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kellyskidz!
28-08-2013, 09:45 PM
Not having a good week at all :(
I now have my first parent refusing to pay.
Text her yesterday reminding her and she didn't answer
Her son left last week and she owes me £90. Today it was supposed to be transferred by her into my bank, not a sign of it.
Tried to call her but no reply. Text her saying the £90 has not gone into my bank which she replied to saying I sent it this morning. I telephoned my bank who said there was no transaction made today and as far as they could see there were no pending trasactions either and to call them back tomorrow.
Telephoned parent and told her this and asked her to check her end and she gave me a speech which was so rehersed and cold and calculated that it chilled me and I thought oh god no, you've done this before and know exactly what you're saying! She said I couldn't contact her tomorrow as she was at work and anyway it had send as far as she's concerned so that's the end of it. She also said your insurance won't cover this so there's nothing you can do. It made me think she's definitely done this or something like this before
What do I do? I've been in tears all night, never had this before and it's shook me. Also she's a friend too (not a close one) which makes it worse!
Am I right in thinking that mm won't touch owed money cases under a certain amount? Should I contact the police as my partner suggested as its technically theft? Or do I just let it go (which I can't really afford to do) and chalk it up to experience?
I feel so upset and down and it's really making me wonder if I can carry on childminding because I can't deal with things like this without getting upset and taking it personally :(:(

Tealady
28-08-2013, 09:52 PM
What an animal that says "Moo"!

It does sound like she has done it before and is so out of order.

All I can say is in future take payment in advance. If you do that already put in terms to your contract that allow you to withhold care until payment is made.

Sending Hugs!

The Juggler
28-08-2013, 10:08 PM
ring mm tomorrow. i thought if it was a low amount they would cover you. they will also advise you on a letter to write her asking for the money which should get her to pay up.

good luck honey xx

sing-low
28-08-2013, 10:19 PM
She may be saying insurance won't cover you to make you think it's not worth trying. Definitely call MM and find out and then go from there. Hugs, what a horrible situation to be in.

blue bear
28-08-2013, 10:23 PM
Mm will sort it out, friend had the same, mm paid out on insurance.

Chatterbox Childcare
28-08-2013, 10:32 PM
Don't let her fool you - you have the option to take her to the small claims court. Make sure your contracts are air tight first though, all signed and dated correctly etc..

kellyskidz!
28-08-2013, 11:19 PM
Thanks guys, CANNOT sleep, how pathetic am I lol?!
And now stressing that I'll be too tired tomorrow on top of this stress. Ugh, bad day! Still feeling down but hoping tomorrows a better day
Good to know mm will support this if needed, I just had a horrible thought that someone had once said they don't deal with low amounts, but £90 is £90
I just know she's not going to pay it, or at least willingly from her attitude. I mean, how would she know about insurance and what they cover? And about bank transfers to childminders and the ins and outs of them? She must have done it before or looked into it which means it was planned, and she never intends to pay me
If I don't end up getting it back it has definitely taught me NEVER to accept payment in arrears, such a shame I've had to learn it this way and put honest decent parents in a situation where they're paying before they get their childcare but I can't go through this again. Honestly haven't eaten all day and have a feeling I won't be sleeping a wink tonight. Can't believe anyone can be so deliberately cruel as to put someone else through this for the sake of saving themselves some money :(

kellyskidz!
29-08-2013, 05:54 AM
No payment in bank today :( not a big surprise though
Will phone insurance company later, can't believe I'm having to do this! I feel weird like I'm dreaming or its not really happening.
I know it does happen, parents don't pay but I didn't think it would happen to me. It's only £90 but its more the principle that someone has effectively stolen from your business that I didn't realise hurts the most!

Samantha_j41
29-08-2013, 05:58 AM
Do you have late payment policy? I charge £5 per day its late (soon chases parent up!) i came up with this after a parent i had was always late paying xx hope you can sort it

shortstuff
29-08-2013, 06:03 AM
Im sorry to hear you are having trouble n I hope mm help you out x

When you explain about paying in advance rather than arrears compare yourself to any other service or shop x you have to pay before you receive your 'goods'.

You dont collect your food shop and say I will come back and pay for what I actually eat with reductions for any waste.

If you are confident when explaining to parents they will usually go with it x although there will always be just one x

kellyskidz!
29-08-2013, 06:14 AM
Oh god oh god oh god!!
Tried to ring mum to say we'll have no further contact and I'll hand it over to mm, no answer so I text it to which she replied
The money has gone out of my account so that's the end of it as far as I'm concerned. Phone your insurance, and I'll be filing a report against you to OFSTED?!!?!
What do I do, I'm so scared she'll do this out of spite!

charlottenash
29-08-2013, 06:18 AM
I'd tell Ofsted you've received that text, and KEEP THE TEXT!!!

Ofsted get this all the time, please don't panic.

shortstuff
29-08-2013, 06:18 AM
Calm down xx ofsted arent interested in money disputes xx

kellyskidz!
29-08-2013, 06:20 AM
Oh my god I literally don't believe this is happening. Crying my eyes out and due to start work in ten mins!
I'm shaking, this is the worst thing that's happened to me. Cannot believe this!!

shortstuff
29-08-2013, 06:23 AM
Seriously have a cuppa n try n relax x ofsted know parents make malicious complaints at times x im sure it will easily be settled x

TooEarlyForGin?
29-08-2013, 06:27 AM
Try no to panic, it's very early, you need to check your account later, transactions don't usually show until after 9am, and depending on the bank can take 3 days to transfer.

Rick
29-08-2013, 06:37 AM
Oh god oh god oh god!!
Tried to ring mum to say we'll have no further contact and I'll hand it over to mm, no answer so I text it to which she replied
The money has gone out of my account so that's the end of it as far as I'm concerned. Phone your insurance, and I'll be filing a report against you to OFSTED?!!?!
What do I do, I'm so scared she'll do this out of spite!

It's an idle threat and one that will get her absolutely nowhere! Ofsted will be on your side even if she does try it. Don't let her get away with it, you have proof in text that she knows she should pay you and from your bank that she hasn't.

Maybe this debt recovery thread will help you

http://www.childmindinghelp.co.uk/forum/attachments/book-keeping-accounts-tax-expenses-national-insurance/7653d1377113938-debt-recovery-letter-debt-letter.pdf

:group hug:

lisa1968
29-08-2013, 07:14 AM
She's calling your bluff.
Send a reply saying "Go ahead.And I'll be taking you to the small claims court". keep all communications between yourself and her.
£90 is a weeks shopping.
As others have said-she's done it before and probably got away with it-don't let her this time.
Oh and she's definitely NOT a friend.
...by the way......don't know if this is ethical or not but in our area we pass on names of non-payers to other minders so they are aware of them if they ask for childcare....

lisa1968
29-08-2013, 07:23 AM
...this job certainly toughens you up when it comes to non-payers!:angry:

hectors house
29-08-2013, 07:26 AM
Stop texting and ringing her and start putting everything in writing - follow Sarah's advice in the post below.

http://www.childmindinghelp.co.uk/forum/book-keeping-accounts-tax-expenses-national-insurance/123083-debt-recovery-letter.html

From now on say to all existing parents that you are very sorry but due to a parent refusing to pay that you are now forced to insist on payment in advance or to hold a deposit to cover against people who have done as this parent has done. You can get them to pay a little bit extra each month that goes into a deposit account to protect you against this happening again.

Hope MM can help you - you could ring Ofsted and warn them that this threat has been made - and tell her that you have notified Ofsted and they are looking forward to her call! £90 doesn't seem like a lot of money - but it's 2 pairs of kids school shoes, a weeks shopping bill and above all you have earnt it.

JCrakers
29-08-2013, 07:27 AM
KEEP THAT TEXT.....

Really sorry you're going through this. It amazes me how people can be so awful. Try not to let it get to you although its really hard isnt it :(

Sending hugs

twiggy
29-08-2013, 07:41 AM
MM would only help me when the parent owed £100 but weren't interested in helping me get back anything less, do you have a late payment policy to add on charges to get the amount owed to over £100?

kellyskidz!
29-08-2013, 08:09 AM
Thanks guys, I'm going to call mm and OFSTED now. Still a little shaky and bottom lip keeps threatening to wobble but the kids are here and making me feel much better, no time to be upset!
I do have late fee policy with 20% of daily fees but just thinking I should leave it to other parties now since, as much as I hate to admit, her threat has shaken me. I obviously have nothing to hide but I could do without the hassle and potential bad name.
Hate that I feel like I've bowed under her pressure but its exhausted me, didnt sleep a wink last night!

watgem
29-08-2013, 08:41 AM
Kellyskidz sending you a big ((hug)), I have the exact same thing, unfortunately I didn't charge upfront either :( I am sending the lady a letter along with another invoice which includes the amount of late payment fees I could possibly charge, I'm more than happy to email you my letter if that helps|? as everyone says keep all texts, and make all your communications in writing, include the date on everything and keep copies of everything, inform Ofsted that you are expecting a complaint to be made due to the text she sent you and tell them its due to non payment of fees, they do get this a lot, so please try not to worry too much they are quite good at seeing through malicious complaintsxxx

EmmaReed84
29-08-2013, 09:14 AM
Ohhhh, what I wouldn't give to have 5 minutes with this woman and let her feel the sharp end of my tongue!!!

What an awful woman! You wait, we will find a thread on... that place... saying "CM is taking me to court!"

I can't understand how someone could be so cold, how on Earth does she sleep at night!!!

I so hope she gets what is coming to her!

kellyskidz!
29-08-2013, 09:23 AM
Kellyskidz sending you a big ((hug)), I have the exact same thing, unfortunately I didn't charge upfront either :( I am sending the lady a letter along with another invoice which includes the amount of late payment fees I could possibly charge, I'm more than happy to email you my letter if that helps|? as everyone says keep all texts, and make all your communications in writing, include the date on everything and keep copies of everything, inform Ofsted that you are expecting a complaint to be made due to the text she sent you and tell them its due to non payment of fees, they do get this a lot, so please try not to worry too much they are quite good at seeing through malicious complaintsxxx

Yes please sending email,in p,. So good to hear its not just me going through this, although obviously I wouldn't wish this on anyone else because its horrible!
Thanks to everyone again for advice xxxx

Simona
29-08-2013, 09:54 AM
Kellykidz..just to clarify that Ofsted do not get involved in 'financial affairs' in other words if parents owe you money it is not their remit to intervene
The parent may complain to Ofsted but it will depend on what complaint she makes...money matters will not interest Ofsted

If you are owed £90 it will cost you much more just to start the Small Claims court proceedings and application...from memory I think it is £150 for the application
Any court will try to get the 2 parties to resolve the issue outside because it is expensive for the court to go through the hearing...

This is a good time to review your contract and ensure you take 4 weeks deposit making clear it will be refunded after parents have given you notice and paid all outstanding fees...put it clearly in your contract, Terms and Conditions and invoice if you do one regularly

I am so worried that non payment of fees seems to come up over and over again...the only way to solve it is to cover yourself with a deposit...no one could ever rent a car, house or flat without a deposit...the same should apply for cms

Good luck

Tazmin68
29-08-2013, 10:21 AM
I had a similar one once years ago again threatened ofsted. Got ncma involved was about to start small claims court then found out parents business had folded and was advised by ncma no point in proceeding with claim as parents not had any money due to business folding and i would be classed as another creditor. I am now very harsh no fee paid no childcare

catminder
29-08-2013, 10:37 AM
So sorry that you are going through this, it's a horrible situation. A few years ago I had a parent who left owing me £150. I got very upset about it as well and to cut a long story short my partner called round to her house (they lived local) and politely asked if she would pay her outstanding fees. A few days later she sent her older child over with a cheque.
I'm not sure if this would have the same result for you but perhaps seeing her face to face may make her realise how unreasonable she is being and she will do the right thing and pay you.
Do you see her up at school or at a playgroup etc? Maybe if you asked her to pay you what she owed you in front of other people she would be more forthcoming.
I really hope you feel better about the situation soon and manage to sleep tonight. We are all behind you
X Alison

little chickee
29-08-2013, 11:03 AM
My personal opinion?

Let it go. Chalk it up to experience and move on. I know that £90 is alot to lose but it really is not worth the heartache, loss of sleep etc.

Learn from it and don't make the same mistake again. Fees up front and no care from the day they are overdue.

emma04
29-08-2013, 12:19 PM
VILE WOMAN!!!!

Forget it, her, the money and the principles and charge fees in advance from now on!

Do NOT let this horrible witch ruin your days, nights or business! Something or someone will come along and bite her hard on the ass very soon, I assure you!!!!

I have spent many a night fretting over spiteful mothers who think we are here purely to be abused and treated like dirt!!! In TRUTH.....They are jealous! Jealous and guilt ridden because:

They can't/won't spent time with their children!!
Their children love coming to us!
Their children talk to them about us constantly!
Their children are learning without them!

Please have a stiff drink tonight and put her and the whole situation out of your head! She's gone, no need to speak or deal with her again! Move on and take comfort from the fact that for every bit*h of a mother there's a lovely mother who thoroughly appreciates you, even if they don't always show it physically!!

rickysmiths
29-08-2013, 12:30 PM
I would also phone the Police and record the fact that a threat has been made on the phone.

Stop Texting and write a letter.

adedwards68
29-08-2013, 12:34 PM
A few years ago I had a problem with a parent paying, I had bounced cheques and excuse after excuse. She phoned me one morning and said child wouldn't be coming anymore due to her temp job ending ( I didn't know her job was temp) and she would pay me. Because she didn't give any notice she ended up owing over £1000. Went through Pacey and this mother had declared herself bankrupt and had agreed to pay a certain amount to me and everybody else she owed money to each month. Never received a penny, she moved and they couldn't trace her. I know charge in advance, no money no care. A very expensive lesson. When I spoke to Pacey about it I said there should be some kind if register that theses parents are put on to stop them doing it to other, of course they can't do it because of"human rights"

kellyskidz!
29-08-2013, 01:54 PM
Spoken to insurance and OFSTED who were very kind (which obviously set me off weeping again lol) they said to write a letter and get proof of postage and to date it two weeks from today and if nothing's heard in that time to call them again, or if I need to in the meantime they are there.
Feeling less upset now and more angry, what's the point in have a legal contract with her if she can get away without paying, she's manipulative and I'm SO sure, I'd put my life on it, that she's done this before to some other poor minder x

shortstuff
29-08-2013, 01:57 PM
Spoken to insurance and OFSTED who were very kind (which obviously set me off weeping again lol) they said to write a letter and get proof of postage and to date it two weeks from today and if nothing's heard in that time to call them again, or if I need to in the meantime they are there.
Feeling less upset now and more angry, what's the point in have a legal contract with her if she can get away without paying, she's manipulative and I'm SO sure, I'd put my life on it, that she's done this before to some other poor minder x

im glad you are feeling less upset x I hope the horrid woman sees sense soon x