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melco
02-11-2012, 09:14 AM
Hi,

I know its only the 2nd but am a bit worried about non payment from a parent. Last month the parent requested the money as soon as she got paid but because I did not request to be paid until the 1st that is the date it was requested by computer share vouchers to be transferred into my account. I also received an email confirming. Anyway this time I have received nothing. The lo I have is term time only and I have given notice on this child as have been having problems. His mum told me he would be coming on Tuesday in response to my email confirming giving notice which also had a copy of the invoice, so thought was fine but am now worried that she is not going to pay. How do I approach this? She may have just forgotten but still I need paying!!! Also as I requested to be paid on the 1st if she does now requests the vouchers will it be 1st Dec before I get paid or will it just go into account once requested?

Thanks for your help as always,

melco

AliceK
02-11-2012, 09:26 AM
Hi,

I know its only the 2nd but am a bit worried about non payment from a parent. Last month the parent requested the money as soon as she got paid but because I did not request to be paid until the 1st that is the date it was requested by computer share vouchers to be transferred into my account. I also received an email confirming. Anyway this time I have received nothing. The lo I have is term time only and I have given notice on this child as have been having problems. His mum told me he would be coming on Tuesday in response to my email confirming giving notice which also had a copy of the invoice, so thought was fine but am now worried that she is not going to pay. How do I approach this? She may have just forgotten but still I need paying!!! Also as I requested to be paid on the 1st if she does now requests the vouchers will it be 1st Dec before I get paid or will it just go into account once requested?

Thanks for your help as always,

melco

I would suggest you log in to your computershare account online and have a look at whether mum has made any payments. Usually I can see that a parent has made a payment on there before they e-mail me to let me know which is usually the following day after payment has been made.. You could also change your payment frequency on there to daily or else yes you will have to wait until 1st Dec for Computershare to pay you.

xxx

melco
02-11-2012, 09:42 AM
Where do I see if mum has made payment and how do I change to daily?

Thanks

AliceK
02-11-2012, 09:57 AM
Where do I see if mum has made payment and how do I change to daily?

Thanks

Log In and then go to My Payments tab. You will be able to see if mum has authorised a payment.

To change to Daily payments go to My Details tab and then click on Bank Details.

xxxx

melco
02-11-2012, 10:12 AM
I have changed it to daily, thank you.

I have checked payment history and it only shows payment for September. Does this mean she has not requested it?

Thanks

The Juggler
02-11-2012, 10:20 AM
what i hate about the voucher companies is they don't explain to parents how long it takes between their request and the money reaching our account. I'd ring the company find out exactly how long that time lapse is but often they can't make an earlier request becaues they can't request it until the vouchers go into their account on payday. Then you have 2 options:

1. agree with parents on a slightly later paydate of say 3, 4th of month if they make the request on payday (i.e. 30th) at least that way you know what date money will come each month

2. tell them they will need to pay in cash one month and bank the vouchers on payday so they have enough to pay you on time the following month.

hope that helps.

melco
02-11-2012, 10:27 AM
what i hate about the voucher companies is they don't explain to parents how long it takes between their request and the money reaching our account. I'd ring the company find out exactly how long that time lapse is but often they can't make an earlier request becaues they can't request it until the vouchers go into their account on payday. Then you have 2 options:

1. agree with parents on a slightly later paydate of say 3, 4th of month if they make the request on payday (i.e. 30th) at least that way you know what date money will come each month

2. tell them they will need to pay in cash one month and bank the vouchers on payday so they have enough to pay you on time the following month.

hope that helps.

Thanks for the reply, however she gets paid on the 25th of each month and thats when she requested it last time. I am happy to receive payment 4/5th of the month as long as I know its coming. Other parents I received email confirming its on its way etc. My worry is that because of the problems we have been having that she is not going to pay! As I have no record of her requesting it. I just hope its because she has just forgotten. I am going to text her to see if she has requested but did not want to start another disagreement!!

AliceK
02-11-2012, 10:44 AM
I have changed it to daily, thank you.

I have checked payment history and it only shows payment for September. Does this mean she has not requested it?

Thanks

If it's not showing then it doesn't look like she has made the payment :panic:

xxx

Goatgirl
02-11-2012, 10:47 AM
Hi,
As you have given notice I would also be suspicious. Having said that, it is obviously possible she has forgotten. I would text or call with a "Hi, just a polite reminder that fees were due in my account yesterday. I have checked with the voucher company and no payment appears to pending. Could you authorise payment today and let me know when its done please. Thank you :)" kind of message at this point.

If I then hadn't heard anything into the evening I would call and ask if payment has been authorised. If not push for prompt payment and if still not acknowledged on the system on Monday, approach them again. More firmly, offering to accept a cash payment and reminding of whatever your policies are for childcare when fees are unpaid i.e. will you accept child for childcare if money is not paid? Might be a good idea to check the contract too in case they are going to be awkward :thumbsup:

Good luck, hope its just an oversight :)

bunyip
02-11-2012, 12:52 PM
First I would phone Computershare. IME they're usually helpful on the phone. Make sure you get the facts before you approach mum.

Then speak to mum about it. Be polite and reasonable, but firm. Don't give ground, but do offer her reasonable opportunity to pay. If it comes to the worst (and it's far from being there yet) and you end up going to small claims court, they will expect you to have done this from the outset.

You do need to be prepared to get your insurer/professional body's legal team involved if necessary. But parents will often give in once they know you are serious and professional and not prepared to take any nonsense.

Re-read your contract and policy, so you're sure of them and can apply them consistently. If you've covered it, then you should be able to withdraw care until mum pays up. This also tends to focus the parents' minds. :rolleyes: If she's made a deliberate decision not to pay (and we don't know that yet) then conyinuing to provide care only means the size of the default is stacking up.

Don't start sending text messages. You may need all the correspondence as evidence, so ensure you use a retrievable form (email or letter). Write down what is said too. You may end up needing to send mum letters to confirm anything she has said/texted.

The most important things at this stage are to check all your facts; check your contract and policies; communicate in a professional manner; and be consistent.

melco
02-11-2012, 02:34 PM
First I would phone Computershare. IME they're usually helpful on the phone. Make sure you get the facts before you approach mum.

Then speak to mum about it. Be polite and reasonable, but firm. Don't give ground, but do offer her reasonable opportunity to pay. If it comes to the worst (and it's far from being there yet) and you end up going to small claims court, they will expect you to have done this from the outset.

You do need to be prepared to get your insurer/professional body's legal team involved if necessary. But parents will often give in once they know you are serious and professional and not prepared to take any nonsense.

Re-read your contract and policy, so you're sure of them and can apply them consistently. If you've covered it, then you should be able to withdraw care until mum pays up. This also tends to focus the parents' minds. :rolleyes: If she's made a deliberate decision not to pay (and we don't know that yet) then conyinuing to provide care only means the size of the default is stacking up.

Don't start sending text messages. You may need all the correspondence as evidence, so ensure you use a retrievable form (email or letter). Write down what is said too. You may end up needing to send mum letters to confirm anything she has said/texted.

The most important things at this stage are to check all your facts; check your contract and policies; communicate in a professional manner; and be consistent.

I have sent a text message as this is the way we have been in contact before but have also sent an email with read receipt so that I have something to keep to confirm.

I have also checked with Computer Share Voucher company and they have no record of the money being requested but in my text an email I have asked whether she has requested it so not accusing her of anything. (yet!)

I have text messages from over a week ago where she was rude because I would not take her son because he was sick. I don't have the option to save these on my phone, would you right down the conversation in case this does go any further?

I just have a feeling about this because she was really rude over a week ago and then after she received notice she has been overly nice.

melco
02-11-2012, 07:37 PM
Me again.

So my texts and emails have been ignored and it was sent 8 hours ago!!

What do I do now? I have called the childcare voucher company just to confirm they have not requested payment since I spoke to them this morning and they have confirmed nothing received from the parent.

My husband thinks I should call now but am scared, never good with wording anything as what comes out of my mouth is not always what I want to say!!

I want to leave it until Monday. What do you guys think?

bunyip
04-11-2012, 09:44 AM
Sorry Melco. Only just checked in again after 2 days and seen you got no other replies. Btw, if this happens it can be worth re-posting on a new thread: once a thread falls off the 'New Posts' screen it won't be viewed by many.

First, I wouldn't panic if you can't do much more until Monday (which is a bit hypocritical of me, as I'm a natural worrier who'd rather be doing something than nothing.)

I reiterate that it's vitally important to have all your facts straight and to hand, ready for any communications you need to have with mum. Hard as it is, you need to be polite, courteous, and professional at all times. Emotive language and feelings will not help. You are essentially trying to resolve a business issue, based on a contractual agreement. You'll only do that in business terms. Don't take this the wrong way, but in business terms it really doesn't matter if she's a bad person who's leaving you to starve. When you do communicate with mum it will be to make a business arrangement. Acknowledge the fact that she is in arrears, and that you are taking legal advice on the best way to recover the money. If that results in a court judgement, then her credit rating may be affected for the future, and could potentially be enforced by a debt recovery agency (the latter probably isn't worthwhile, but it may focus her mind a little.) Subject to contract/legal advice, you may/will be withdrawing care. She might also be required to pay you, even for the period in which you withdraw care until the end of the notice period. But you'll have to check all of this with your legal team. You should also be applying late payment fees to all invoices, subject to what's in your contract. Ask her when she proposes to pay you, or if she has any sort of payment plan in mind. You'd welcome her reply in writing, by return.

I would spend today checking your contract and policies to be sure you know what are your responsibilities, mum's responsibilities, and your options in this case. I have a simple "no payment - no care - no exceptions" clause which all my clients understand. In effect, I never get into arrears because all parents are fully aware that I will turn them away at the doorstep first. I think the new NCMA contracts back this up, but you'll need to check. If you've let them get into arrears before, this can be tricky as mum may be able to claim the right to do it again by 'custom and practice'. This is something you need to ask about from the legal team of your insurer/professional body.

IMO it would be best to withdraw care asap so long as it is right to do so. Note this is my opinion and not necessarily my advice. You should only take such advice from proper legal representation, based on a full understanding of the contract, policies, and full details of the matter in hand.

I would also write down a transcript of all text messages and phone conversations so they are not lost, forgotten or deleted. It may also become useful to send to mum (by email or letter) a copy of the text messages she has sent, saying "I have received and put on record the following communication received from you on [date]"

I'm hoping you are a member of NCMA and covered by their or MM's insurance. Right? In which case, the next important step is to call their legal people on Monday morning. Tell them everything you told us and any other details; tell them what you've done to date; and follow their advice.

To be frank, even if you have a solid case, behave reasonably and win a small claims court ruling, it is not always possible to recover all/any of what's owed. That's a good reason for minimising your potential losses by withdrawing care but, as already stated, you need legal advice to ensure that you're acting within your rights. If you get it wrong, mum might be able to prove that you are in breach of the contract and the whole thing may backfire.

If nothing else, then comfort yourself that this is a learning curve which many CMs experience. It's the big wake-up call to tighten up those contracts and payment policies. Clients can only get into arrears if we let them.

melco
04-11-2012, 09:52 AM
Sorry Melco. Only just checked in again after 2 days and seen you got no other replies. Btw, if this happens it can be worth re-posting on a new thread: once a thread falls off the 'New Posts' screen it won't be viewed by many.

First, I wouldn't panic if you can't do much more until Monday (which is a bit hypocritical of me, as I'm a natural worrier who'd rather be doing something than nothing.)

I reiterate that it's vitally important to have all your facts straight and to hand, ready for any communications you need to have with mum. Hard as it is, you need to be polite, courteous, and professional at all times. Emotive language and feelings will not help. You are essentially trying to resolve a business issue, based on a contractual agreement. You'll only do that in business terms. Don't take this the wrong way, but in business terms it really doesn't matter if she's a bad person who's leaving you to starve. When you do communicate with mum it will be to make a business arrangement. Acknowledge the fact that she is in arrears, and that you are taking legal advice on the best way to recover the money. If that results in a court judgement, then her credit rating may be affected for the future, and could potentially be enforced by a debt recovery agency (the latter probably isn't worthwhile, but it may focus her mind a little.) Subject to contract/legal advice, you may/will be withdrawing care. She might also be required to pay you, even for the period in which you withdraw care until the end of the notice period. But you'll have to check all of this with your legal team. You should also be applying late payment fees to all invoices, subject to what's in your contract. Ask her when she proposes to pay you, or if she has any sort of payment plan in mind. You'd welcome her reply in writing, by return.

I would spend today checking your contract and policies to be sure you know what are your responsibilities, mum's responsibilities, and your options in this case. I have a simple "no payment - no care - no exceptions" clause which all my clients understand. In effect, I never get into arrears because all parents are fully aware that I will turn them away at the doorstep first. I think the new NCMA contracts back this up, but you'll need to check. If you've let them get into arrears before, this can be tricky as mum may be able to claim the right to do it again by 'custom and practice'. This is something you need to ask about from the legal team of your insurer/professional body.

IMO it would be best to withdraw care asap so long as it is right to do so. Note this is my opinion and not necessarily my advice. You should only take such advice from proper legal representation, based on a full understanding of the contract, policies, and full details of the matter in hand.

I would also write down a transcript of all text messages and phone conversations so they are not lost, forgotten or deleted. It may also become useful to send to mum (by email or letter) a copy of the text messages she has sent, saying "I have received and put on record the following communication received from you on [date]"

I'm hoping you are a member of NCMA and covered by their or MM's insurance. Right? In which case, the next important step is to call their legal people on Monday morning. Tell them everything you told us and any other details; tell them what you've done to date; and follow their advice.

To be frank, even if you have a solid case, behave reasonably and win a small claims court ruling, it is not always possible to recover all/any of what's owed. That's a good reason for minimising your potential losses by withdrawing care but, as already stated, you need legal advice to ensure that you're acting within your rights. If you get it wrong, mum might be able to prove that you are in breach of the contract and the whole thing may backfire.

If nothing else, then comfort yourself that this is a learning curve which many CMs experience. It's the big wake-up call to tighten up those contracts and payment policies. Clients can only get into arrears if we let them.

Thank you so much for your reply. Since this message however this have changed. See post called "Can this get any worse!!!" she has now paid (apparently) as still not showing on website but will not be able to confirm until Monday but she is not willing to pay for 2 sick days.

bunyip
04-11-2012, 10:08 AM
Thanks Melco, got that.

I just uploaded the HPA guidance pdf on your other thread.

I'm just a little relieved to read that it's the same client. Was beginning to think you'd got 2 PITA mums: at least it's just the one. :p