New to minding and not enjoying it so far :-( This will be a long one....

[mamamoomin]

So I've been minding a little boy (4 yrs) after school for the past 9 weeks. Initially it was ok, he was quiet but played nicely with my dd (who is under 2) and did as he was told. Then after about 4 weeks I started to notice little things like he would never say please or thank you, would demand I get him things etc. So I tried to put a stop to that. It didn't really work, I still have to remind him about his manners every single day. He also started to get pushy around my dd, didn't want her playing with 'his' toys...even though they're not his, they're toys for minding. Shouts at her if she touches his coat, shoes etc. Then things started to get worse. I picked him up from school and the end of the day came and I took his bag to get ready for Mum, he didn't want me too, I said I needed too because Mum would want to get going quickly...well he went crazy, threatened to punch me, kick me, was screaming at me, tried to hit me with his umbrella if I came near him to get the bag that he had snatched. Mum turned up right in the middle and he had managed to climb over the stairgate and she had to physically pull him down the stairs and out the door. When I picked him up from school the next day he said he didn't want to go with me as he was still angry with me. He eventually come and there was no incidents although his attitude was still 'I want this, I want that' ... Then I had a similar scene a couple of days ago when he went to the toilet and wouldn't wash his hands, again I was getting threats. He said he didn't like me, said I wasn't a good childminder as I told him what to do. I spoke to Mum and found out that he had witnessed some violence between her and his Dad (they are going through a messy split) a couple of weeks previously, when the bad behaviour increased so obviously it's linked. She said she has been having to tell him off more and more recently and he doesn't want to do what he's told at home either and has become increasingly possessive over his things like coat, bag, toys etc. He is fine at school according to his Teacher.

I know it's not his fault and I do try to be affectionate towards him as behind all the aggression there is a lovely little boy, it's just that I'm finding it more and more difficult especially when he starts having a go at dd for no reason.

I am also having trouble in getting my 2nd / 3rd mindee so worried about money on top of it all.

Just really not having a good time of it and considering just giving up if I'm being honest. I didn't have a rose tinted vision of childminding. Just thought I would enjoy it more than I am doing.

xx

[vals]

Don't give up -getting registered is a challenge in itself now, it will be worth it in the end.
you have done well by discussing the problems with the mum, and as hard as it is, as long as you are working with her, I am sure things will improve. Try and remember the child isn't angry with you, its just his way of expressing himself. I have looked after many 'difficult' children, and when things improve I reflect on the days when i dreaded the doorbell going, and say how pleased I am that I persevered.

[jadavi]

Also it's really nice for him to have somewhere else to go if things are a bit strained at home. At least he's being himself and relaxed with you. It will be an important regular outlet for him even tho he is playing up right now.
Maybe it would help to do some table activities with him that he likes so you get some positive interaction going...Lego, baking, puzzles.
It may help to get his teacher's take on it. With mum's permission you could ask him/ her to call you and she might give some ideas or tips.
Hang in there. It does get better with easier children and in time you will prob be swamped. :)

[gegele]

Dad probably took some stuff with him and they probably argued about what is whose and so on.

maybe if he is touchy about his stuff he could be the one preparing his stuff.

try to find a book about separation at the library and anger burst surely there must be something and you could read together.

I find that the school run is always a good time to have chat as let formal than a sit down chat but you have to listen to each other.

say that if he feel angry he should go and have a sit down, a time out to calm himself and then come back to play...

good luck,

you started with a situation but it will get better.

[Pipsqueak]

So I've been minding a little boy (4 yrs) after school for the past 9 weeks. Initially it was ok, he was quiet but played nicely with my dd (who is under 2) and did as he was told. Then after about 4 weeks I started to notice little things like he would never say please or thank you, would demand I get him things etc. So I tried to put a stop to that. It didn't really work, I still have to remind him about his manners every single day. He also started to get pushy around my dd, didn't want her playing with 'his' toys...even though they're not his, they're toys for minding. Shouts at her if she touches his coat, shoes etc. Then things started to get worse. I picked him up from school and the end of the day came and I took his bag to get ready for Mum, he didn't want me too, I said I needed too because Mum would want to get going quickly...well he went crazy, threatened to punch me, kick me, was screaming at me, tried to hit me with his umbrella if I came near him to get the bag that he had snatched. Mum turned up right in the middle and he had managed to climb over the stairgate and she had to physically pull him down the stairs and out the door. When I picked him up from school the next day he said he didn't want to go with me as he was still angry with me. He eventually come and there was no incidents although his attitude was still 'I want this, I want that' ... Then I had a similar scene a couple of days ago when he went to the toilet and wouldn't wash his hands, again I was getting threats. He said he didn't like me, said I wasn't a good childminder as I told him what to do. I spoke to Mum and found out that he had witnessed some violence between her and his Dad (they are going through a messy split) a couple of weeks previously, when the bad behaviour increased so obviously it's linked. She said she has been having to tell him off more and more recently and he doesn't want to do what he's told at home either and has become increasingly possessive over his things like coat, bag, toys etc. He is fine at school according to his Teacher.

I know it's not his fault and I do try to be affectionate towards him as behind all the aggression there is a lovely little boy, it's just that I'm finding it more and more difficult especially when he starts having a go at dd for no reason.

I am also having trouble in getting my 2nd / 3rd mindee so worried about money on top of it all.

Just really not having a good time of it and considering just giving up if I'm being honest. I didn't have a rose tinted vision of childminding. Just thought I would enjoy it more than I am doing.

xx

First and foremost you need to document everything as far as you remember it - days/times/what was said/done , how you dealt with it.
And you carry on documenting
Next you need to sit down with mum and work out a behaviour management strategty - positive rewards and attention, consequences of actions

you need to closely monitor this childs behaviour and if it escalates perhaps a referal for more professional assistance to work with you and mum - child is obviously conflicted and dealing with emotions that are overwhelming him.

You need to get firm and consistent very quickly - lay out some very clear boundaries and expectations. Ignore what you can and act swiftly where you can't

I would be very clear with mum that you cannot have him endangering himself or others and certainly not getting violent with you or others - be clear that these are grounds for instant termination of contract and things need to show improvement increasingly over the next few weeks otherwise you may have no choice.

As for the toys - I tell all the children - actually they are MY toys and I am choosing to share with them. If they don't like that they have options - sit quietly by themselves with a book for instance. I do also point out that this is my children's home and they do no deserve to be treated badly.

Keep firm, calm and cheerful. The LO is seeking a reaction - albiet negatively.

Unless you get mum on board though I am afraid you may be fighting a loosing battle.

[k1rstie]

I think sometimes its tough being a kid!! New childminder, new school, mum upset, dad cross, dad not there, dad there!, being told what to do. Although children do not have the same types of stresses we do, I think life can be stressful for them!


BUT.....

When I first started minding, my first child was a nightmare, if it wasnt for the fact that eventually I got a second child, I would have given up.

I suspect many minders have a nightmare with their first child. We are inexperienced, do not yet have the special gut feelings, and do not have the network of support, that older minders have, plus you are more likely to have a nonpaying parent, or be inexperienced then talking about contracts, holiday pay, notice periods etc. Maybe certain parents can see that as a brand new minder, you will not have come into contact with their child with another childminder, so they can say they are angels, as you are unlikely to know the old minder to be given a nod or a wink!!

When I was new, it took 9 months to get my first child, I was despirate for one - would have agreed to anything. But once minding, the 2nd and 3rd child will come.


I am glad I didnt give up after the time i had with the first child ( his name is still whispered in our house), that child is the only one I have everr given notice too.


my advise to you would be - your next couple of kids will come soon (probably starting in January), not sure what to professionally advise about your current situation .

Good Luck

Kirstie:laughing:

[nipper]

I think you could be the one constant thing he needs by the sounds of it. You have identified that things changed all of a sudden and that underneath all these confusing feelings he must be having, there is a sweet natured little boy. I would keep going if I were you and just make a little bit of extra time for him. Is he an only child as well?

[hedgehog]

I too had a very disruptive child and he started to upset my children and make the days he came so stressful. I rehearsed in my head how I would tell his parents I wanted to terminate the contract so many times but part of me didn't want to give up on the child as I knew it probably wasn't the child's fault so I never said anything. I spoke to his parents about him being disruptive and we agreed how we would both tackle the behaviour and I put very firm boundaries in place and gave loads of positive praise and did star charts and I made sure we had time outdoors every day he came so he could let off steam. I noticed he had a particular interest in transport so we did loads of activites around this which he really enjoyed and whilst he wa busy he wasn't misbehaving. It took a few months but then his behaviour started changing and he settled down and was like a different child. I think he was lacking consistancy but learnt what was expected when he came to me as I was quite strict and he liked having boundaries. It was VERY hard work and very stressful and hard on my children. He is still one of my more challenging children but he is now a lot better and I no longer dread the days he comes. I hope you're ok as I know it is really stressful to deal with and hard to see your child being affected. Could you set yourself a date to work towards that if he hasn't improved by then then you can end the contract? Good luck and let us know how it goes. x

[mamamoomin]

Thanks for all the replies. Yes he is an only child and I think Mum probably has some kind of single working parent guilt so every night he gets a treat in some form and expects the same from me. I took him to a little bakery once as we were having a day out in half term and now he always wants to go and goes off on one if I say no. Same with going into shops, I took him into the supermarket to do a counting activity as I needed to get some fruit and he saw a toy, demanded it and then cried the whole way home because I said no.

We have started a reward chart and he seems to like that, he also likes much more active / loud / messy games than what I am used to with looking after girls..although I did expect that a boy wouldn't want to sit in a reading corner for over an hour like the little girl I used to look after as a Nanny.

I am currently offering a week of free childcare for anyone who signs a contract before Christmas but still nothing, I am going to leaflet drop over the weekend and maybe create a fb page.

xx

[hectors house]

I would let the issue of manners slide at the moment as he maybe feels you are on his back all the time (I'm sure you aren't but maybe it feels that way to him), work out which of his other behavioural issues need tackling and which you can ignore for the moment. Obviously you need to address any behaviour that is dangerous to him and to others and I wouldn't tolerate any deliberate breaking of toys or other things in my house. His behaviour has changed since you started looking after him and would seem to be linked to his parents separation - so hopefully once he feels safe again his behaviour will slowly change back. Glad you are finding more things that he likes and hope you find some more customers.

[mum24]

First and foremost you need to document everything as far as you remember it - days/times/what was said/done , how you dealt with it.
And you carry on documenting
Next you need to sit down with mum and work out a behaviour management strategty - positive rewards and attention, consequences of actions

you need to closely monitor this childs behaviour and if it escalates perhaps a referal for more professional assistance to work with you and mum - child is obviously conflicted and dealing with emotions that are overwhelming him.

You need to get firm and consistent very quickly - lay out some very clear boundaries and expectations. Ignore what you can and act swiftly where you can't

I would be very clear with mum that you cannot have him endangering himself or others and certainly not getting violent with you or others - be clear that these are grounds for instant termination of contract and things need to show improvement increasingly over the next few weeks otherwise you may have no choice.

As for the toys - I tell all the children - actually they are MY toys and I am choosing to share with them. If they don't like that they have options - sit quietly by themselves with a book for instance. I do also point out that this is my children's home and they do no deserve to be treated badly.

Keep firm, calm and cheerful. The LO is seeking a reaction - albiet negatively.

Unless you get mum on board though I am afraid you may be fighting a loosing battle.


i agree with much of this, especially documenting everything, and also if necessary in a little while if behaviour doesn't improve involving other childcare professionals, however, personally, i would hesitate to to add to mums problems by telling her you may impose instant termination of the contract (at the moment anyway). It is very difficult though, I had a brother and sister who had dreadful tantrums, never seen anything like it before, now they don't have tantrums with me, but they still do with mum and dad to get their own way, which as you will have guessed, they do.

[Pipsqueak]

i agree with much of this, especially documenting everything, and also if necessary in a little while if behaviour doesn't improve involving other childcare professionals, however, personally, i would hesitate to to add to mums problems by telling her you may impose instant termination of the contract (at the moment anyway). It is very difficult though, I had a brother and sister who had dreadful tantrums, never seen anything like it before, now they don't have tantrums with me, but they still do with mum and dad to get their own way, which as you will have guessed, they do.

Whilst I agree to a point about not compounding mums problems we are not social workers and we are not nor are members of our family there to be battered or used a kicking pads or punching bags, our own children in their own homes should not be subjected to dangerous or aggresive behaviours. And to be honest mum needs to be aware of this and what the consequences are.
I am not suggesting for a moment that the OP gives up 'just like that' - I do believe that sometimes we need to persevere but NOT to the detriment of our families.
What the OP is describing is something an experienced minder may struggle with let alone a less experienced one!

just my opinion :)

[lauren1979]

Also remember if he has just started school he is going to be exhausted on top of everything else!

Take a deep breath, keep calm and remember it is not personal :)

[TNT]

Poor little boy, and poor you! What a challanging situation. All of the advice from others has been great and I hope he starts to feel more secure with you soon, am sure he will as it sounds like you are doing a great job.

Have you tried going to local toddler groups to drum up some business? I have got lots of business through the groups I attend and advertise at.

[smartbear]

Whilst I agree to a point about not compounding mums problems we are not social workers and we are not nor are members of our family there to be battered or used a kicking pads or punching bags, our own children in their own homes should not be subjected to dangerous or aggresive behaviours. And to be honest mum needs to be aware of this and what the consequences are.
I am not suggesting for a moment that the OP gives up 'just like that' - I do believe that sometimes we need to persevere but NOT to the detriment of our families.
What the OP is describing is something an experienced minder may struggle with let alone a less experienced one!

just my opinion :)

Has to be said, the best interest of the child may not always be served by staying in a particular setting, so don't get too guilty if you decide that the right thing is to give notice. Your children's interests are just as important and they are your responsibility. But having said that there are things you could do & if you make this work you'll feel so good about it. I' d talk to the teacher - is he really so well-behaved at school? If he is, then you could start by continuing school's expectations/sanctions. I'm sure Mum'll agree to that. And get advice/support from anywhere - CM groups, the EY team, this forum! Could be a good way of getting yourself both a support network & some new business. But it's such bad luck to get this first time, don't let it put you off!

[VeggieSausage]

I totally agree with documenting absolutely everything and keep notes, this is very important.....there may be violence in the house directed at him, or with him in the middle and you may need to at some point have dealings with social services. I think that there is a case that if there is a violent father living in the house then this is a safeguarding issue I would seek advice about it anyway.

I would sit down with mum and compile with his input the house rules. By him helping to compile them he may feel more of an ownership to them and with mum listening as to what behaviour is expected in your setting then she may reinforce at home. For the sake of this child and your own you need to be in control of the situation but I think alarm bells would be ringing for me and every comment mum makes about anything, record his behaviour to see if there is a pattern etc is important.

Don't give up and if the situation is really adversely affecting you and your family then you will need to give notice, good luck.

[mushpea]

I have a emotions chart to help children express their emotions, at the moment I use it a lot to help a child look after who has ADHD and finds it hard to understand how he's feeling, we sit down together and look at the faces and somtimes he will point to them other times I will sugest which ones he might be feeling then we discuss whats made him feel like this, prehpas somthing like this could help with his anger and how he's feeling.
with him not wanting you to touch his stuff i would say to him ' I understand you dont want me to touch your stuff so i will give you a warning 10mins before mums due and you can get your bag etc ready', this way the stuff is ready and he may feel more in control.
I also have a smiley face/sad face chart, for my mindee the visual is needed when he dosen somthing wrong so by putting a sad face on his chart when he does somthing wrong it helps him understand where hes going wrong but at the same time he also gets smiley faces for each nice thing, it may be a nice thing he wouldnt normaly do like nice manners or being kind to others or just because for the last 20mins he has played nicely, if he has more smiley faces than sad then he gets a sticker and at the end of the week if he has enoug stickers mum rewards him with somthing.
firm and fair also helps and cutting out the argument points so like tonight he wasnt playing with a toy nicley I told him twice to treat it nicely and not bash it but he ignored me so I just took it away, somtimes removing the toy or stress is easier and more affective than keep moaning at him but thats my mindee so it may be different with yours.
I also have some toys that I can half like hot wheels track or lego so half stays int he play room to be shared and half goes in a corner that children can choose a box to play with on their own as with my mindee he needs time to himself to chill.
I hope some of these ideas can help but definatly being firm but fair and although being sympathetic to his needs dont let him get away with bad behaviour as he will always think he can get away with it