes. Understandable. There is lots of talk in my area. I keep telling myself not to worry yet, as you say, you don't have to join! Xx

[Simona]

As I understand it anyone can set up agency and although it's not currently compulsory to join one I believe that we will be pushed and pushed to eventually join one as it will become harder and harder to remain independent.

I was talking to a family friend recently who said her childminder was thinking of starting her own agency with others in her area. They wouldn't charge CMs to join but would help organise group training and help parents find vacancies, again not charging them. They plan to let everything else remain the same so CMs still look after all their own paperwork, finances, running of their business etc. they plan for the to stop any other agency coming in to their area to take over.

What are people's thoughts on this? The not having an individual inspection thing would still be problematic for most CMs I think and what happens if you can't get many other CMs on board.

I became registered in October last year And have no intention of joining an agency but I also don't want to be forced out of a job I enjoy as I've only been doing it 6 months and I'm a long way off retiring lol!

Anyone who wants to set up an agency has to follow prescribed rules...an agency cannot just be set up without looking at the requirements, what needs to be in place an d communication/application with Ofsted

These are the guidelines issued for the C&F Bill ...which has now become an ACT as agencies are the law
http://media.education.gov.uk/assets/files/pdf/c/childminder%20agencies%20statement%20of%20policy%2 0intention%20clause%2073_001.pdf

There is also another document that states clearly what agencies must provide in their package...I will post the link when I find it

It may also be useful to read the trials evaluation when it comes out....which I believe is in May following the end of the trials in March and a full month of evaluation in April by an independent body

[Kiddleywinks]

It may also be useful to read the trials evaluation when it comes out....which I believe is in May following the end of the trials in March and a full month of evaluation in April by an independent body

How independent is the independent body? :rolleyes:

[Simona]

How independent is the independent body? :rolleyes:

No one knows who the independent body is ...let alone independent of whom!!!
We can only hope for news on this...as the 4 associations are meeting Truss on the 25 March it may be a good question to ask then...assuming she keeps her date?

[ClareMaher]

Thanks for the links Simona.

Although I don't want to join an agency if it becomes law I would certainly either join one that is run by childminders or set one up myself if there wasn't one in my area as I certainly don't want someone who doesn't know anything about childminding telling me how to do my job.

[Ripeberry]

And another thought. Would they not 'Cherry Pick' the best CMs. Agencies might work for people who are struggling by themselves. But for established CMs with a good reputation, the biggest hurdle we have is the Ofsted fee. It could be hundreds! :(

[Becci26]

And another thought. Would they not 'Cherry Pick' the best CMs. Agencies might work for people who are struggling by themselves. But for established CMs with a good reputation, the biggest hurdle we have is the Ofsted fee. It could be hundreds! :(

I am waiting with baited breath to find out how much the Ofsted fees are, it will most likely make or break my decision to continue childminding unfortunately :(

[AdeleMarie88]

I am waiting with baited breath to find out how much the Ofsted fees are, it will most likely make or break my decision to continue childminding unfortunately :(

I fully agree with this. This will most likely decide for me too, i fear that that is how they will eventually break Everyone into joining agencies, by making it such a financial strain to not be in one! X

[Becci26]

I fully agree with this. This will most likely decide for me too, i fear that that is how they will eventually break Everyone into joining agencies, by making it such a financial strain to not be in one! X

Unfortunately I completely agree :(

I wish they would hurry up and give us some firm information,

I only work part time atm and not looking to increase my hours any time soon, financially it's a squeeze as it is without the increase in fees for inspections!

[AdeleMarie88]

I'm trying to go along with the idea, "will cross that bridge when we come to it", no point worrying until we get definite agencies popping up, and that could take some time.

For me the frustration is, I came into this business so I could have that autonomy and control over my own earnings, things are never that straight forward are they!! Don't know why Truss can't just leave us be!

X

[Mouse]

I am waiting with baited breath to find out how much the Ofsted fees are, it will most likely make or break my decision to continue childminding unfortunately :(

I've held off implementing a fee increase until we know what the fees are.

When you break it down, it isn't too daunting. One fee mentioned is £900, per inspection. If that was every 3 years, that's £300 a year. I work 48 weeks a year, so that's £6.25 a week. If I have 6 children on my books that's only just over £1 each child per week. Any fee increase I make will be at least £1 per child, per day, so I have more than covered the Ofsted fee :thumbsup:

[Simona]

I'm trying to go along with the idea, "will cross that bridge when we come to it", no point worrying until we get definite agencies popping up, and that could take some time.

For me the frustration is, I came into this business so I could have that autonomy and control over my own earnings, things are never that straight forward are they!! Don't know why Truss can't just leave us be!

X

Because Truss introduced the agency idea but her biggest backer is....Ofsted of course
Can we rewind back to July 2012 when HMCI said cms are too expensive to register and inspect?

[dawn100]

You make a very good point, also I can't see how ofsted can charge us more than a pre-school or a nursery to register currently nurseries and preschools vary between £35, £50 and the most expensive £220 per year it all depends on hours and number of weeks open. Even paying £220 a year to Ofsted I could cover that in a 5p per hour fee increase so in that case I think I would still be better off financially than joining an agency and get to keep my freedom and competive enough for parents, rember agrncies aren't just looking to cover their costs they'll be looking to make money.
If ofsted do bring in higher fees for us I will be looking at how much I need to increase to cover the cost and then in the letter to parents I will make it very clear that my fee increase is directly linked to the increase of ofsted fees.


I've held off implementing a fee increase until we know what the fees are.

When you break it down, it isn't too daunting. One fee mentioned is £900, per inspection. If that was every 3 years, that's £300 a year. I work 48 weeks a year, so that's £6.25 a week. If I have 6 children on my books that's only just over £1 each child per week. Any fee increase I make will be at least £1 per child, per day, so I have more than covered the Ofsted fee :thumbsup:

[Simona]

You make a very good point, also I can't see how ofsted can charge us more than a pre-school or a nursery to register currently nurseries and preschools vary between £35, £50 and the most expensive £220 per year it all depends on hours and number of weeks open. Even paying £220 a year to Ofsted I could cover that in a 5p per hour fee increase so in that case I think I would still be better off financially than joining an agency and get to keep my freedom and competive enough for parents, rember agrncies aren't just looking to cover their costs they'll be looking to make money.
If ofsted do bring in higher fees for us I will be looking at how much I need to increase to cover the cost and then in the letter to parents I will make it very clear that my fee increase is directly linked to the increase of ofsted fees.

Can we REWIND back to July 2012 please and recall what has happened since?

The cost of inspection covers a cycle...at present it is 2012-2016...4 years...no one knows what it will be like in future
Calling it a registration fee is a bit confusing because ...yes it covers our continuing registration but also the services/information Ofsted give us and the inspection and much more
CMs pay £35 while CMs on the other register £104...is that sustainable? no and our fee should have been revised many years ago

many figures have been speculated in various forums about our fee
The figure I was given by Truss herself at my meeting with her in August 2012 is £800 for a cm inspection...
we did discuss agencies and also who could become an agency...yes she said we could as cms set one up either for a small group or as individuals...lets not forget what that could mean

We also fought against agencies because of the loss of individual inspection which most CMs are against
At the Preschool Learning Alliance conference in June last year I and many others attended the Ofsted workshop with the top manager...she reaffirmed the cost of inspection for cms is £800 ....for preschools and others £1400

I fedback extensively from that conference for this forum and I am sure others present at the workshop would confirm those figures
At the same time I also attended 2 other conferences in London....again I fedback extensively on those too for the forum...all in the archives I assume

So if CMs inspections cost £800 every 4 years that is £200 per annum...which means £16.66 per month to put away and save...(I have been doing so for a long time...just in case. If that is not required I will have a small amount of savings to use elsewhere) ...it can be done by passing the cost to parents of course just like agencies will do.

In addition cms responded to Ofsted immediately 2 years ago when the Chief Inspector said in Nursery World CMs were too expensive to register and inspect ...cms said we would be willing to pay a higher fee to cover costs and stay independent

The archive in this forum will reflect our comments as will many other forums where these discussions were held.
I did write to Sue Gregory on that score and she replied it is the DfE that sets the fee not Ofsted.

That fact that DfE/Ofsted have ignored that request means the agenda is rather different...did the Chief Inspector not say that many CMs were not delivering 'education' but just 'minding'?

Yes he did ...did he not say he wanted CMs out of the EYFS? he did
What does it mean now that CMs can work in schools for wraparound care?...that we will be minding not really educating
Why have Cms been split by Ofsted from the rest of the workforce under the Early Education and Childminding?

Some have concentrated on agencies for 2 years and ignored the fact that Independent CMs should have been on the agenda ...we should have had answers not continue to ask questions on agencies...the result is that after reams of words we are none the wiser

This forum did respond to my appeal to ask questions for independent CMs...many of you will have seen my questions to Truss in the Alliance Under 5 Mag...many will know I am trying to be elected to The their Board of Trustees...because I would like to have a go at representing independent CMs

Now that agencies are the law...did anyone ever doubt that?....what next for independent CMs?...that is what we need to concentrate on...now not 2 years down the line.

My view of course

[hectors house]

We have set up an Independent network which is offering everything an Agency would - support and advice (buddy scheme for new minders), legislation updates, collating info on when childminders first aid & safeguarding is due so we can put pressure on the training companies to offer local affordable training, we have a web page for advertising, bi monthly meetings - for only £20 a year membership (most of this is to fund the website). We are remaining independent as we all want to keep our individual Ofsted grading.

[Simona]

We have set up an Independent network which is offering everything an Agency would - support and advice (buddy scheme for new minders), legislation updates, collating info on when childminders first aid & safeguarding is due so we can put pressure on the training companies to offer local affordable training, we have a web page for advertising, bi monthly meetings - for only £20 a year membership (most of this is to fund the website). We are remaining independent as we all want to keep our individual Ofsted grading.

That sounds very proactive and, in my view, also very effective because it is targeted at your local cms with hands-on support
Thank you for sharing and keep us posted how successful you are in this

[AdeleMarie88]

We have set up an Independent network which is offering everything an Agency would - support and advice (buddy scheme for new minders), legislation updates, collating info on when childminders first aid & safeguarding is due so we can put pressure on the training companies to offer local affordable training, we have a web page for advertising, bi monthly meetings - for only £20 a year membership (most of this is to fund the website). We are remaining independent as we all want to keep our individual Ofsted grading.

Really like the idea of that! X

[Mouse]

We have set up an Independent network which is offering everything an Agency would - support and advice (buddy scheme for new minders), legislation updates, collating info on when childminders first aid & safeguarding is due so we can put pressure on the training companies to offer local affordable training, we have a web page for advertising, bi monthly meetings - for only £20 a year membership (most of this is to fund the website). We are remaining independent as we all want to keep our individual Ofsted grading.

We have a similar set up, although it has just evolved rather than anyone actively setting it up.

We've had a childminding group for years and have always supported each other. As LA support went down, peer support increased. We arrange our own training and events, always at a time that suits us and at a venue we can all get to. We arrange visits from a dentist, the fire service, a creepy crawly group, music sessions etc. We also have a FB group so we can communicate that way. If a parent phones one of us and we can't help, we contact other childminders who we know can. Between us we nearly always manage to match up the parents with a suitable childminder. We cover each other's holiday and help out if one of us is ill.
We raise funds for the group by weekly subs and sponsored events. We have quite a healthy bank balance and that goes towards the cost of activities, printing, photocopying, training etc (although we always pay some extra for that).

We really don't see that an agency would offer us any more than we already do, but if it came to it (ie. if it was ever made that only agency minders could provide funding, or use tax credits) we would seriously look into the process of setting up our own agency.

[hectors house]

We have a similar set up, although it has just evolved rather than anyone actively setting it up.

We've had a childminding group for years and have always supported each other. As LA support went down, peer support increased. We arrange our own training and events, always at a time that suits us and at a venue we can all get to. We arrange visits from a dentist, the fire service, a creepy crawly group, music sessions etc. We also have a FB group so we can communicate that way. If a parent phones one of us and we can't help, we contact other childminders who we know can. Between us we nearly always manage to match up the parents with a suitable childminder. We cover each other's holiday and help out if one of us is ill.
We raise funds for the group by weekly subs and sponsored events. We have quite a healthy bank balance and that goes towards the cost of activities, printing, photocopying, training etc (although we always pay some extra for that).

We really don't see that an agency would offer us any more than we already do, but if it came to it (ie. if it was ever made that only agency minders could provide funding, or use tax credits) we would seriously look into the process of setting up our own agency.

We have just set up a facebook page, and if anyone phones about a space and we can't help them, it gets e-mailed round the rest of the group but we desperately need to recruit new members as we are all full. The LA person who is there to support new childminders after they have registered I fear will be poisioning their mind and trying to get them to join an Agency - really wish I had asked at the conference whether our LO is going to set one up or if they know if the Children's Centres will be.

[Mouse]

We have just set up a facebook page, and if anyone phones about a space and we can't help them, it gets e-mailed round the rest of the group but we desperately need to recruit new members as we are all full. The LA person who is there to support new childminders after they have registered I fear will be poisioning their mind and trying to get them to join an Agency - really wish I had asked at the conference whether our LO is going to set one up or if they know if the Children's Centres will be.

So far our LA (well, our one DO) is very much against agencies and says there are no plans at all for our LA to set one up. We're fortunate that new childminders are given our group details and urged to join us. Some do, some want to go it alone completely, which is fine. Our childminders do have quite a high profile in our area, so if anyone is thinking of registering, they do tend to approach one of us as they get more info than they would from the LA.